[killJOY]

If you had read even a single book on evolution, you'd know it's NOT "known" as survival of the fittest, but "differential reproduction.

BTW here's your grandma

[Windmills]

A scientist's personal, emotional feelings are practically irrelevant in cases like this. Once new information is discovered and revealed, it no longer belongs to any one person, but rather to the entire scientific community and beyond. Darwin had no power to withdraw or refute anything once it had been established scientifically, no more than Oppenheimer could express his regrets and try to wish away the fact of nuclear weapons. It doesn't matter that you were critical in helping to create it; it exists now, and placing your unscientific spin on it won't make the Earth become flat again.

[shakespear1]

I also think that the issue is not whether evolution theory is true or false. The issue is whether someone understands the basics. Even understands what a THEORY IS !!!! It is the basics that allow one to move on to more complex issues.

I recall Bush Sr. and his "Thousand Points of Light" speech. It was more BS as the statistics seem to point out today. Education was a required issue but only to be talked about.

I was always amazed that education, something that has been done for so many years, is still something that needs all the changes that it has undergone over the years. DO we not know what works to educate the kids? Or is this all a scam?

That speech was a perfect metaphor for all the lies that come out of the Bush Sr. White House and those over the many years.

I would argue that by keeping the crowd ignorant makes it easier to rule.

[killJOY]

Gideon, great quiz, which I cant say Id score 19 on.

Got a link to the answers?

[Kingcoal]

The funny thing is that the figure of 28% is about the same as those with a college degree. What's also funny is that GWB, who has an MBA from an Ivy League school, doesn’t accept the theory of evolution.

I saw a little documentary where a guy went around a commencement ceremony talking to fresh grads and asking them what causes the seasons. Now I remember learning in grade school that the tilt of the earth's axis as it obits the sun causes the seasons - something like 5th or 6th grade when I was 12, so I got a big kick out of what I saw. Many of the grads questioned thought that seasons were caused by the elliptical shape of earth's orbit. Some others simply declined to answer. It just goes to show that you can lead a horse to water...

I think it has a lot to do with attitude. What most people don't understand is that science isn't a belief system. They sit there in class arrogantly and defiantly thinking to themselves: "that's what YOU believe." My father had that problem. He was a devout Methodist with a masters degree in structural engineering. I never saw eye to eye with him because I was 16 years old and accepted the theory of evolution and rejected a lot of what was being spouted off in church. I could never comprehend the way he rationalized his beliefs. He was a whiz at math and definitely knew how to design a building, but had problems when science reared its ugly head in his religious beliefs.

I think it has to do with comfort zone. People who cling to irrational beliefs do so because they feel good when they think about those beliefs and frightened when they think of something that challenges them. People like this are those you do not want in the critical path of an important decision making process. Their decisions have more to do with personal comfort than with what might be the most logical and rational path.

In other words, you don’t want a man like GWB in any critical decision making processes.

[jeezlouise]

This Vision.net "critique" offers no alternative theory as to the origins of man other than :

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')hilosophical Materialism totally rejects as "superstitious nonsense" the concept of a 'Creative Principle' or 'Universal Consciousness' over lighting the creation of the Universe in general or the evolution of life on Earth in particular, as this is totally at odds with the basic premise of that philosophy.

[killJOY]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') created the quiz on the fly.

[Chuckmak]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'I') think it has to do with comfort zone. People who cling to irrational beliefs do so because they feel good when they think about those beliefs and frightened when they think of something that challenges them. People like this are those you do not want in the critical path of an important decision making process. Their decisions have more to do with personal comfort than with what might be the most logical and rational path.

[frankthetank]

Gideon~

My wife has a bachelor degree from U of Wisconsin. I'll have to have her take it later I hope it was money well spent!

[Kingcoal]

LOL, Gideon, you get a gold star, OK?

‘Tilt’ is a relational term and it doesn’t take a genius to understand that I am talking about the rotational axis tilted in comparison to the plane of orbit. Is it a complete scientific treatise on the mechanics of Earth’s orbit and everything that affects it? No, from a layman’s standpoint, the grade school answer is sufficient.

If you just graduated from college and you can’t come close to giving a correct answer on something that is really common knowledge, then you are not what your degree implies. Would you hire someone with such huge gaps in their knowledge?

