:format(webp)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/58695315/93116806.jpg.0.jpg "America doesn’t win wars anymore")
A month into his presidency, Donald Trump lamented that the US no longer wins wars as it once did.
“When I was young, in high school and college, everybody used to say we never lost a war,” Trump told a group of US governors last February. “Now, we never win a war.”
Dominic Tierney, a professor at Swarthmore College and the author of multiple books about how America wages war, may know the reason why.
He believes the US can still successfully fight the wars of yesteryear — World War-style conflicts — but hasn’t yet mastered how to win wars against insurgents, which are smaller fights against groups within countries. The problem is the US continues to involve itself in those kinds of fights.
“We’re still stuck in this view that war is like the Super Bowl: We meet on the field, both sides have uniforms, we score points, someone wins, and when the game ends you go home,” he told me. “That’s not what war is like now.”
The US military is currently mired in conflicts in countries like Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, and Yemen. It’s hard to see any end in sight — especially an end where the United States is the victor, however that’s defined.
A lightly edited transcript of our conversation follows.
Alex Ward
During his first year in office, Trump got the US more deeply involved in wars, with the goal of defeating terrorists in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, and Somalia. But has this put the US on course to end these fights?
Dominic Tierney
Victory may be asking a lot.
Since 1945, the United States has very rarely achieved meaningful victory. The United States has fought five major wars — Korea, Vietnam, the Gulf War, Iraq, Afghanistan — and only the Gulf War in 1991 can really be classified as a clear success.
There are reasons for that, primarily the shift in the nature of war to civil conflicts, where the United States has struggled. Trump himself recognized this: He said on the campaign trail numerous times that we used to win wars and we don’t win anymore. And he has promised to turn the page on this era of defeat and said that we were going to get sick and tired of winning.
But will he channel that observation into winning wars? I doubt it.
The nature of war continues to be these difficult internal conflicts in places like Afghanistan, where the United States has struggled long before Trump ever dreamed of running for president.
Alex Ward
So what constitutes victory in war today, and has that changed from the past?
Dominic Tierney
The famous war theorist Carl von Clausewitz argued that war is the continuation of politics by other means. So war is not just about blowing things up — it’s about achieving political goals.
The United States, up until 1945, won virtually all the major wars that it fought. The reason is those wars were overwhelmingly wars between countries. The US has always been very good at that.
But that kind of war has become the exception. If you look around the world today, about 90 percent of wars are civil wars. These are complex insurgencies, sometimes involving different rebel groups, where the government faces a crisis of legitimacy.
The US has found, for various reasons, that it’s far more difficult to achieve its goals in these cases. The three longest wars in US history are Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan — all from recent decades, all these complex types of civil wars.
Alex Ward
On its face, this seems to be a paradox: The US can win on the battlefield against a major military force, but we can’t seem to win these smaller wars.
Dominic Tierney
Yes. And even more surprising: It’s when the US became a superpower and created the best-trained, strongest military the world has ever seen, around 1945, that the US stopped winning wars.
The answer to the puzzle is that American power turned out to be a double-edged sword.
The US was so powerful after World War II, especially after the Soviet Union disappeared, that Washington was tempted to intervene in distant conflicts around the world in places like Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan.
We ended up intervening in countries where we had little cultural understanding. To illustrate this, in 2006 — at the height of the Iraq War — there were 1,000 officials in the US embassy in Baghdad, but only six of them spoke Arabic.
In addition, the US military has failed to adapt to this new era of war. The US military has this playbook for success against countries: technology, big-unit warfare, and so on. And when we started fighting insurgents, it was natural that we would turn to that same playbook.
Alex Ward
So we might not have much cultural understanding of the places where we’re fighting, but we have greater technology and better fighting forces. Why can’t we overcome this obstacle?
Dominic Tierney
The reason, again, comes down to the difference between an interstate [more traditional] war and a counterinsurgency, or nation-building mission.
One difference is that we cannot easily see the enemy. In an interstate war, the enemy is wearing uniforms, we know where they are on a map. In a counterinsurgency they are hiding in the population.
Now, the US military is capable of hitting any target with pinpoint accuracy using the latest hardware. But what if we don’t know where the enemy is? A lot of that technology, which is really impressive, turns out to be irrelevant.
Alex Ward
It seems like we have two problems here. We haven’t corrected our way of thinking to deal with insurgencies or civil wars, and then we keep getting involved in those kinds of wars, despite the fact that we’re ill-prepared to deal with them.
Why do we keep falling into this trap?
Dominic Tierney
One answer is we basically believe in illusions — the idea that nation-building and counterinsurgency will be avoided.
Look at Iraq, where the United States believed it could topple Saddam Hussein and basically leave as quickly as possible. We would overthrow the tyrant and then the Iraqi people would be free to create their own democracy. That was based on massive overconfidence about what would happen after Hussein fell.
