[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', 'W')e slow down to look at an accident, even though we are not happy that people may be injured. We just like seeing the cars all bent up. I don't know why that is interesting, but it is.

A life with no struggle and no suffering is dull and pointless for many people. The idea of being placed in life and death situations and forced to rely on your wits is refreshing for some who spend their days dealing with incredibly petty office or other work crap (which is the product of everyone else being bored as well).

I feel very bad for anyone who is injured or killed, and yet I find upheavel, chaos, shocks to the system and general disturbances to the herd to be very invigorating. It's like the danger taps into something primal that day to day life just doesn't reach. It's probably this impulse that makes many young people go into the military.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JPL', 'H')mmm.

I think about 10% of the people on this forum are actually going to take the information they've learned & do something with it.

The rest will eventually get bored & wander off. The 'modern way of life', as far as I can figure from some back-of-the-envelope calculations, has about 50 years to go before it collapses totally. Nuclear, wind, conservation will keep things going far longer than a lot of people here think. That's not even my opinion, that's just the way it's going to be.

But when the final collapse happens - it will be total. Every resource stretched out, & gone. Every last bit of uranium dragged out of the ground, every last high-score on the latest computer game, zero.

So what are you (or your children) going to do then? That's the real question. Even my guess of 50 years is too short a time to prepare for what our real future is going to hold - do YOU feel ready-enough yet (grin)?

JP

[Ludi]

I can't imagine a life so easy or boring that I would need chaos or devastation to make it interesting. Why would anyone put up with such a life?

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'I') can't imagine a life so easy or boring that I would need chaos or devastation to make it interesting. Why would anyone put up with such a life?

[OilMagnate-Not]

I admit to being freaked out by the possibility of hunting at night for venison, and farming by day to feed us in what will be a vacated region due to high fuel costs. Yet on the other hand I admit to being excited by the prospect of humankinds insults to the planet being reduced before we cause the extinction of all major mammals except ourselves. We will be reduced in numbers, but hopefully leopards will still thrive, and eagles will soar. We must remember we are not the only living creatures on this planet, so it's not ok to reduce this orb to desert, dust and dead oceans. Better there is such a thing as peak oil, because otherwise we would just keep guzzling the stuff and wreak the planet.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilMagnate-Not', 'I') admit to being freaked out by the possibility of hunting at night for venison, and farming by day to feed us in what will be a vacated region due to high fuel costs. Yet on the other hand I admit to being excited by the prospect of humankinds insults to the planet being reduced before we cause the extinction of all major mammals except ourselves. We will be reduced in numbers, but hopefully leopards will still thrive, and eagles will soar. We must remember we are not the only living creatures on this planet, so it's not ok to reduce this orb to desert, dust and dead oceans. Better there is such a thing as peak oil, because otherwise we would just keep guzzling the stuff and wreak the planet.

[FreakOil]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilMagnate-Not', 'I') admit to being freaked out by the possibility of hunting at night for venison, and farming by day to feed us in what will be a vacated region due to high fuel costs. Yet on the other hand I admit to being excited by the prospect of humankinds insults to the planet being reduced before we cause the extinction of all major mammals except ourselves. We will be reduced in numbers, but hopefully leopards will still thrive, and eagles will soar. We must remember we are not the only living creatures on this planet, so it's not ok to reduce this orb to desert, dust and dead oceans. Better there is such a thing as peak oil, because otherwise we would just keep guzzling the stuff and wreak the planet.

[RdSnt]

I would agree with you and only wish to add to the comment by pointing out a significant aspect of your statement that I wish everyone would get.
In the context of humanity and history and memory, we humans are the only "creatures" who care what occurs to the planet. Regardless of metaphysical arguements and "mother earth" love and what have you, the bottom lines is, the other animals don't care what happens. The Earth will just as contentedly circle the sun whether it is a lush garden or a burned out cinder. It will not miss us.
If more people would look at the problems pragmatically, ie: "we are shitting in our own nest", then perhaps we'd stand a chance of holding onto more of our civilization and humanity(the concept not the population).


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilMagnate-Not', 'I') admit to being freaked out by the possibility of hunting at night for venison, and farming by day to feed us in what will be a vacated region due to high fuel costs. Yet on the other hand I admit to being excited by the prospect of humankinds insults to the planet being reduced before we cause the extinction of all major mammals except ourselves. We will be reduced in numbers, but hopefully leopards will still thrive, and eagles will soar. We must remember we are not the only living creatures on this planet, so it's not ok to reduce this orb to desert, dust and dead oceans. Better there is such a thing as peak oil, because otherwise we would just keep guzzling the stuff and wreak the planet.

[TheTurtle]

OilMagnate-Not, I just want to welcome you to PO.com. It is refreshing to see a new member who understands the situation. There have been so many new people joining lately who seem to view peak oil as just a mere inconvenience in their wonderful journey of consumption that I have grown somewhat discouraged about the future of humanity.

Your recent post has reinvigorated me. Thank you.

