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THE PETA Thread (merged)

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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby PhilBiker » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:12:22

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gnm', 'F')actory farming is bad for the animal AND bad for whomever eats the crummy meat toxin filled meat. Buying from small local and or organic/free range farms is a good solution.
How about petrochemical dependant factory farming of grain, corn, soy, canola, etc.?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby PhilBiker » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:13:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', 'T')he difference is the suffering for chickens and pigs and cows in factory farms is not only 20 minutes, it is their entire life. Animals born into a life on a factory never do anything that is natural to them. They never run in the sun, they never dig in soft dirt...in fact mother pigs sometimes never even get to stand up their whole lives!
But these animals have been bred and domesticated for so long who's to say what is "natural to them"?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:21:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', '
')
We've all seen the carnage on Discovery channel and other places when other carnivores take down their prey. It ain't pretty. But it's life. We do it. It ain't pretty. It's life. Nature and life are savage some time. The native peoples of North America have a great attitude about it, they thank the animal for giving it's life for them, for supplying them with leather and other useful products.


No, it is not the savage part that I find offensive, I can understand that...and more to that, nature has implemented a mechanism in all living creatures that allows the spirit to detatch from the body at the moment of death so as not to feel the bite of death.

It is the disregard for the life of the animal while it is alive.

Look at this picture...is this savage or is it just plain greedy and cruel? These are momma pigs in gestation crates. They are impregnated over and over again and they never even get to stand up in their lives, let alone get to bask in the joy of their babies...this is how they live until they are no longer furtile and then they are killed.

It is not savage, it is a brand of cruelity that only a human is capable of inflicting. This is factory farming at it's worst. Eat meat, but pay a fair price for it.

Image


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', 'P')ictures like that are why my dog is a rescue mutt and my next dog will be and the one after that as well.


I sincerely respect that.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:25:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', 'B')ut these animals have been bred and domesticated for so long who's to say what is "natural to them"?


oh come on, you think these baby chicks don't "know" something ain't right?

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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:25:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', 'B')ut these animals have been bred and domesticated for so long who's to say what is "natural to them"?


oh come on, you think these chicken don't "know" something ain't right?

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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:25:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '
')That...we are the only cause of animal sufferage on this world. Please! Do you think the chicken reacts any differently by being chased through the underbruch by a fox for 20 minutes prior to having its neck squeezed shut over the course of several minutes than it would by having its beak cauterized? I doubt it. Perhaps PETA should go to Africa and through some fake blood on the Lions? Eating is a dirty business...those that eat meat should be thankful that there are people out there that are willing to do the dirty work to provide us with squeeky-clean, plastic wrapped, tidy roasts for our youngins.


The difference is the suffering for chickens and pigs and cows in factory farms is not only 20 minutes, it is their entire life. Animals born into a life on a factory never do anything that is natural to them. They never run in the sun, they never dig in soft dirt...in fact mother pigs sometimes never even get to stand up their whole lives!

And...? What's your point? This again is projection. I you were born into a...let's say 'Matrix' sytle environment, would you know that you were suffering, or would it be: "yum yum yum I've got chow...round the clock...chow...chow...chow." How do you know these animals sit in their cages and pine for the romping, thowing daisies into the air life? I'll answer, you don't. But you are projecting your human perspective onto them and saying 'this is what they think'. Shame shame shame...we do the same thing to other humans....e.g., Iraq, Iran, Afganastan, et al.

Eating is dirty business, but the fact that there are those willing to do the dirty work for everyone else is not a good thing, it is a bad thing. It leads to enormous waste on the part of the consumer, which is why there is a need for these huge factory farms that are cruel and inhumane. People want cheap food, but there is a price for cheap food. And anything that is cheap has no value in the minds of most people. In my mind, food, especially animal protein, should never be cheap. Everyone, and I mean everyone, if they choose to eat meat, should have to at least once in their lives have to butcher an animal.

I only buy from the local meat market that buys from local wisconsin farmers...it is more expensive, but to me the benefits are many, just knowing that the animals lived a normal life is one.

still dont get the point...are these so called 'local farmers', some sort of saint that only KILL with the utmost care and concern? Or, are they just the same as factory farmers with more room? Do they cry before they gut the cow? Say a paryer? Inject drugs which make the whole thing beautiful for the animal? Sorry I don't get your point.

