[Carlhole]

The American Constitution and Bill of Rights have been battered and kicked around since 911.

The country's broke and has no credit.

We're fighting two overseas wars.

We're talking about the end of Capitalism.

People want to reject Science, Technology and innovation as means to solve problems facing us.

Optimism is considered naive.

What is left of America?

Lip service?

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'W')ell, thank you for that vapid, non-response. Obviously, you don't have any good ideas to expound upon... so you might as well just go on some blind, irrational attack.

[mrsea]

It is interesting to watch you all turn on one another and accuse each other of a lack of patriotism. It reminds me of pigs at the trough when the word is passed that rations will be reduced. Those of you who often come here and read this forum surely subscribe, in some degree, to the theory of Peak Oil, overpopulation and economic collapse. Now, as the collapse draws nearer, is certainly not when we should be losing our heads.

Placing blame at this juncture in time is counterproductive. It matters not what brought us to this point but rather what direction we take from here. While I don’t believe we should return to the forge I do think that when we find ourselves on the wrong path, rather than strike out in a new direction, it is sometimes wiser to retrace our steps to a place of familiarity and regroup before heading out again.

One thing that I find bewildering with all that is going on is, where is the youth of our nation? Why are they silent? Regardless of what country we speak of, history has shown us that it is the young people who are the vanguard of change. I recall what it was like being a young adult in the 60’s. The people back then rose up and took their dissatisfactions to the streets. Why don’t we see any of that today? Is everyone in America happy and satisfied?

Maybe, subconsciously, we know that our ability to take it to the streets is no longer an option. There was no Department of Homeland Security in the 60s. One thing is for sure, if the populace does openly revolt, we will finally find out what those FEMA camps are really for.

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mrsea', 'O')ne thing that I find bewildering with all that is going on is, where is the youth of our nation? Why are they silent? Regardless of what country we speak of, history has shown us that it is the young people who are the vanguard of change. I recall what it was like being a young adult in the 60’s. The people back then rose up and took their dissatisfactions to the streets. Why don’t we see any of that today? Is everyone in America happy and satisfied?

[Carlhole]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AgentR', '.')..you're the one who is asserting if some measure of doom goes splat on the US/world and we lose ground on the technological front, that America is dead and innovation is dead.

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'D')oomers don't believe in America. And if you say you are not a Doomer, then you don't have to defend yourself against my accusation.

[Carlhole]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mrsea', 'I')t is interesting to watch you all turn on one another and accuse each other of a lack of patriotism.

[Carlhole]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AgentR', 'T')he world will be crushed by the results of its gluttony. Darkness will rule for many years. However, Americans will remain, Americans; and they will fight. They will struggle, and grasp, and claw, and think, until there is once again, light. Even if ever so dim.

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'W')hatever re-emerged "after many years of darkness" would be an entirely different culture.

[ProudFossil]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', 'N')onsense, Carlhole. I'm a doomer but I believe in America---the dream of America as embodied in the Constitution. Just as I'd still believe in life if I had a fatal disease.

[ProudFossil]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'T')he American Constitution and Bill of Rights have been battered and kicked around since 911. The country's broke and has no credit. We're fighting two overseas wars.
We're talking about the end of Capitalism. People want to reject Science, Technology and innovation as means to solve problems facing us.
Optimism is considered naive. What is left of America? Lip service?

[Carlhole]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AgentR', 'M')y position is that innovation will continue to be well established within the American culture whether peakoil has a technological fix or not; you seem to have trouble believing in America if things don't go your way.

[StuckInPhilly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mrsea', 'I')t is interesting to watch you all turn on one another and accuse each other of a lack of patriotism.

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I') don't have any idea what you're talking about when you say "things don't go my way".

[AgentR]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('StuckInPhilly', 'T')his endless drumming of how innovative we are has yet to show itself in reality.

[Starvid]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'S')eems to me that if you are a Doomer, you do not believe in America.

[Carlhole]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AgentR', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I') don't have any idea what you're talking about when you say "things don't go my way".

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mrsea', 'w')here is the youth of our nation? Why are they silent?

[AgentR]

The problem, carhole, is that you are insisting on defining "TypeA is feature X" and then harranging TypeA for being X.

I am a doomer. That does not mean that the future is certain. It does mean that I think I have a notion about how its going to play out. That notion.... is bad.

Now, Monte is of course locked in a degree of absolutism that makes it almost impossible to have a conversation with him about the subject, but that does not mean that ALL DOOMERS are clones of Monte.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ProudFossil', '1')940 - the country was really broke and there was not credit anywhere in the world.
1942 - we were fighting two wars over both oceans with the loss and damage to millions of our soldiers.
1945 - the Communist party was strong and submitting candidates for elective office.
1942 - started the biggest push in science and technology in history.
1940 - remember there was a great depression, unemployment running at 20%, soup lines, etc. The only optimism was going to a movie.