[MacG]

Sound not entirely unlike a marketing ploy. The seller is a "zero" without ebay history, buyer just a (9).

[Raxozanne]

Isn't new technology great...

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')The poster, "goldeneyemaster", claims his Xbox 360 was crashing "like once every 20 minutes," so he suspended it in the air with a bit of string - which solved the problem.

[emersonbiggins]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', 'S')ound not entirely unlike a marketing ploy. The seller is a "zero" without ebay history, buyer just a (9).

[AmericanEmpire]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')aybe Microsoft knows that civilization won't last much longer, so they decided to go out with a bang with a final gaming machine before the collapse.

[NonToxic]

Tango

If it does not work sorry. I tried to preview it.

[strider3700]

I'm not convinced that it's necessarily the car of the future but it's probably a lot closer to it then anything else we have now.

Presonally I think they should make it twice as wide to help increase the adoption rate. It just looks strange right now.

I wonder what the reserve is on it.

[NonToxic]

A factory order is $85000.00.

[strider3700]

well now I know that this is definitely not the car of the future

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')resonally I think they should make it twice as wide to help increase the adoption rate. It just looks strange right now.

[pilferage]

They can produce a trike, which is registered as a motorcycle, and cut costs like mad. But they don't....
I call BS.

[The_Toecutter]

Actually, it's not that simple with a trike. Motorcycle regulations vary from state to state, in which many states would consider a trike of any sort a motorcycle, while others might consider a closed trike as a car and subject it to the national automobile standards.

However, one electric car builder named Jerry Dycus is taking the trike approach with the Freedom EV concept. It will be able to accelerate like a VW bug(or faster, although that is still slow), top 80 mph, and do 100 miles per charge for about $15k. And it will be virtually hand-built. The downside is, he's going to be dealing with a much smaller market that is nowhere near mainstream(while the Tango might slip in there just slightly), and he's also counting on a peak oil crisis occuring soon(which with high gas prices would help get more vehicle sales). Operating cost including batteries will be about 3 cents per mile for the Freedom EV. You read that right. Three pennies per mile. His risk is consequently MUCH higher, while CommuterCars would rather have a more secured and garunteed market, and they'd like the car to have 4 wheels to be *somewhat* paletable as a second car to most in hopes that they will later be able to mass produce it. Further, Commutercars wanted to build a performance machine, and it would have been difficult to achieve their desired performance characteristics and stability with a three wheeled vehicle, but not out of the realm of possibility.

http://www.evproduction.org/wiki/index.php?title=Freedom_EV

Corbin Motors took the three-wheeled approach as well with the Sparrow, but ran into problems when a good number of states didn't let them market their vehicles there. Further, they easily tipped over despite a relatively low center of gravity due to having three wheels and some balancing issues with handling.

[pilferage]

Granted, they can't mass market it. But to not produce it at all implies (to me) they're in it soley for profit. They going to be producing quite a few of these things, so why can't they sell certain versions in certain areas ~ at cost?

[The_Toecutter]

More different types of models cost more money to develop. The only one developed so far is the high performance T600. Most of the cost is not in parts, as parts cost is probably around $20-25k for this particular model, but is instead in labor and research.

I can garuntee you that each Tango likely has at least $20k in labor involved, probably more. Another good chunk was spent on research. If this particular business, being as small as they are, sells at cost in some areas, they're taking a risk that they'll sell enough cars elsewhere to have the funds to expand. Their strategy is to build as many high performance versions as they can so that they have money to develop cheaper and more profitable versions, while their high performance $80k model makes a reputation for the company and gets the name out. To do otherwise would compromise their strategy to expand.

They are a business and their motivation is profit, as they want to expand, but it is not their sole motivation given their design and choice of components. They could have made an even more-profitable gasoline powered car(at the same cost) with similar performance, but they decided not to.

To enter the market now days requires extremes. You will need to grab attention of prospective consumers by either starting with high performance, or starting with extremely cheap/economical. Commutercar's strategy was to start with high performance, they can't afford to sell at cost in some areas(yet). The guy building the Freedom EV is expecting lower costs($15k or so including labor), lower profit margins for each car sold, and perhaps even higher volume production, in which case he can afford to take that risk as he's the sole source of the labor involved and his limitation would be how low pay he is willing to work for as an average for all cars built and sold.

[pilferage]

How can labor cost ~25% of the vehicle price? They're paying someone $20K to assemble these things!? And a significant portion of that for research? As for ascribing their motivation to something other than profit because they're using a different design, they could just as easily be exploiting this niche in both consumer views and design.

I know I'm headed off into a semantic rant...
But, I think they'd be much better off with a distributed selection of models, and lower personal pay. Having everyone associated with the company at a decent (~$25k per year) rate of pay, with the profit being funneled into expansion/advertising/'whatever would benefit the company' would result in a huge competative advantage in today's market.

[Vexed]

Ya got two days to make your bid

[Vexed]

According to a previous poll of 545 Peak Oilers, 464 folks here have a 40 mile or less commute everyday - which is exactly what this vehicle offers.

That means that 86% of the PO.com community could go oil free for their daily commute, other than what is burned at the electric plant - about a 98% emission savings per ICE engine replaced.

[ChicknLittle]

This year I've moved to around 3 miles (but lots of big hills) from work... And I just ordered an electric bike (ok, im lazy) to get me to work faster and with less sweat... The bike is about 2000$ (there are cheaper available), with a 1000 Watt motor, and a great lithium polymer battery which only weighs 10 pounds and is not greatly affected by cold weather. I expect to be able to go around 14 mph even up hills with little effort, with a range of more than 15 miles without pedaling... and plan to use it even in cool weather this winter. Not cheap, but cheaper than trying to buy a hybrid car, and cheaper than feeding a horse.

This pic is close to what im getting (same frame and drive, different battery configuration). I think doing this will reduce my stress re: peak oil [web]http://www.electricstar.org/images/tidal_force.jpg[/web]... and, a movie about a guy who uses an electric bike http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eNdU9QQZUk

[Vexed]

These little electric cars can only get cheaper too!

Yup, that's right.

Revenue at the company called Zap was up 376% in the second quarter of 2006, compared to last year. Compare this with Ford's numbers, anyone?

These $10,000 electric cars and $500-$2500 electric bikes (which exist RIGHT NOW) can only get cheaper and faster and more efficient as the market moves from SUV's, foreign oil, and the rest of the dominant paradigm.

We just have to pray for high oil prices to continue.

[BrazilianPO]

From the economic POV, I will still keep my 6 years old, 34 mpg car. Gas prices would have to at least double before I start considering any of these funny-looking electric cars.

Moreover, what about battery life? My laptop's battery only lasted three years. I do not want to exchange the car's battery pack every three or four years at a cost of 15-25% of a new vehicle.

There are still some important issues before electric cars hit the mainstream, but they could do it eventually.

[peaker_2005]

Electric bikes to me make a lot of sense. Should the battery fail, at least you can still pedal the thing! It means that you wouldn't have to put your life on hold while you wait for a new battery (which, post peak, could take a while...)