[Revi]

Our situation will deteriorate, but I don't see collapse happening for a while yet. It will get progressively worse and worse. Here in the US it is starting as a relentless inflation for the things us little people buy, while the value of houses drops and we get paid less and less due to budget cuts and a slowdown in business.

A collapse would be so much more dramatic and fun than this.

This is going to really stink.

[Fredrik]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', ' ')The only concern I have is for people who are living in areas occupied by seriously dumb fu**ers, who will select themselves out of the gene pool, by reacting in a predictably retarded way to extreme stress.

Do I feel sorry for these people? Ummm....not really, because many of them are mean, as well as stupid. But I derive no glee from imagining them suffer, though I do think the world will be a better place without them.

A caveat here--I don't actually think that many people meet this criteria. A lot of people are simply dumbed down by popular culture and will be forced to change in an economically constrained environment.

I see poverty and involuntary constraints on spending as the only way out of the mess we're in. It gives me both hope and dread. That's almost dictionary definition of the term, "excitement."

[JPL]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '
')
JPL, am I mistaken, or has not your view darkened considerably over the past few years?

Can't say I blame you.

I suspect your 50-year timespan is on the long side, but I sure as hell hope you're right.

[RdSnt]

I tend towards the doom side myself, and my wife rolls her eyes at me when I start talking.
Your comment though regarding 50years before a more sustainable culture starts to roll is way overly optimistic. In order for our "civilization" to collapse that far that quickly it would have to do so in an extremely sudden manner. I'm not disputing that it will do so, but your suggestion that in 50 years things will have recovered enough to start putting things back together again is too hopeful.
With the type of collapse implied I would suggest that at a minimum 100 years will have to pass before any communities are stable again.

That's not to say there won't be pockets of stability, I certainly plan to be one of those, but they will be relying on historical knowledge and skills. My outlook is to become a repository of skills and memory from which new structures may grow. I won't be a part of that new grow though, I'm far too steeped in this world and my reflexes will always tend towards repeating what was. I can only hope to provide a safe haven from which something better might develop.
I tend to look at it as similar to the task of raising a child. The very best thing to do is as little as possible, but provide an undeniable sense of love and security.

[JPL]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RdSnt', 'I') tend towards the doom side myself, and my wife rolls her eyes at me when I start talking.
Your comment though regarding 50years before a more sustainable culture starts to roll is way overly optimistic. In order for our "civilization" to collapse that far that quickly it would have to do so in an extremely sudden manner. I'm not disputing that it will do so, but your suggestion that in 50 years things will have recovered enough to start putting things back together again is too hopeful.
With the type of collapse implied I would suggest that at a minimum 100 years will have to pass before any communities are stable again.

That's not to say there won't be pockets of stability, I certainly plan to be one of those, but they will be relying on historical knowledge and skills. My outlook is to become a repository of skills and memory from which new structures may grow. I won't be a part of that new grow though, I'm far too steeped in this world and my reflexes will always tend towards repeating what was. I can only hope to provide a safe haven from which something better might develop.
I tend to look at it as similar to the task of raising a child. The very best thing to do is as little as possible, but provide an undeniable sense of love and security.

[s0cks]

I get excited because I'm fed up of the daily grind. Driving to a pointless job with zero satisfaction, in mad rush-hour traffic. And I am forced to do this in today's society to live comfortably.

We didn't evolve as to sit in front of computer screens (I work in IT). The population is educated and brainwashed into this lifestyle and I hope a collapse of systems will at least spark some sort of change for the better.

I may not survive myself but its better then sitting on my arse doing nothing for 50 more years.

Its like a thunderstorm heading your way when your kid. Exciting!

[Ferretlover]

HHHmmm... Is it excitement or tension?

[xerces]

I'm not at all excited about a time that involves the misery and suffering of billions of people. Moreover, I have a lot invested in our current societal paradigm in terms of time and resources. I currently lead a semi-prosperous and happy lifestyle that I would like to maintain. The best bet is for us to transition gracefully into a lower energy state through gradual population reduction complemented by a less materialistic economic model(Neo-Feudal, Socialist, Mercantile) along with technological streamlining of our industrial base.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JPL', '
')And that, my friends, is what may well cause your 'die-off'. The concept that Peak Oil is somehow a problem that needs solving, rather than a solution that should be embraced.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('s0cks', 'I') get excited because I'm fed up of the daily grind. Driving to a pointless job with zero satisfaction, in mad rush-hour traffic. And I am forced to do this in today's society to live comfortably.

[TheTurtle]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JPL', 'T')his truth being, that there is nothing civilised, nothing nice about the way we are currently trashing the place. To some of us it already causes immense pain.

But like I said earlier, that 'some of us' figure is probably about 10% of the people here. The rest still treat the running-out of liquid fuels as fundamentally a 'bad' thing. They would rather fight the inevitable than face it.

And that, my friends, is what may well cause your 'die-off'. The concept that Peak Oil is somehow a problem that needs solving, rather than a solution that should be embraced.