So why do we go to war if we hate counterinsurgency and we struggle at it? The reason is the White House convinces itself it doesn’t need to stabilize or help rebuild a country after a war. But it’s not just the Bush administration — think of the Obama administration too.
Barack Obama was a very thoughtful president and talked at length about his foreign policy thinking. At the heart of the Obama doctrine was “no more Iraq War.” And yet he basically made the same mistake in Libya, where there was very little planning for what would occur after Muammar Qaddafi was overthrown in 2011. In fact, Obama went on the record saying that the Libya intervention was his worst mistake a president.
Alex Ward
So if it really is a bunch of wishful illusions and incorrect assumptions, how do we avoid that? We have tons of evidence that things don’t go our way when we get involved in these kinds of wars. We don’t seem to learn from our mistakes.
Dominic Tierney
We don’t learn very well from history. Presidents convince themselves that the next time will be different.
The lesson Obama took from Iraq was not to allow any US ground forces to get involved in nation-building. Since Obama was willing to support regime change, the end result was going to be the overthrow of Qaddafi with no real plan to stabilize Libya.
If a thoughtful president like Obama — who was very cognizant of the errors of Iraq — can do that, it suggests that any president would be capable of doing that.
Alex Ward
It seems like one of the problems is that we’re involving ourselves in these wars with little preparation. How do we solve that?
Dominic Tierney
We need better language training, cultural training, more resources for special forces — and that would mean less money spent on nuclear attack submarines, for example.
Second, once we improve America’s ability for stabilization missions, we deploy the US military with greater care and fight fewer wars. That means when we do fight, we have a better plan to win the peace.
Alex Ward
But then there’s another problem: Sometimes groups like ISIS arise, and US leaders and many Americans want the military to take them out. So when the president is faced with the option to target a group like ISIS with airpower, some would argue that it’s better, politically, to do that.
Dominic Tierney
The US doesn’t think several moves ahead. The US military is good at taking out bad guys. But the removal of the bad guy creates a power vacuum, and that power vacuum is filled by somebody else.
In Afghanistan, we created disorder and then the Taliban returned — the power vacuum there was also filled by ISIS. And in Iraq, the vacuum was filled by militant groups, most notably al-Qaeda in Iraq. In Libya, the vacuum was filled by a complicated range of militant groups.
The mood in the US is: “We just killed ISIS, let’s go home and close the book on the ISIS war.” Well, there’s more to the story.
Alex Ward
The Trump administration says it will pay less attention to defeating terrorists and will now focus more on battling back growing Chinese and Russian power.
That new strategic focus means we’ll change the kinds of weapons we buy and the kind of training our troops do. But I don’t see the US stopping its fight against terrorism. Does this preparation for a different style of war — while still fighting another — put the US in an awkward position?
Dominic Tierney
I think it does.
There is a desire to shift from difficult nation-building missions toward countering great-power challengers like Russia and especially China. But this isn’t very new. The Obama administration wanted to pivot to Asia and the China challenge. And then what happened? We ended up being engaged against ISIS.
I tend to think that the pivot to China is sort of like Waiting for Godot — it never arrives. And I think the United States is going to get drawn back into these civil wars and these kinds of messy conflicts, particularly in the broader Middle East. The odds of conflict between the US and China are very low; the odds of the US engaging in another civil war in the next five years are extremely high.
Alex Ward
Based on this conversation, victory in war seems to be how we define it, or, rather, will it to be. The US sets its victory goals low, but we don’t even meet those lower goals. Why can’t we get over this hump?
Dominic Tierney
We’re still stuck in this view that war is like the Super Bowl: We meet on the field, both sides have uniforms, we score points, someone wins, and when the game ends you go home. That’s not what war is like now. Now there are tons of civilians on the field, the enemy team doesn’t wear a uniform, and the game never ends. We need to know there’s no neat ending.
The costs of this problem have been so catastrophic for the United States, in the form of thousands of military lives and billions of dollars spent. It’s time we fundamentally rethink our vision of what war is.
Cloggie on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 8:57 pm
“HAHAH! The great replacement won’t be televised!”
Bloodbaths seldom are.
The liberal order will evaporate in a maelstrom of violence.
If you openly gloat about the disappearing of a people, don’t be surprised about the response.
I think that in the US the train session is going to be skipped.
In contrast to Germans, Americans are armed to the teeth.
#HappinessIsAWarmGun
Duncan Idaho on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 8:58 pm
Welfare Ranching and Mining.
D. Cloud on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 9:01 pm
Controlling the oil and preserving the petro dollar is the bread and butter of the MIC. War is a racket.
