[I_Like_Plants]

Olduvai Theory says "Modern Civilization, 1930-2030, R.I.P."

I still see nothing to convince me it isn't the best theory extent for forecasting the future whether near or far.

[return1880s]

I think losing our modern technology we take for granted will hurt more than having been born in the 1880s and never knowing how easy people have it now and thats slowly going away.

People used horses in the past, but did walk for shorter distances.
Not everyone grew their own food, some had other trades besides farming and made "real money" gold/silver coins. They then "spent" some of that to buy food. The farmers then spent the money to buy whatever didnt grow.

From what ive read, things will break down sometime in 2012. The internet may cease to exist as the depression and lack of cheap energy will wipe them out. This is one aspect to modern living that I will sorely miss. Information will never again be so easy to access anywhere, anytime. Information may not even be free! Most information today is free and any info that isnt free is only due to convinence of not having to search for hours to find bits and pieces.

Everyone agrees there will be a massive dieoff as nature and biology kick in. Earth's carrying capacity is a billion. There is enough land and resources in America for about 100 million humans. Those in third world countries will be the first to go and a very large percentage will starve or die from plagues.

I read threads and websites about "alternate, non fossil fuel" energy and none of those options are going to "save" us because there is only 2% of what we currently use. Can nearly 7 billion people survive alone on alternate energy? How will we grow enough food "peak food" and what about medicine for them all? Our current population is due to cheap oil but that won't be the case in a few years.

No one knows for sure how it will all unfold. Will that 2% of alternate energy go to the government? The rich? Towards police, fire, medics? How much could we be looking per gallon of ethanol/biofuel after peak oil? How much would a kilowatt of electricity cost?

[I_Like_Plants]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whereagles', 'W')e will live simpler lives,

[Pops]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'F')rom what ive read, things will break down sometime in 2012.

[Ludi]

You grew your own food and it was simpler than buying it? I wish that were true for me! And I don't even work a McJob!

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'E')arth's carrying capacity is a billion.

[return1880s]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'F')rom what ive read, things will break down sometime in 2012.

[TheTurtle]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'F')rom what ive read, things will break down sometime in 2012.

[return1880s]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'E')arth's carrying capacity is a billion.

[rider]

Electricity is what makes modern life what it is, if it goes it takes a lot away. There are plenty of places that will go without electric power way before 2012. Nicaragua is a prime candidate, 72 to 80 percent their electricity is produced by generators using either Diesel or Bunker Fuel. Right now there is a generation deficit that makes rolling blackouts part of daily life. Taiwan has donated generators, but by the time they are installed next year how much is the fuel going to cost. A lot of people on this planet are already living like if it were the 1880s, or even earlier. The Post Oil World is similar to flood water rising, if you look closely you can see the low-lying areas getting submerged already.

[MC2]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', '
')Everyone agrees there will be a massive dieoff as nature and biology kick in. Earth's carrying capacity is a billion.

[Pops]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheTurtle', '[')Hey, 2012? The date is December 21st, right?

(Or was it the 22nd? )

[I_Like_Plants]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'Y')ou grew your own food and it was simpler than buying it? I wish that were true for me! And I don't even work a McJob!

[KevO]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheTurtle', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'F')rom what ive read, things will break down sometime in 2012.

[TheTurtle]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'E')arth's carrying capacity is a billion.

[Starvid]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('return1880s', 'A')nd where are we going to get electricty?

[whereagles]

I don't think we'll necessarily need to grow our own food or wash our own clothes post-peak. I believe it is possible to sustainably produce enough energy to keep up the more important conveniences, such as mechanized agriculture and main domestic appliances. Transportation will definitely be a pain post-peak, though.

Of course, all this assumes humans will be able to cope with the situation rationally.. I agree that's a rather optimistic assumption.

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Starvid', '.')..Everyone who's lost connection with reality at least. No one has managed to explain why this dieoff is supposed to happen.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('I_Like_Plants', 'G')rew some, mostly gathered it,.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheTurtle', 'L')udi, some of us know that there are better ways than monocrop agriculture. The big question in my mind is how many people will figure that truth out soon enough. Pessimism in that regard doesn't constitute "death cult" membership, IMO.