I urge everyone to go to the PETA website and force yourselves to look at some of the pictures...it is very hard to do, I know, I do it about once a month. I do not slaughter my own food, but the least I can do is look and see the suffering and at the very minimum acknowledge that eating meat is not my right it is a privilege.


Um sure...who administers this 'privilege"? But I do agree. Go to PETA: vomit; wring your hands, hell flog yourself for being human...Kill youself if you must...but shut up. The rest of us (those who understand nature) and accept that humans are and intrinsic part, not separate from it, should do what the Native American's do...respect the sources of our lives, but not deny it.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:31:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he difference is the suffering for chickens and pigs and cows in factory farms


What suffering? How is it that you know what suffering is to another species?
Are you psychic? Budahha? Recarniated form a fram animal? Again, projection. Do these animals stop eating/drinking? Maybe that is (in the animal mind), all there is to life; food and water. Everything else is just...just
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:32:27

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he difference is the suffering for chickens and pigs and cows in factory farms


What suffering? How is it that you know what suffering is to another species?
Are you psychic? Budahha? Recarniated form a fram animal? Again, projection. Do these animals stop eating/drinking? Maybe that is (in the animal mind), all there is to life; food and water. Everything else is just...just


I see, so broken bones, burns caused by lying continually in their own urine, beatings, cramped wire cages...only a human would suffer in such conditions.

Animals are unable to feel these things...is this what you are saying?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:38:30

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he difference is the suffering for chickens and pigs and cows in factory farms


What suffering? How is it that you know what suffering is to another species?
Are you psychic? Budahha? Recarniated form a fram animal? Again, projection. Do these animals stop eating/drinking? Maybe that is (in the animal mind), all there is to life; food and water. Everything else is just...just


I see, so broken bones, burns caused by lying continually in their own urine, beatings, cramped wire cages...only a human would suffer in such conditions.

Animals are unable to feel these things...is this what you are saying?


Pfft...you don't get it. Have you ever seen the defensive rites of the Hippo?

His tail is specifically designed (evolved), to spread its urin and feces all over the place as a scent signal to an advasiary...'back off'. Again this is just projection...what do you know about the animal world and its...shall I say "feeling", with regard to urin and feces. Hell pigs are shit eaters (naturally), hence the unclean status Jews afford them. So are shellfish wich eat shit from other aquatic animals. I've personaly witnessed cows licking the ass of other cows while urinating. I think this argument is barking up the wrong tree...

You are telling me what other animals/species feel. But you are unwilling to tell me how you know what they feel with imperical evidence. Side note: imagine all those plants force to reproduce in those fields bathed in cow feces (manure), for months on end through the summer...savage!
Last edited by Petro on Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:44:11, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:42:49

Petro, do you have a pet?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:45:49

you bet I do...two: adopted from the pound, and an Green Wind Macaw purchased from a domestic breeder...your point?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby PhilBiker » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:47:30

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', 'o')h come on, you think these baby chicks don't "know" something ain't right?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'o')h come on, you think these chicken don't "know" something ain't right?
I don't purport to have any comprehension of what they think. I do know they've been bred to be domestic foodstock for thousands of years, maybe longer.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:50:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', 'o')h come on, you think these baby chicks don't "know" something ain't right?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'o')h come on, you think these chicken don't "know" something ain't right?
I don't purport to have any comprehension of what they think. I do know they've been bred to be domestic foodstock for thousands of years, maybe longer.


What you are not acknowledging is that they have been food-stock, one way or another since the beginning of time.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:51:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', 'y')ou bet I do...two: adopted from the pound, and an Green Wind Macaw purchased from a domestic breeder...your point?


oh perfect. Ok, take the bird and keep it in its cage covered without food or water for about 14 days. This is what they do to chickens to force them to molt when egg production declines so they can get a few more months of production out of her. Now, do this to your bird and for good measure, scream, play really loud music and rattle your bird's cage violently several times a day.