Duncan Idaho on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 9:13 pm
GLOBAL WARMING DENIERS ARE EVIL HUMAN GARBAGE
http://www.doomsteaddiner.net/blog/2019/07/25/global-warming-deniers-are-evil-human-garbage-a-blast-from-the-past/
Cloggie on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 9:18 pm
Brexit is going to be a trainwreck:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/06/michael-gove-accuses-eu-of-refusing-to-negotiate-new-deal
“Brexit: Michael Gove accuses ‘wrong and sad’ EU of intransigence”
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/06/nicola-sturgeon-if-we-crash-out-with-no-deal-corbyn-will-be-almost-as-responsible-as-may-or-johnson
“Nicola Sturgeon: ‘If we crash out with no deal, Corbyn will be almost as responsible as May or Johnson’”
No need for another stupid, corrosive 50-50 referendum. Once the economic post-no-deal bloodbath begins, simply withdraw from the UK unilaterally, as an economic emergency measure of government. No deal with London necessary. BoJo will set the good example.
Also, good opportunity for the reunification of Ireland.
“Do or die”, you said?
https://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/brexit-verhandlungen-eu-verliert-glauben-an-einen-deal-a-1280731.html
The EU no longer believes in an orderly Brexit.
Everything is now possible, including armed confrontation. Time to set up an EU army and organize the largest military parade in history, just to make a point.
Expect the anti-Russian sanctions to be swiftly cancelled by the EU, after October 31. The 1945-West is over and something to be pissed upon.
makati1 on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 9:33 pm
JuanP: Here are a few…
https://news.sky.com/story/f-35-jets-chinese-owned-company-making-parts-for-top-secret-uk-us-fighters-11741889
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/how-will-america-replace-844-f-35-parts-turkey-makes-66496
“More than 300,000 individual parts all come together to produce the F-35 Lightning II at Lockheed Martin’s mile+-long factory in Fort Worth, Texas. In addition, final assembly and checkout is performed at facilities in Cameri, Italy and Nagoya, Japan.
The global team also includes more than 1,400 suppliers from domestic and international companies around the world.”
https://www.f35.com/about/life-cycle/production
NOTHING is made in the US anymore except war and debt.
muhamadelpedoal-amerikiakafmr on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 10:49 pm
ok maybe i’m a little bit out of tune but i don’t understand why supertard loves muzzies so much. he ordered banana republic to pull clothing from their site. but this is freedom of expression supertard!
so he said he lets muzzies tend to his goats and they’re good neighbors. but in syria and iraq a lot of naive christians were good neighbors with muzzies and the muzzies were good people. until they all left and came back to behead people and take women for slaves.
JuanP on Tue, 6th Aug 2019 11:11 pm
“JuanP: Here are a few”
Hey thanks for setting me strait makato. I like it when people are honest. Saved to my notes and to be plagerized on my new blog.
(That’s why I don’t comment here so much anymore. I’m concentrating on my new blog. In case y’all were wondering.)
Who am I on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 12:59 am
Who am I?
I’m a trust fund baby who leeches off family trust for money, flies on family jet;
Never worked a single day;
Poses as Ozark deplorable;
Drives pick-up truck replete with mud;
REAL Green DEEP Adaptation (excluding central air conditioning units);
Everything is for keeping up appearances.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 1:01 am
Speaking of new blogs…..
Excluding my ID Theft and Sock Puppetry, I am spending less time on this lame unmoderated forum to concentrate on my own blog.
I do want to thank all those who have attacked me with giving me material for growth. I have saved the best of my comments for my new blog. I have years worth of material. I have enjoyed moderating the worst of you and neutering your selfish useless agendas. I will still be here it is just I will be spending more time putting out a blog. I don’t expect much of a following with my blog. This is more a personal effort to assemble what I have learned over the last 10 years of formulating my REAL Green Deep Adaptation. Many of my ideas and lifestyles are not mine. I do not claim anything either. For the stalkers here I hope you find my blog and visit the comment forum. It will be only lightly moderated to prevent juanpee identity theft and excessive cloggo spamming. LOL. There will be a prize for juanpee and annoymouse if you can stalk my blog. Double LOL. Anyway fuck my enemies and many thanks to those who contributed to my metamorphous.
I guess I could have joined the moderated section at PO dot com, but I knew I’d get my ass permanently banned. I’ll try not to let the door smack me up the backside on the way out.
Goodbye to ALL of you dumbasses.
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 1:24 am
African bishop (86) warns Europe not to exaggerate with third world immigration:
https://catholicherald.co.uk/magazine/you-ask-them-are-you-serious-an-interview-with-cardinal-arinze/
Governments, he says, also have a duty to be realistic. “Each government has to see, for how many people can they provide? Not only their entrance: lodging, work, family, cultural insertion.” (One of the cardinal’s verbal habits is this kind of listing, as though drawing up a table of contents.) Moreover, he says, countries that lose their young people are losing the people who can build that nation’s future. “So the countries in Europe and America can sometimes help best, not by encouraging the young people to come to Europe as if they looked on Europe as heaven – a place where money grows on trees – but to help the countries from which they come.”
