[timmac]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('UncleRay', 'I') have a few questions about "cash for clunkers"

Do buyers pay sticker price for the new car? How/when do they get the rebate?

Does the buyer pay sales tax on the gross sale or after the rebate is deducted?

Does the buyer pay income tax on the rebate?

Do the dealers get the clunker for free? Do they sell it for scrap? Must the dealer disable the engine or the scrap yard?

It's been said auto dealers usually make most of their profit on the trade-in car. So are they losing money in the long run?

[TreeFarmer]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'Y')eah, almost $20,000 for used car?

Sausage burner?

[Fishman]

My reading is they drain the oil and pour sodium silicate into the oil system then start the engine. Sort of like running liquid sand through the oil system, permanently locking up the engine. The real question is what will the sales be after the program? Will it have sucked out all the possible sales and then plummet, or actually get folks out to buy cars afterward (doubtful)

[heroineworshipper]

U got it, kid. It raised the price of cars.

[MarkJ]

Some of our lower income challenged and credit challenged tenants, employees and customers buy decent used vehicles every year or two with their tax refunds.


Having sold hundreds of used vehicles to income and credit challenged buyers, the supply has never been much of an issue. Down-payments, financing, insurance, maintenance, repairs, parking fines, towing, impound fees, parking space rental, traffic tickets and repossessions are problems since the lower income households spend nearly all of their pay on rent, electric, heat, hot water, plus other debt and living expenses.


Repairs are a major issue for income challenged people with out-of-warranty vehicles. The lower income people dread the yearly vehicle safety and emissions inspections, roadblocks and traffic stops since they often can't afford the tires, repair parts and/or professional labor rates, plus parts markup necessary to pass safety/emissions inspections or police inspections. Repair costs are often more than the market value of the vehicle, so people often junk the vehicle, or buy a used beater with a current inspection.

Many people don't have the parking, off-street parking, work areas, knowledge, tools, equipment and skills to maintain and repair vehicles. Many trash their vehicles in a short period of time since they don't check their fluids, change their oil, grease fittings, wash their undercarriage or perform other critical maintenance and repairs.

We still have quite a few bargains in my region since many households own 3/4/5/6 vehicles.

http://wad20.wantaddigest.com/view/ajax ... class=Cars

I got a pretty decent deal on a late model Mustang simply because the owners ran out of garage space for vehicles and toys.

When people get their tax refunds, investors, sellers, used car dealers and buy-here-pay-here car dealers can turn a nice profit.

The buy-here-pay-her dealers that lease my garage have had decent increase increase in sales since credit is tighter. They often sell sub $1,000 high mileage auction cars and trades for big bucks to credit challenged types on a weekly payment schedule.

[deMolay]

Not to mention it is bad for the enviroment.

[mattduke]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')ow, the clunker program could cause prices to rise 5% to 10% more, especially for vehicles worth $4,500 or less, says Alec Gutierrez, senior market analyst for Kelley Blue Book. "It's going to drive prices up of some of the most affordable vehicles we have on the road."

The $2 billion added by Congress came after eager buyers churned through most of the original $1 billion in the first two weeks. The program provides incentives of up to $4,500 to people who trade in an old car for a new, fuel-efficient vehicle. But to prevent fraud, the program requires that all trade-ins be scrapped so the gas guzzler doesn't find its way back on the road.

Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Okla., called that provision "nuts" during debate in the Senate last week. He said that in his state, one trade-in had less than 10,000 miles on the odometer. "We're going to destroy the opportunity for somebody less fortunate to have that automobile," he said.

Used car dealers agree. They say fewer older cars are at auction.

Too few older cars at reasonable prices could put some dealers out of business, says Tim Swift, general manager of the Corry Auto Dealers Exchange, an auction operation for dealers in Corry, Pa. "It's was tough finding them before, and now, it's even worse," says Mike Williams, owner of Auto Wise in Shelbyville, Ky. "The $3,000-to-$5,000 car is just gone."

[frankthetank]

The clunker program is a scam. Its a way to funnel billions to the dealerships and to the auto companies. On paper it looks like your getting thousands for your car, but what it comes down to is very little... On top of that you are now going into debt... What a horribly stupid program...

[dunewalker]

This ought to quiet the technocopians who insist that we will mobilize new technology to deal with the decreasing availability of inexpensive fossil fuels. Think of what could have been accomplished with just the $3 billion being wasted on the clunkers program. It's more obvious than before that no mitigation is going to happen.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('frankthetank', 'T')he clunker program is a scam. Its a way to funnel billions to the dealerships and to the auto companies. On paper it looks like your getting thousands for your car, but what it comes down to is very little... On top of that you are now going into debt... What a horribly stupid program...

[TheDude]

The price already has rebounded, as I posted in the Vehicle Sales Watch thread.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('frankthetank', 'T')he clunker program is a scam. Its a way to funnel billions to the dealerships and to the auto companies. On paper it looks like your getting thousands for your car, but what it comes down to is very little... On top of that you are now going into debt... What a horribly stupid program...

[vtsnowedin]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('UncleRay', 'I') have a few questions about "cash for clunkers"

Do buyers pay sticker price for the new car? How/when do they get the rebate?

Does the buyer pay sales tax on the gross sale or after the rebate is deducted?

Does the buyer pay income tax on the rebate?

Do the dealers get the clunker for free? Do they sell it for scrap? Must the dealer disable the engine or the scrap yard?

It's been said auto dealers usually make most of their profit on the trade-in car. So are they losing money in the long run?

[yesplease]

It could hurt, but at the same time a poor person who is buying a used vehicle that gets less than 19mpg is also hurting themselves on average given the majority of vehicle use in the U.S. Having fewer used gas guzzlers may be beneficial in that sense. The poor person in question is set of having a big guzzler, which is unfortunately kinda common IME, will get hurt regardless due to thousands more per year in fuel costs. Needing a larger vehicle for work would be where someone was getting unfairly hurt. Although it wouldn't be hurt by much since removing a million guzzlers won't increase the price of the other 50 million or so by a whole lot.

[lowem]

Now, what exactly is the US government trying to do? Short circuit the total-fleet replacement process from 30 years to 30 months? Very, very expensive proposition.

Does the US government really have the money to pull this off? Yeah, thought so.

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TreeFarmer', 'O')nce again, who buys those used cars? The poor.

[crude_intentions]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lowem', 'N')ow, what exactly is the US government trying to do? Short circuit the total-fleet replacement process from 30 years to 30 months? Very, very expensive proposition.

Does the US government really have the money to pull this off? Yeah, thought so.

[Kristen]

Nothing to surprising here. The government passes some piece of legislative work without thinking of the consequences.

[smallpoxgirl]

They're trying to pretend like this has something to do with gas mileage. They haven't and aren't raising the CAFE standard for decades, so that is just smoke and mirrors. Basically it just comes down to vandalizing a whole lot of perfectly good cars, and spending a butt load of taxpayer money to convince Americans to buy new cars they don't need and can't afford. It really has me steamed.

[eastbay]

... and when the C for C program ends, what will become of car sales numbers? The non stop stupidity of Obama is appalling.

But then again, any electorate that votes 98% for more war will fall for just about anything. And 'they' know it.