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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Zardoz » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 02:55:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', '.')..Systemic harassment, both selective and arbitrary, is not incompetence.

And, the motivation behind this supposed "systemic harassment" is what, exactly?
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Koyaanisqatsi » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 04:28:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', '.')..Systemic harassment, both selective and arbitrary, is not incompetence.

And, the motivation behind this supposed "systemic harassment" is what, exactly?


Step #6
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby alpha480v » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 05:19:13

I just got my ccw permit here in NY. It Took a long 7 months, but I got it Finlay.

I wouldn't be surprised if all registered handgun owners weren't on some master list of people who should be visited when tshtf.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby skeptik » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 06:21:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', 'S')ystemic harassment, both selective and arbitrary, is not incompetence.

Standard totalitarian playbook. Keep the populace in a constant state of alarm and fear via illogical and arbitrary harrassment. Most will stay sullenly compliant. Those who protest are then more easily picked out as potential troublemakers and given 'special security treatment' - precisely the words used to me by TSA on my recent visit to Nebraska from Spain.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby vision-master » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 08:36:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Novus', 'U')nder NO circumstances register your guns. Registration just guarantees a visit from the man on a day you don't want to see him. Stupid! Stupid! Stupid!

What kind of gun can you buy without registering? A bi-bi gun? Hunting shotgun? I mean, sure, its great to have an unregistered arsenal in the woods but what unregistred firearm can you have at home legally? An arquebuse?


Private party cash sale............ :razz:
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby HEADER_RACK » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 08:56:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Novus', 'U')nder NO circumstances register your guns. Registration just guarantees a visit from the man on a day you don't want to see him. Stupid! Stupid! Stupid!

What kind of gun can you buy without registering? A bi-bi gun? Hunting shotgun? I mean, sure, its great to have an unregistered arsenal in the woods but what unregistred firearm can you have at home legally? An arquebuse?


Private party cash sale............ :razz:


+1
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 09:55:20

I hate to throw cold water on everyone, but I don't think the tinfoil hat and government conspiracy theories hold up here.

As I said, I should draw more hits than Seahorse in their databases, and I never get questioned at all. I believe some failed algorithm for handling these things, not intentional maliciousness, has put him on a "list", the kind which you obviously don't want to be on.

I love a good conspiracy theory as much as anyone else, but the evidence suggests otherwise in this case.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby BigTex » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 10:55:07

The finest conspiracy is so subtle that very few are even aware of it, including the insiders.

Sort of like in 1984.
:)
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 12:38:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('golem', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', 'I') hate to throw cold water on everyone, but I don't think the tinfoil hat and government conspiracy theories hold up here.


so why are they building internment camps?
http://www.informationclearinghouse.inf ... e12078.htm

golem


Like I said, here. That means, "in this instance", for those on the short bus.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('golem', '
')punk


Go fuck yourself, blowhard.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 12:44:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', 'T')he finest conspiracy is so subtle that very few are even aware of it, including the insiders.

Sort of like in 1984.


I am not delusional about what TPTB are doing. I fully know.

Again, I stand by my assertion that in this case, Seahorse's situation is due to their algorithm for sweeping the data selecting him, and adding him to the list. He got caught up in the Homeland Security systems. In his particular case, it is not insidious with respect to him, it is the result of policies and systems they have put in place since 9/11 by TPTB.

If they were really after Seahorse, he would not have left that airport.

The TPTB's motivations and real plans are an entirely different discussion in my opinion.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby DomusAlbion » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 13:11:55

Gentlemen, let's be gentlemen.

Golem, careful with your language or we'll be locking you in the attic again.

Jotapay, please don't provoke or encourage our resident crazy uncle.

Thanks,
DA
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 13:51:22

Duly noted, I apologize.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Heineken » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 14:11:48

Seahorse, let me introduce you to a friend of mine. His name is Franz Kafka . . .

Seriously, I hope you get yourself extricated from this mess as soon as possible. Being that you are a lawyer, you should be well-equipped to do it.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby seahorse » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 14:44:26

Thanks Heineken,

I'll keep everyone posted, bc I'm genuinely interested in trying to figure out how this happened. If I weren't interested, then there would be something wrong with me. However, as with most of you, I have been a little concerned about the trend of our executive office. Some of my posts and threads have expressed that. So, being a lawyer, it would not surprise me that I somehow end up on some list for that fact alone. Lawyers have never been favorites of gov'ts. One need only realize that 22 of the 56 men signing the Constitution were lawyers. Or, better yet, read up on the famous French lawyer Robspierre who took a very leading role in the French revolution hanging the aristocrats. Or, more recently, the Pakistan unrest led by their lawyers.

Do I think that its related to me being a lawyer or things I've posted? Most likely not. Most likely, I'm the "victim" of some stupid bureacratic screw up. If, however, its more than that, then, well, that's very telling and I will certainly let everyone know. However, even if its just some screw up unrelated to anything else, as I said, its certainly says a lot about the current state of our homeland security, or lack thereof.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby jupiters_release » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 14:59:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', 'I') hate to throw cold water on everyone, but I don't think the tinfoil hat and government conspiracy theories hold up here.

As I said, I should draw more hits than Seahorse in their databases, and I never get questioned at all. I believe some failed algorithm for handling these things, not intentional maliciousness, has put him on a "list", the kind which you obviously don't want to be on.


How many of the million americans on the terrorist watch list are actually terrorists? Probably none. The existence of an algorithm, however random, or a list itself is proof of systemic harassment which relatively is nothing compared to the poor souls being tortured around the world in gitmo and other undisclosed locations.