New political alliance developing in Britain:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7329245/Labour-gets-bed-SNP-Labour-reveals-WONT-block-second-Scottish-independence-vote.html
Labour and the SNP get into bed: John McDonnell reveals they WON’T block second Scottish independence referendum while Nicola Sturgeon hints she’ll help get Jeremy Corbyn into No10
I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-7329381/PETER-OBORNE-fear-future-Britain-Boris-hands-unelected-Svengali.html
“PETER OBORNE: Why I fear the future of Britain (and Boris Johnson) is now in the hands of unelected Svengali Dominic Cummings”
The British Rasputin Cummings.
Boris Johnson, officially the leader of Vote Leave, was given little more than a walk-on role, portrayed as a slightly bumbling idiot figure who traveled the country to address public meetings according to a script written for him by the much more committed Cummings. Johnson the monkey. Cummings the organ grinder… According to some papers, and many ministers and civil servants I have spoken to recently, this is the man who is truly running Britain.
According to Wikipedia, Cummings is a former nightclub bouncer and failed airline entrepreneur in Russia. Cameron called him a “career psychopath”. He is controversial within the Tory party. He is a true Brexiteer by conviction, where BoJo merely wants to be “king” and uses Brexit for that purpose.
joe on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 2:43 am
Not sure that the Torys would even care at this stage if Scotland left. Scotland only joined us because of the benefits of access to our markets. Scotland on its own will retain access to the EU but not the free trade agreements made after Brexit. Since the main trading partner of Scotland is the UK then let’s see how intelligent actual independence really is. They run a trade surplus because of their unity with Britain, for example tourism and services. Right now for political reasons their political leaders have decided to play with fire and put their good economic position at risk. Thats fine. It’s won’t change anything. If Corbyn becomes PM, he and his communist and islamist friends will nationalise everything in the kind of deal that the squad wants in the US. Goodles luck to em, but the masses might not be a stupid as they think……
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 4:18 am
“My money is on China.”
LOL, of course it is that is all you think about. Even if it is absurd you would bet your money on it. This is why your ideas are so inaccurate.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 4:34 am
“Eight Reasons The EU Will Suffer Far More Than UK From Brexit”
https://tinyurl.com/y4xcae98 Money mavin via zero hedge
“Reason 1: Corporate Taxes The UK can and likely will slash corporate tax rates. A lower corporate tax rate will mitigate much of the profit damage suffered by UK corporations in the event of no deal. Note that one of the EU’s biggest complaints against Ireland now is the “unfair” corporate tax structure of Ireland. Reason 2: Currency Fluctuations A falling currency is good for exporters and bad for importers. The British Pound has been falling in anticipation of Brexit. Reason 3: Balance of Trade In the event of no deal, WTO tariffs kick unless the EU offers to work out a trade deal In a rising tariff setup, exporters will suffer far more than importers. Germany has an enormous trade surplus with the UK. Angela Merkel is very concerned about German exports as well she should be. Throw in the increasing chance of Trump putting tariffs on German cars and the EU will get crucified. Note that a falling currency will mitigate some of the Tariff damage on UK exporters while compounding the problems for the EU. Reason 4: Fishing Rights In Brexit, the UK halts all EU fishing rights. EU fishermen will get clobbered. Reason 5: Trade Deals The UK will be able to make its own trade deals and set tariffs how it pleases. Reason 6: Rules and Regulations The UK will finally be free of inane EU rules and regulations on basically everything but especially agriculture. Reason 7: Brexit Fees and Pay to Play Fee Some dispute this, but the UK can halt the Brexit breakup fee. Boris Johnson has threatened to do that. Regardless, the UK will stop paying into the EU coffers even it does pay the breakup bill. The EU has budgeted for UK payments. When the UK stops paying, the EU will have to raise taxes to cover the difference. Reason 8: Long Term Consequences Both the EU and UK will suffer in the event of no deal but the long-term consequences strongly favor of the UK.”
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 5:20 am
“China’s pollution is so bad it’s blocking sunlight from solar panels”
https://tinyurl.com/yxh3yw6u we forum
New research published in the journal Nature Energy suggests the country’s densely polluted atmosphere is blocking the sun’s rays, preventing solar panels from harvesting energy efficiently…The results showed that average solar generation declined by between 11-15% over the period. Researchers forecast that a return to the air-quality levels of the 1960s could result in an increase in solar electricity harvests of more than 12%.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 6:16 am
“Our Veggie Gardens Won’t Feed us in a Real Crisis”
https://tinyurl.com/yyknqbv9 resiliance
“The Midwest floods and their possible repercussions for the food supply got some attention in the news (though not enough). One of the most common suggestions I saw on social media was: “Plant a garden!” If only it were that simple. I used to be a small-scale organic farmer so take it from me: totally feeding yourself from your own efforts is very, very challenging. Though some friends and I tried over multiple seasons, we never succeeded, or even came anywhere close.”
