[mermaid]

It's the beginning of the end, the "western" world has lost grip on the Palestinians by this election. The Fatah was very heavy supported by the US and so it was a unstable political party and that was just what Israel needed to continue their strategy.
Now the Hamas can decide where to get their support from, and probable from other Arab Islamic countries to bundle their strength and wipe Israel from the map.
It has all been predicted before that Israel would come under attack.

This situation is a startsignal for a very unstable and unsecure future.
I hope the Palestinians will come to their senses and keep trying the peaceful way, or maybe it will start a worldwar 3: Arab world against the Western world.

[Luckystars]

edit

[crapattack]

I've been thinking that if you're the US and need to continually prop up your industrial military complex, having enemys is not a terrible thing. In fact, the continuation of conflict in Israel justifies the Israeli/US base there. Handy.

[bbadwolf]

@Erl:

A few years past peak, the Israelis won't have nukes anymore. The US will and so will some big countries but small places like Israel are gonna get their economies trashed. And nukes don't just sit there, they require plenty of maintenance and lotsa fuel to deliver them. Like another poster said, it will be down to bullet against bullet and there are lots more Arabs than Jews. It'll come down to numbers and the Jews are far far behind. Another said it was crazy to drop a country into hostile territory like that and I couldn't agree more. The Jews have nothing but enemies on their borders and well beyond, the whole region despises them.

And even if it starts coming to pass while the Jews still have nuclear capacity, they would win some serious battles indeed, but they just can't kill them all. Like I said, the entire region despises them. Not to mention that nuking the Arabs, even if you get them all, trashes 2/3 of the world's oil supply. As a result, I suspect that the rest of the world is going to start seriously pushing Israel to make peace. There simply isn't any other solution that doesn't involve disaster for the entire world. If it comes down to letting Israel get exterminated or destroy most of the world, I rather suspect that Israel would get sort of ignored sort of like the Tutsi's of Rwanda got ignored. People will shake their heads and proclaim it a disaster (and it will be) but they'll put their own safety first.

As I said earlier, it would be a great time for the Jews to get the hell out of there. The ones that stay are going to die.

Damn this is a mess isn't it?? In truth, the existance of Israel is now one of the greatest threats pushing us towards a hard landing. If not for that one little pisspot of land, the West would stand a chance of placating the Arabs and keeping the status quo for a while longer and perhaps manage a softer landing, sort of like what the Chinese are doing. If we could slow this process down a bit...it wouldn't solve the long term problem of course but we'd have a better chance of adapting. If WW3 breaks out in the Middle East, the catastrophe will be worldwide!

-bbad

[thor]

Have a look at the Hamas charter, for example:

Article Eight: The Slogan of the Hamas
Allah is its goal, the Prophet its model, the Qur’an its Constitution, Jihad its path and death for the case of Allah its most sublime belief.

Article Fifteen: The Jihad for the Liberation of Palestine is an Individual Obligation
When our enemies usurp some Islamic lands, Jihad becomes a duty binding on all Muslims. In order to face the usurpation of Palestine by the Jews, we have no escape from raising the banner of Jihad. This would require the propagation of Islamic consciousness among the masses on all local, Arab and Islamic levels. We must spread the spirit of Jihad among the [Islamic] Umma, clash with the enemies and join the ranks of the Jihad fighters. The ‘ulama as well as educators and teachers, publicity and media men as well as the masses of the educated, and especially the youth and the elders of the Islamic Movements, must participate in this raising of consciousness. There is no escape from introducing fundamental changes in educational curricula in order to cleanse them from all vestiges of the ideological invasion which has been brought about by orientalists and missionaries. That invasion had begun overtaking this area following the defeat of the Crusader armies by Salah a-Din el Ayyubi. The Crusaders had understood that they had no way to vanquish the Muslims unless they prepared the grounds for that with an ideological invasion which would confuse the thinking of Muslims, revile their heritage, discredit their ideals, to be followed by a military invasion. That was to be in preparation for the Imperialist invasion, as in fact [General] Allenby acknowledged it upon his entry to Jerusalem: “Now, the Crusades are over.” General Gouraud stood on the tomb of Salah a-Din and declared: “We have returned, O Salah-a-Din!” Imperialism has been instrumental in boosting the ideological invasion and deepening its roots, and it is still pursuing this goal. All this had paved the way to the loss of Palestine. We must imprint on the minds of generations of Muslims that the Palestinian problem is a religious one, to be dealt with on this premise. It includes Islamic holy sites such as the Aqsa Mosque, which is inexorably linked to the Holy Mosque as long as the Heaven and earth will exist, to the journey of the Messenger of Allah, be Allah’s peace and blessing upon him, to it, and to his ascension from it. “Dwelling one day in the Path of Allah is better than the entire world and everything that exists in it. The place of the whip of one among you in Paradise is better than the entire world and everything that exists in it. [God’s] worshiper’s going and coming in the Path of Allah is better than the entire world and everything that exists in it.” (Told by Bukhari, Muslim Tirmidhi and Ibn Maja) I swear by that who holds in His Hands the Soul of Muhammad! I indeed wish to go to war for the sake of Allah! I will assault and kill, assault and kill, assault and kill (told by Bukhari and Muslim).

