[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I') just stumbled on this which may be interesting to some of you. It goes through the arguements for the HIV-AIDS connection in some detail:link

[dukey]

Graphic (large)


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')eadly toxic chemical hazard warning by Sigma Chemical Co. on tiny 25mg bottles of AZT supplied to research laboratories. You obviously don’t find this advice on GlaxoSmithKline's AZT label, or in its package insert recommending a daily dose of up to sixty times as much. Or let’s face it: who would swallow it?

[Newsseeker]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newsseeker', 'U')mm... homosexuality? Not prevalent in Africa but definitely in the West.

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newsseeker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newsseeker', 'U')mm... homosexuality? Not prevalent in Africa but definitely in the West.

[smallpoxgirl]

There are a number of problems with the AZT causes AIDS theory.

If that were true:
1. AIDS shouldn't predate the use of AZT, which it doesn't.
2. There should be a high degree of correlation between who takes AZT and who gets AIDS. There isn't.
3. Starting AZT should make AIDS worse. It doesn't. AZT can suppress the bone marrow. When that happens, what you get is something called pancytopenia. All of the blood cell lines are suppressed. The red cells are suppressed, so you get anemia. All of the white blood cell lines are suppressed. The immune system dysfunction in AIDS is a very unusual and specific type of immune system dysfunction. Only the helper T cells are affected. The macrophages, the B cells, the cytotoxic T cells, the Natural Killer cells, basophils, eosinophils, monocytes....they're all fine. No one has ever shown AZT causing that kind of a specific cell line suppression.
4. Starting AZT shouldn't make AIDS better. In fact it does. When patients are started on AZT, their helper T cell counts go up not down.

AZT is certainly a very toxic substance. Many medicines are. Warfarin was originally developed as a rat poison. Now we give it to patients as a blood thinner. Nitrogen mustard chemotherapeutics are derived from mustard gas.

[dukey]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he macrophages, the B cells, the cytotoxic T cells, the Natural Killer cells, basophils, eosinophils, monocytes....they're all fine. No one has ever shown AZT causing that kind of a specific cell line suppression.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dukey', 'A')ZT destroys everything. It makes no distiction. It also crosses the blood brain barrier.

[dukey]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')ZT is a cytotoxic chemical, a "DNA chain terminator." It interferes with DNA replication, by substituting itself for thymine, one of the base components in the DNA chain. This, theoretically, interferes with the reproduction of HIV. But it also interferes with the reproduction of the T-cell, the basis of the immune system, and the T-cell dies. The doctors who tested AZT for its effectiveness against HIV claimed they found that AZT was one thousand times as toxic to HIV reproduction as it was to the T-cells that were involved in that reproduction.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dukey', 'g')et it ?..

[Kingcoal]

Neither Smallpoxgirl or EnergyUnlimited has watched the video obviously, yet they have gone off on some strange tangent. Maybe I missed something (I sat through the whole thing), but where did they say that "there is no HIV, nobody's ever seen it"? The video explains that HIV or HLTV retrovirus is probably common and harmless, shows pictures of it and tells you how you probably inherited it from your mother.

Both SPG and EU have gone on and on with inflammatory comments about the intelligence of someone WHO WOULD EVEN BOTHER TO WATCH THIS VIDEO. EU said something like "watching something that is stupid is stupid" or something to that effect.

Well I watched the video, the whole thing. Do you know why I watched the whole thing SPG/EU? Because that’s what I do, I like to hear opinions, even seemingly wacky ones. I learned a long time ago that the path to intelligence is listening and understanding. I’ve seen people with decades of education and little experience go off on tangents costing thousands, even millions of dollars irrationally defending their original ideas in vain. Scientists are people too; they are petty, covetous and vain, just like everyone else. They become possessed with being right, that’s why the scientific method includes this thing called peer review.

I didn't see and conspiracy theory in this video. I just saw a viewpoint being presented and a case being made. The point was simple; AIDS probably isn't caused by HIV. They presented evidence to that effect and presented a theory that AIDS might have something to do with recreational drug use. They did imply that the medical community was not following standard scientific procedures when it came to AIDS, such as peer review before press conference.

We have been told that HIV causes AIDS and more research was needed. What this video is trying to say is the same thing - minus the claim that HIV causes AIDS, as the authors don’t think that claim has been sufficiently proven yet. They attempt to demonstrate that there is not a very strong case for that assertion and that we need more open, unbiased research. They put forth a hypothesis that drug abuse may actually cause the disease, however, they don't claim to have proven anything.

So what is wrong with having a dissenting opinion, backing it up with evidence and pissing people off? Has the current 25 year search for a cure been that successful? The video describes how scurvy and other conditions were once thought to be caused by a pathogen and how those scientists fought tooth and nail – in vain, to discredit the theory that scurvy might be a nutritional deficiency. Why can’t we have some open thinking on the AIDS front?

[dukey]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hy can’t we have some open thinking on the AIDS front?

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', ' ')Why can’t we have some open thinking on the AIDS front?

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'N')either Smallpoxgirl or EnergyUnlimited has watched the video obviously, yet they have gone off on some strange tangent.

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I')f Duesberg wanted to settle this here and now, it'd be pretty easy. If he really believes HIV is harmless, he should inoculate himself with it and show the world.

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I')f you are going to tell people, that "You know what, don't worry about that condom, just don't take AZT and you'll be fine", you'd better damned well be right and be sure you're right because if you're wrong, people are going to die.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', 'a')ccuse everyone who even dare to ask questions of the most horrific things

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', ' ')Duesberg may not being saying "go have unprotected sex", but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that is what's going to happen if you tell gay men "AIDS isn't contagious". Duesberg is the patron saint of all the HIV negative males that are in relationships with HIV positive partners. There are people right now killing themselves because they've believed what he says. This in not theoretical. I've met these people.

No way is he that clueless about the public health implications of what he says. He knows darned well he's killing people.

[NEOPO]

Thank you Sir! I am not worthy...
No I do not believe many actually click the links and/or watch the videos initially nor subsequentally.
A distinction should be drawn between gazing in relative disdain through goggles of preconceived notions and seeing with an open mind.

Mr Russell a potential Enigma for the initiate.
Alot of wool yet I taut I taw a pooty tat!
I did !! I did!! I did taw a pooty tat !!

I regretfully believe that this may be where "it" occurred : The Royal Society
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')n the words of no one

[PrairieMule]

A man walks through a park and sees 2 drug addicts sharing a dirty needle.

"Hey you better stop that our you'll end up with AIDS!"

"Don't worry Mister," replies the first junkie, "we are both wearing condoms."

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', 'W')ould it be possible for you to share my curiosity?