“Without going through all of the above, here’s what you’re probably not thinking of right now: The typical US American diet is only 10-20% fruits and veggies―like you might grow in your backyard―and the vast majority is made up of grains and proteins in one form or another. What vegetable does nearly everyone grow in their home garden? Tomatoes. How do they eat them? Often enough, on a sandwich or in pasta. That’s wheat or rice or some other grains. How many people have ever planted rice or wheat in their back yards? Meat is also grains because that’s what’s fed to animals. This includes the majority of grass-fed cows, who are “finished” (fattened up) on grains on a feedlot prior to slaughter. So if you want meat in your home-grown diet, you’ll need to plant for those mouths too. You might end up concluding that you don’t need as much as you thought you did. (BTW, historic paleolithic diets were supplemented by hunting meat but were dependent on gathering roots, seeds, berries, etc.)”
“When I think about the possibility of some kind of food supply crisis in the US, all I can do is shake my head. We do not have a safety net to catch us if we fall. If we want one, we needed to start working on it yesterday. Just putting in another raised bed in your backyard ain’t gonna do it. You can’t live off of spinach, cucumbers and green beans. (You can survive just on potatoes if you have to, but guaranteeing year round availability is tricky.) I’m not saying we shouldn’t plant veggie gardens. We should put in as many as we can and fight to keep them when they’re threatened. But let’s not kid ourselves that a few heads of broccoli (or even a wheel barrow of zucchinis) will get us through an actual breakdown of the agricultural system. It won’t. If we want a shot at doing that, we need to put in some meaningful time and effort, and it will necessarily be outside the system.”
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 6:17 am
I am with this author when he shakes his head. I also shake my head when I see these articles by academics claiming we should do this or that to make room for more people on this earth. Vegans come to mind when they claim we can do away with meat production. Some say we should eat insects. What we are faced with is unprecedented because we have become habituated to a diverse tasty diet on demand. What we are also faced with is an unstable food supply system if push ever came to shove by mother nature. There ae no answers to overshoot only strategies for mitigation and adaptation. We can make efforts to change diets and plant gardens. These efforts will not be enough in some crisis but others they may make a meaningful dent in the pain that could be ahead. A bad food crisis could be what tips the globe into a cascading collapse. There is not much that can be done for that. There will be horrific consequence. There is no way around this. Going forward we likely will not feed the extra billions we see reports tell us we will. Food productivity and stable water availability are in decline. No amount of technology is going to change that in my mind not with the pollution, depletion, and growing populations we see today.
I have a permaculture farm. It is all I can do to manage what I have. It is the wife and I and people I hire when I need professional services like plumbers or electricians. My garden is big but minimalist. Minimalist means I don’t have time to manicure it. I have tomatoes, cucumbers, and melons. I also have asparagus, black berries, grapes, and fruit trees. Tomatoes and peaches turned out well this year. Lots of apples too. Cucumbers and zucchini are abundant. My wife is canning some of this produce. I have been eating out of the garden and it is wonderful. If you ask me if this is going to make a difference in a crisis I would say yes if the crisis hits at the right time. If the crisis hits at the wrong time I may not even get a garden in. Don’t forget I had to buy seeds. I have how to seed books but I don’t have time to make my own seeds. I barely have time to get a garden in and maintain it. I have meat production which is a big advantage I have over others. In a crisis I can sell, trade and or harvest a cow with others. Cows are too big to deal with for just my wife and I. The real advantage I have is my goats. They are easy to butcher and utilize. Along with garden stuff a meal can be made.
I am doing all I can do to marginally be sustainable in a crisis. I am aware of many things I could harvest of the land. There is lots of wildlife, nuts, and greens. These things would help but for how long and how stable? I have also purchased a significant amount of long shelf life food. This along with the meat and garden stuff I produce will get me through a few months. I am better off than the average joe in the city but not by much because it comes down to community and the ability of many to support the diverse diet, we have become used to. For me I tell people to do something. A small garden will help and it is more than what you produce. It is about the ability to produce. It is not economic for me to raise my food but it is smart to know how to and to have some in the ground or on the ground with animals. It is akin to insurance or a bank account.