Article Twenty-Eight
The Zionist invasion is a mischievous one. It does not hesitate to take any road, or to pursue all despicable and repulsive means to fulfill its desires. It relies to a great extent, for its meddling and spying activities, on the clandestine organizations which it has established, such as the Freemasons, Rotary Clubs, Lions, and other spying associations. All those secret organizations, some which are overt, act for the interests of Zionism and under its directions, strive to demolish societies, to destroy values, to wreck answerableness, to totter virtues and to wipe out Islam. It stands behind the diffusion of drugs and toxics of all kinds in order to facilitate its control and expansion. The Arab states surrounding Israel are required to open their borders to the Jihad fighters, the sons of the Arab and Islamic peoples, to enable them to play their role and to join their efforts to those of their brothers among the Muslim Brothers in Palestine. The other Arab and Islamic states are required, at the very least, to facilitate the movement of the Jihad fighters from and to them. We cannot fail to remind every Muslim that when the Jews occupied Holy Jerusalem in 1967 and stood at the doorstep of the Blessed Aqsa Mosque, they shouted with joy: “Muhammad is dead, he left daughters behind.” Israel, by virtue of its being Jewish and of having a Jewish population, defies Islam and the Muslims. “Let the eyes of the cowards not fall asleep.”

source:
http://www.palestinecenter.org/cpap/doc ... arter.html

[Leanan]

The British Empire really made a mess when it folded. Three of our biggest headaches are due to the way they drew the lines as they pulled out. Israel vs. the Palestinians, India vs. Pakistan, and Iraq.

I wonder if the U.S. empire will leave similar messes in its wake as it collapses...

[KevO]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('erl', 'I')'m not sure how this is a "defeat" for Bush or the U.S. It seems to me to be a defeat for the Palestinians and their desire for an autonomous state.

Their cause may have just taken a big step backward. Either way, we should know shortly.

[KevO]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Leanan', '
')I wonder if the U.S. empire will leave similar messes in its wake as it collapses...

[mermaid]

I don't think Israel vs. Palestinia has anything to do with oil. But i was thinking that even IF The Israeli's would leave their country and settle somewhere else, will the Pals be satisfied?

the Pals do need the Israeli's for jobs and other social things. It would be very stupid to wipe the Israeli's from the map.

[erl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('0mar', 'W')ho's brilliant idea was it to setup a country that is surrounded by hostile forces?

[erl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bbadwolf', ' ') The Jews have nothing but enemies on their borders and well beyond, the whole region despises them.

[thor]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('erl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('0mar', 'W')ho's brilliant idea was it to setup a country that is surrounded by hostile forces?

[Leanan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hey held out from the Roman assault for quite a time, but in the end the Romans managed to build a ramp, break down the gates and stormed the fort. All they found were dead Jews. They had all committed suicide.

[kam30en]

Omar, you're probably right, but the jews still have the nuclear subs, so when Israel is fucked, so is Mecca. Bye bye, Mecca, Medina, Tehran, Damascus, Cairo, just to name a few. I'm sure they'll have just enough oil left to power those subs. It's called MAD (Mutual Assured Destruction) for a reason.

http://www.thebulletin.org/article_nn.p ... so02norris

[If_oil_grew_like_bamboo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '.')..the West would stand a chance of placating the Arabs and keeping the status quo for a while longer and perhaps manage a softer landing...

[Magus]

Article from MSM

"Fiery Start for Hamas Leadership"

Well, this doesn't look like a situation that will end well.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
MSNBC staff and news service reports
Updated: 9:03 a.m. ET Feb. 18, 2006
RAMALLAH, West Bank - Hamas began its majority rule in the Palestinian parliament on Saturday and quickly rejected President Mahmoud Abbas’ call to negotiate with the Israelis and respect existing peace agreements.

Abbas spoke at the opening session of the new Hamas-dominated Palestinian parliament, after the new legislators were sworn in. Hamas controls 74 of 132 seats, but Abbas has considerable powers as Palestinian Authority president.

He said the Hamas victory in last month’s parliament election — and the defeat of his Fatah Party — have led to a new political reality. “Therefore, it (Hamas) will be asked to form the new government,” Abbas said. “On my part, you will find all the cooperation and encouragement you need, because our national interest is our first and final goal, and is above any individual faction.”

[erl]

This should surprise no one.

[dooberheim]

When the primary Israeli tool of diplomacy is the bulldozer, and the primary tool of Hamas' diplomacy is the suicide bomber, I can't imagine this would have a happy ending either.

DK

[Zardoz]

I believe this is called "taking responsibility for your problems":

Hamas figure slams Gaza 'anarchy'

What a concept!

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')e said life in Gaza City now involved "unimaginable chaos, careless policemen, young men carrying guns and strutting with pride, and families receiving condolences for their dead in the middle of the street."

And he was also critical of militants who fire crudely-made rockets into Israel, saying ordinary Palestinians paid a high price when Israel responded militarily to such attacks.

[Eli]

This the funniest and most sad and pathetic thing I have read all day.

LInk