Then listen to your bird, watch your bird...try to pet your bird while doing this.

Then tell me if you think your bird is feeling that something is wrong. And then, once you go back to your regular program, see if the bird forgets and goes back to being your same old pet.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:51:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', 'o')h come on, you think these baby chicks don't "know" something ain't right?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'o')h come on, you think these chicken don't "know" something ain't right?
I don't purport to have any comprehension of what they think. I do know they've been bred to be domestic foodstock for thousands of years, maybe longer.


What you are not acknowledging is that they have been food-stock, one way or another since the beginning of time.


So because we have deemed them food stock, they are not animals anymore, worthy of respect in their lives and in their deaths...they are somehow less valuable than say your rescue dog?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:55:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', 'y')ou bet I do...two: adopted from the pound, and an Green Wind Macaw purchased from a domestic breeder...your point?


oh perfect. Ok, take the bird and keep it in its cage covered without food or water for about 14 days. This is what they do to chickens to force them to molt when egg production declines so they can get a few more months of production out of her. Now, do this to your bird and for good measure, scream, play really loud music and rattle your bird's cage violently several times a day.

Then listen to your bird, watch your bird...try to pet your bird while doing this.

Then tell me if you think your bird is feeling that something is wrong. And then, once you go back to your regular program, see if the bird forgets and goes back to being your same old pet.


What the hell are you talking about? When a bird molts protien resources go into feather reproduction...NOT eggs...inducing a bird to molt (by the way is there really such a thing?), will reduce both sexual interest but also reproduction...Where are you getting your information?

PS - what you suggest is abuse for the type of bird that I own...a green wing macaw is not a chicken and has developed along a different evolutionary track. Please dont try to mix apples and oranges in this dicussion.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:57:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PhilBiker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SinisterBlueCat', 'o')h come on, you think these baby chicks don't "know" something ain't right?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'o')h come on, you think these chicken don't "know" something ain't right?
I don't purport to have any comprehension of what they think. I do know they've been bred to be domestic foodstock for thousands of years, maybe longer.


What you are not acknowledging is that they have been food-stock, one way or another since the beginning of time.


So because we have deemed them food stock, they are not animals anymore, worthy of respect in their lives and in their deaths...they are somehow less valuable than say your rescue dog?

Again more projection...anthropomorphic bruhaha...does the lion consider its food? Worry about leaving one of the herd motherless? Can the lion afford this type of 'human' reasoning? No. It can't. It would cease to live on this planet. Funny how you (human), think that you can. Without price...without greif...without cost.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 11:59:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '
')
What the hell are you talking about? When a bird molts protien resources go into feather reproduction...NOT eggs...inducing a bird to molt (by the way is there really such a thing?), will reduce both sexual interest but also reproduction...Where are you getting your information?


google chickens forced to molt

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '
')PS - what you suggest is abuse for the type of bird that I own...a green wing macaw is not a chicken and has developed along a different evolutionary track. Please dont try to mix apples and oranges in this dicussion.


so you are not willing to test to see if your bird can feel?
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby SinisterBlueCat » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 12:03:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Petro', '
')
Again more projection...anthropomorphic bruhaha...does the lion consider its food? Worry about leaving one of the herd motherless? Can the lion afford this type of 'human' reasoning? No. It can't. It would cease to live on this planet. Funny how you (human), think that you can. Without price...without greif...without cost.


I will say this once again. it is not about the death, it is about the conditions of life.

I have to get some work done now, so I thank you for the conversation. I will leave with this. If I am wrong and animals are like you say, then it is no harm, no foul...but if you are wrong it is a whole different story.
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Re: Just saw a PETA video

Unread postby Petro » Fri 13 Jan 2006, 12:04:05

Oh please! The bird that I own and I are bonded beyond what is considered reasonable. When I leave the room he whistles, says everything in his
verbal inventory. Squawks, etc., I prean his feathers and he (to my discomfort), preans me. It's a case of mamal vs. avion species, yet we are both depedant on each other. We are bonded...there isnt any other description that will suffice...it is no differece than the bond between me and my dogs...just a species difference
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