We don’t know what kind of crisis is ahead. The degree and duration will matter. With that in mind we can survive some crisis. It is possible the right kind of crisis could cause significant changes in behavior. In that case I welcome a slap in the face kind of crisis. What I don’t welcome because I know from experience is a 2×4 to the head crisis we may not get up from. Do something and at least learn how to do something. You can also get an education of how exposed we really are. This realization can change your behavior in other areas also. How smart are some of our behaviors if we realized how vulnerable we are with food. I am struggling to have a doomstead. My experience over 10 years of sustained effort has sobered me. I have actually been at this 20 years but sustained effort at a doomstead farm is 10. I am as prepared as I can be and tweaking my abilities all the time. I have the money and the time and I realize many don’t. I am lucky in this respect. This permaculture farm stuff does not add up economically but tell me what does today? This whole rat race is a race away from reality and towards absurdity but it is a race we are stuck in. An effort at downsizing and producing something is called for at least for those who can and who care.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 6:27 am
“Towards a Landscape Diet and Communal Landscape Management”
https://tinyurl.com/y2st2sxx resilience
Lately I have read two articles which both claim that small scale farming is (self)exploitive and that even with direct marketing such as farmers markets, there is no profit, hardly even survival. What nobody told me about small farming: I can’t make a living, by Jaclyn Moyer published in Salon (it is from 2015, but someone shared it on social media and it came my way) makes the case that it is not possible to make a living from production on a small farm under any normal circumstances. Jaclyn writes that she at first wouldn’t admit having a struggling business as no one wants to climb aboard a sinking ship.
“When a student asked if my farm was sustainable, I told her that I was certified organic, I managed my soil fertility through crop rotations and compost applications, I didn’t use synthetic pesticides, I conserved water. But no, I’d said, I didn’t think my farm was sustainable. Like all the other farms I knew, my farm relied on uncompensated labor and self-exploitation. My farm was not sustainable because I knew the years my partner and I could continue to work without a viable income were numbered.”
“Because of our insistence on independence and our failure to cooperate more closely, we’re being outsold at the grocery store by a factor of 400+. Accounting for on-farm, food hub, restaurant, and other non-market sales does little to affect the scale of this imbalance. Farmers markets and other “local” outlets punch well above their weight in terms of social/cultural value, but this is fooling us into believing we’re making more of an impact than we actually are, and that a rapidly consolidating food system backed by venture capital, entrenched interests, and the world’s wealthiest corporations will somehow be displaced by the romance of neoliberal peasant farming”.
“The economic conditions under which farmers, other actors in the food system and consumers interact is the factor that most strongly shapes the food system, and therefore it will be futile trying to change the contents of the system while leaving the economic conditions, structures and relationships intact. What we have got to today is – somewhat simplistically put – what makes sense under the conditions under which farmers, agribusiness and consumers operate.“
“In my vision we see farming as landscape management and food is based on the landscape diet, i.e. that you eat food from the landscape you live in. Communities are jointly deciding on major principles of how the landscape is managed and take responsibility for that farmers can do their job in a good way – and eat the stuff from that land. Exact details surely will vary, and should vary as culture and ecological conditions differ, but I am sure there will be room for small-scale farming there. I am well aware of that this vision doesn’t fit well with cities of 20 million people sourcing their food from all continents. But I don’t think that the future will be in such cities.”
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 6:32 am
“Worst Year Ever”: The Chinese Ban On U.S. Agricultural Products Will Be A Death Blow For Countless U.S. Farms”
https://tinyurl.com/yc3wpq2 economic collapse blog
“U.S. farmers have never experienced a year quite like this. During the first half of 2019, endless rain and unprecedented flooding were the major problems. As a result of the incredibly wet conditions, millions of acres of prime farmland didn’t get planted at all, and tens of millions of other acres are going to yield a lot less than usual. Even without anything else happening, we were going to see farm bankruptcies soar to absolutely crazy levels, but now the Chinese government is essentially cutting off U.S. agricultural imports. This will greatly depress the prices that U.S. farmers get for their crops, and so many farmers that were still hoping to squeeze out a profit for this year will be hit with a loss instead. Ultimately, the truth is that 2019 is going to be a death blow for countless U.S. farmers that were barely hanging on financially after a string of really tough years. Many will leave the industry entirely and never go back to farming again, and our nation will be worse off because of it.”
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 6:58 am
“Eight Reasons The EU Will Suffer Far More Than UK From Brexit”
Says an anonymous poster “mish”.
Another googled opinion.
The main point of Brexit is to get rid of noriously globalist English and Americans and let them demographically drown in the third world all by themselves. Anglo-Zionist problem solving itself once and for all.
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:06 am
Parking Britain into Oceania:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7331521/Dominic-Raab-hails-Donald-Trumps-warmth-enthusiasm-surprise-meeting-president.html
“Dominic Raab hails Donald Trump’s ‘warmth and enthusiasm’ after surprise meeting with the US president and VP Mike Pence in Washington to discuss a post-Brexit trade deal”
UK out of Europe, Russia in.