If you understand the consequences of overshoot and that policy makers do too, then it doesn't take much imagination to connect the dots... put yourself in the shoes of the Rothschild cartel. What would you do? If the public thinks Homeland Security harassment is innocent or at best incompetent, then the public are getting conditioned to think the same when martial law strips them of their rights. When Blackwater comes to appropriate your property or escort you to a KBR facility, you can just think "oh its a computer error" or "they don't know what they're doing" ... "I'll just comply now and call my lawyer later."

It'll be too late then, just as it's too late now to avert the consequences of overshoot and its dependency on fossil fuels.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 15:17:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', '
')How many of the million americans on the terrorist watch list are actually terrorists? Probably none. The existence of an algorithm, however random, or a list itself is proof of systemic harassment which relatively is nothing compared to the poor souls being tortured around the world in gitmo and other undisclosed locations.

If you understand the consequences of overshoot and that policy makers do too, then it doesn't take much imagination to connect the dots... put yourself in the shoes of the Rothschild cartel. What would you do? If the public thinks Homeland Security harassment is innocent or at best incompetent, then the public are getting conditioned to think the same when martial law strips them of their rights. When Blackwater comes to appropriate your property or escort you to a KBR facility, you can just think "oh its a computer error" or "they don't know what they're doing" ... "I'll just comply now and call my lawyer later."


Yes, I agree. I just think in the case of a specific individual, there are more specific reasons for the situation and specific ways to extricate oneself from the mess, rather than approaching the problem like it's a broad conspiracy and you have to find "them" because "they" did it to you.

But yes, sure sure, I know they are planning for marital law and the camps and RFID chips and complete control of everything and fascists and corporate control, etc etc. That isn't exactly going to help Seahorse though right now.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby jupiters_release » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 15:34:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', '
')How many of the million americans on the terrorist watch list are actually terrorists? Probably none. The existence of an algorithm, however random, or a list itself is proof of systemic harassment which relatively is nothing compared to the poor souls being tortured around the world in gitmo and other undisclosed locations.

If you understand the consequences of overshoot and that policy makers do too, then it doesn't take much imagination to connect the dots... put yourself in the shoes of the Rothschild cartel. What would you do? If the public thinks Homeland Security harassment is innocent or at best incompetent, then the public are getting conditioned to think the same when martial law strips them of their rights. When Blackwater comes to appropriate your property or escort you to a KBR facility, you can just think "oh its a computer error" or "they don't know what they're doing" ... "I'll just comply now and call my lawyer later."


Yes, I agree. I just think in the case of a specific individual, there are more specific reasons for the situation and specific ways to extricate oneself from the mess, rather than approaching the problem like it's a broad conspiracy and you have to find "them" because "they" did it to you.


Have you not seen any of the articles about people who've legitimately tried for years to get off the airport harassment list with no luck or resolution? The TSA's "mistake" wouldn't matter if Seahorse didn't fly again, which is probably the best option giving the current state of affairs. Of course I'm sure he could fight the system and blog it here, it would be interesting to read the "trials and tribulations of getting off the list." :-D
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Jotapay » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 15:47:51

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jupiters_release', '
')Have you not seen any of the articles about people who've legitimately tried for years to get off the airport harassment list with no luck or resolution? The TSA's "mistake" wouldn't matter if Seahorse didn't fly again, which is probably the best option giving the current state of affairs. Of course I'm sure he could fight the system and blog it here, it would be interesting to read the "trials and tribulations of getting off the list." :-D


Yes I have. Again, I agree. I would repeat what I wrote above, but it's already up there. Specifics, not broad generalities, will help here. I deal with this stuff all the time where I manage huge processes that always screw some individuals up, and there is always a specific reason for it.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby Koyaanisqatsi » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 16:40:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', 'I') hate to throw cold water on everyone, but I don't think the tinfoil hat and government conspiracy theories hold up here.

As I said, I should draw more hits than Seahorse in their databases, and I never get questioned at all. I believe some failed algorithm for handling these things, not intentional maliciousness, has put him on a "list", the kind which you obviously don't want to be on.

I love a good conspiracy theory as much as anyone else, but the evidence suggests otherwise in this case.


They don't have to single him out. The point is that there are a million people on the list, and so a subset of the population is harassed more or less at random. This scares everyone into submission, whether or not they've been targeted. But it's not because of "some failed algorithm" - it's deliberate.

Again, Step #6, Engage In Arbitrary Detention and Release.

That is in addition to Step #7, Target Key Individuals.
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Re: I'm on the List

Unread postby vision-master » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 17:30:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Koyaanisqatsi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', 'I') hate to throw cold water on everyone, but I don't think the tinfoil hat and government conspiracy theories hold up here.

As I said, I should draw more hits than Seahorse in their databases, and I never get questioned at all. I believe some failed algorithm for handling these things, not intentional maliciousness, has put him on a "list", the kind which you obviously don't want to be on.

I love a good conspiracy theory as much as anyone else, but the evidence suggests otherwise in this case.


They don't have to single him out. The point is that there are a million people on the list, and so a subset of the population is harassed more or less at random. This scares everyone into submission, whether or not they've been targeted. But it's not because of "some failed algorithm" - it's deliberate.

Again, Step #6, Engage In Arbitrary Detention and Release.

That is in addition to Step #7, Target Key Individuals.


Kinda like this symbol. :razz:
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