Bring it on!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/24/lord-heseltine-suggests-brexit-allowing-germany-win-world-war/
“Lord Heseltine suggests Brexit vote allows Germany to win World War Two”
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:12 am
Further to my above, the on demand diverse tasty diet us Americans have become habituated to is not the same diet at all as the rest of the world eats. Most people in the world today still survive on rice and vegetables. I should also make note, just because I only have a short growing season doesn’t mean that everybody else does. Look at makato for example, he can grow food year round. makato obviously spent good time in choosing his location. I didn’t choose mine. It was a trust fund handout from my mommy and daddy.
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:15 am
According to der Spiegel is the real reason behind the US-Chinese trade war a fight for who is going to be the next #1
Agree.
Let them lock horns.
There is such a thing as laughing third.
#PBM
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:16 am
Link
https://m.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/soziales/usa-gegen-china-warum-der-wirtschaftskrieg-noch-haesslicher-werden-koennte-a-1280835.html
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:20 am
“China’s pollution is so bad it’s blocking sunlight from solar panels”
I posted this article cause it was so dumbass. I mean who rights stupid shit like this anyhow?
“the country’s densely polluted atmosphere is blocking the sun’s rays”
Last time I checked China didn’t have a atmosphere seperate from the rest of the world, or did I miss something here?
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:42 am
“Last time I checked China didn’t have a atmosphere seperate from the rest of the world, or did I miss something here?”
Juanpee, I realize you didn’t go to school but for your info the atmosphere is layered
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:46 am
“ same diet at all as the rest of the world eats. Most people in the world today still survive on rice and vegetables. I should also make note, just because I only have a short growing season doesn’t mean that everybody else does. “
That is working out well everywhere, lol, juanpee. If you are going to debate leave your agenda at home in you high rise Miami Beach condo where cockroaches grow.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:47 am
And the layer over China IS seperate from the rest of the world juanpee. I lurned me that one in gradeschool.
dumbass
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:50 am
Hey Davy I could care less about any of this because I am set. I got all the money I need. Fuck you
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:51 am
Of course I get to keep my agenda on me at all times and everybody else has to leave there’s at home. That’s just the way I roll. It’s all about me, myself, and I. Cause i’m Special.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:54 am
You made my point exactly, juanpee. You are so toxic to this forum. You only give a shit about yourself. You truly are an example of the worst of humanity. A mentally unbalanced egotistical rich South American brat that never matured.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 8:57 am
Folks as you can see JuanP is using my ID as usual. Don’t hurt his feeling or he will use yours.! Many time it is just his stupid mindless socks that demonstrate his personality dysfunctions. Ban and deport the mentally ill illegal alien.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:00 am
“And the layer over China IS seperate from the rest of the world juanpee. I lurned me that one in
Where did I see that, juanpee, stupid. The article is referring to low level pollution. What a brain dead idiot
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:02 am
I should try harder to break myself free from my widdle juanpee hallucinations. There making me look even more insane then I already am.
I AM THE MOB on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:19 am
“We could lose the whole farm”: Rural America is fighting to stay afloat as Trump’s trade war grinds on
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/national/farm-bankruptcies-rise-as-trumps-trade-war-grinds-on/
haha have fun on welfare
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:23 am
“I should try harder to break myself free from my widdle juanpee hallucinations. There making me look even more insane then I already am.”
Juanpee, I win you lose. I am still here. I see you getting less motivated as time goes by. Man you must be a really fucked up individual to spend over a year in this mindless hateful activity of being a cyber bully and stalker. What a loser.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:31 am
I might be less mad all the time if I was able to figure out there’s no winners or losers in discussions.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 9:41 am
“I might be less mad all the time”
Juanpee, You are the stalking cyber bully. This is a sick thing too. You have been at it over a year into now which indicates personality dysfunctions. You have degraded the quality of this forum but you have made it clear you want it taken down. I debate and discuss. I post relevant energy news. You specialize in mindless socks and ID theft with close to zero contributions. I call you the pure form of a troll juanpee.
JuanP on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:32 am
Folks as you can see Davy is using my ID as usual. Don’t hurt his feeling or he will use yours.! Many time it is just his stupid mindless socks that demonstrate his personality dysfunctions. Ban and deport the mentally ill illegal alien.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:38 am
In case you’re wondering what accounts for my endless ID Thievery and Sock Puppeteering, I must come clean. Remember my lover Pablo? I discovered Pablo painting my toenails in Forest Park after passing out from a bit too much Ripple. Well, Pablo left our trailer by the town dump for greener pastures and as I consequence I am more desperate than ever for an ebony twink.
Keepin’ it real, people.
I AM THE MOB on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:43 am
In about 10-15 years people like Clogg and Davy will be in nursing homes sitting in diapers full of poop and getting slapped in the face by some mexican nurse..
Long time coming..
HAHA
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:44 am
“I have a permaculture farm. It is all I can do to manage what I have.”
It’s really tough being forced to subsist on a trust fund and just barely having enough time to tend the weed infested garden. What do the rest of you dumbasses do who have to work for a living? You’re a bunch of worthless losers.
boney joe on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:47 am
That’s what I call getting their just desserts. Getting bitch slapped 24/7.
“In about 10-15 years people like Clogg and Davy will be in nursing homes sitting in diapers full of poop and getting slapped in the face by some mexican nurse..”
ALL JUANPEE SHIT on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:56 am
JuanP on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:32 am
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:38 am
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:44 am
boney joe on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:47 am
JuanP on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:32 am
Folks as you can see Davy is using my ID as usual. Don’t hurt his feeling or he will use yours.! Many time it is just his stupid mindless socks that demonstrate his personality dysfunctions. Ban and deport the mentally ill illegal alien.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:38 am
In case you’re wondering what accounts for my endless ID Thievery and Sock Puppeteering, I must come clean. Remember my lover Pablo? I discovered Pablo painting my toenails in Forest Park after passing out from a bit too much Ripple. Well, Pablo left our trailer by the town dump for greener pastures and as I consequence I am more desperate than ever for an ebony twink.
Keepin’ it real, people.
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:44 am
“I have a permaculture farm. It is all I can do to manage what I have.”
It’s really tough being forced to subsist on a trust fund and just barely having enough time to tend the weed infested garden. What do the rest of you dumbasses do who have to work for a living? You’re a bunch of worthless losers.
boney joe on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 10:47 am
That’s what I call getting their just desserts. Getting bitch slapped 24/7. “In about 10-15 years people like Clogg and Davy will be in nursing homes sitting in diapers full of poop and getting slapped in the face by some mexican nurse..”
Antius on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 11:20 am
“In about 10-15 years people like Clogg and Davy will be in nursing homes sitting in diapers full of poop and getting slapped in the face by some mexican nurse.”
Not so long ago, the Mobster was prognosticating that we would all be dead within a few years, when peak oil arrived and the zombie apocalypse began. He had fantasies about the breakdown of law and order, whereupon he intended to rape Taylor Swift, who in reality would probably have shot him. That was a few years ago. The end of the world never turned up. Instead, rich people got richer and the poor kept getting poorer. The future looks like feudalism, not the walking dead.
I AM THE MOB on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 11:50 am
Antius
I never said in a few years..And there is no evidence to support that far fetched accusation..
I have always said I think around 2030 give or take is when the wheels finally come off..And I have a mountain of peer reviewed evidence to support that
https://medium.com/@Cliffhanger1983/the-collapse-of-civilization-manifesto-2039c6a5327
And remember you said the Cons would take back the house in 2018 election? Because ZeroIQ told you so..
And the US energy department as of last month stop publishing world oil production data..So I think its safe to say that world peak oil is past tense..
Enjoy the ride..And me and home boys will enjoy…
JuanP on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 12:47 pm
“I have always said I think around 2030 give or take is when the wheels finally come off..”
Liar, you have used 2025 on multiple occasions
JuanP on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 12:49 pm
You also cry about alt right extremism then tell us how you plan on killing white men and breeding their daughters when collapse comes Whats up with that?
Davy on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 1:04 pm
I want my MOMMY!
Cloggie on Wed, 7th Aug 2019 1:29 pm
Floppy opines: “We could lose the whole farm”: Rural America is fighting to stay afloat as Trump’s trade war grinds on
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/national/farm-bankruptcies-rise-as-trumps-trade-war-grinds-on/
haha have fun on welfare
Here is an alternative scenario… desperate unemployed who feel they are losing their country make for great terrorists… um… make that freedom fighters.
P.S. just got a mail with recommendations from Amazon.com, based on past purchases (and no doubt browsing history):
1. The day of the rope (LOL)
2. Clean Code: A Handbook of Agile Software Craftsmanship
3. Ethnic Apocalypse: The Coming European Civil War – Guillaume Faye
4. Programming Pearls – Jon Bentley
5. Retroculture: Taking America Back
6. End the Con: A Plan to Take Back Our America
7. Venice, a new history
8. The Architectural History of Venice: Revised and enlarged edition
9. The Stones of Venice, John Ruskin
10. Norway Travel Guide
11. Wasserstoff und Brennstoffzellen (Technik im Fokus) (German)
12. Triumph and Tragedy (The Second World War), Churchill
13. Euv Lithography (SPIE Press Monographs)
14.
Physics for Scientists and Engineers Raymond A. Serway, John W. Jewett
etc.