[green_achers]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')ry taking Gideon's Science Quiz . . .

[Chaparral]

^ regurgitated factoids are the building blocks for higher constructs.

The smart AND WISE will of course, constantly reconsider those factoids as time passes and adjust or even discard their constructs as neccessary.

[Tyler_JC]

Knowing a bunch of random science facts is hardly representative of "scientific literacy".

Rather than ask, "About how many genes are coded in the human genome? 2,500, 25,000, 250,000, or 2.5 million?"

In all honestly, someone can have a perfectly acceptable understanding of the concepts of genetics without knowing how many zeros to put after the 25...

Another one of the questions, "How did Avogadro arrive at his number?" Most people don't use complex chemical calculations in their daily lives, why should they need to know mole? However, most people probably understand that everything is made of trillions of very tiny atoms. Do they really need to understand the exact number of atoms per mole of iron? (6.022*10^23)<--AP Chem:)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avogadro_constant
--And the actual way that Avogadro came up with the number is very complex and is also completely useless information for all but a tiny group of scientists.

6. How many times greater in magnitude is a 7.0 earthquake relative to a 6.0 earthquake, on the Richter scale?

---Isn't knowing that a 7.0 is much stronger than a 6.0 enough to comprehend the concept of "powerful earthquake". Or instead of asking a pure math question like that, why not ask "explain earthquakes". People with science literacy will mention tectonic plates and not angry Gods.

I can understand Peak Oil without knowing the various names of the types of geological formations.

I'm reluctant to use "random science facts quiz" as a measure of scientific understanding.

But yeah, not knowing that the Earth revolves around the Sun makes you an idiot.

[basil_hayden]

OK I'll give it a shot and risk ridicule...LOL

1. RBC, but I'm sure there's long proteins out there
2. shouldn't that be inertia, not friction? I'll guess more.
3. ATCG
4. 4
5. 9.8m/s2
6. 10
7. N
8. no idea, sounds like functional equiv evolution
9. carefully?
10. 6
11. momentum
12. T
13. T cell
14. 2.5 mill
15. 12
16. C
17. Sugar
18. 100
19. 4 bill
20. none (wasn't java a hoax? maybe he was HS)
21. 60 mill

Too many dang biology Qs for this hydrogeologist...

[killJOY]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1'). RBC, but I'm sure there's long proteins out there
2. shouldn't that be inertia, not friction? I'll guess more. <b>more</b>
3. ATCG
4. 4 <b>I said "Alpha Centauri," and less than 5: Does that count?</b>
5. 9.8m/s2 <b>? not slightest idea</b>
6. 10
7. N
8. no idea, sounds like functional equiv evolution <b>convergent</b>
9. carefully? <b>in a rowboat</b>
10. 6
11. momentum
12. T <b>?not slightest idea</b>
13. T cell
14. 2.5 mill <b>25K</b>
15. 12
16. C
17. Sugar
18. 100
19. 4 bill
20. none (wasn't java a hoax? maybe he was HS) <b>neandertal</b>
21. 60 mill

[neocone]

The very fact the US still uses an outdated imperial measurement system dating back hundreds of years and not logical by any measures (5 inches 7/16th... WTF????!!!!) is the only proof we need of how uneducated the locals are.

The only way it measured up so far was by hand picking the best minds of the world and taking advantage of Europe's downfall through 2 World Wars + selling off eastern europe to the soviets to prevent any intellectual competition and brain drain the rest.

The education system here only cranks out consumers i.e Pavlov dogs trained to react to marketing.

Fat in that system is good i.e job security for health care and fast food chains and pill manufacturers and miracle diet marketeers.

Crime is good i.e job security for prison guards and lawyers and judges and clerks and gun manufacturers and civil suit lawyers etc...

Cars are good i.e pork spendings on freeways, big everything through mass consumption through being motorized.

etc...

All of this can only work through dumbing down people and glorifying athletes and movie stars and making scientists "asocial nerds" so no one takes science seriously, and while the superpower leveraging is good America can just buy off the minds abroad.

Not for long anymore... the Iraqi adventure is a nice proof!!!

[Dreamtwister]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tyler_JC', 'K')nowing a bunch of random science facts is hardly representative of "scientific literacy".

[Dreamtwister]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('neocone', 'T')he very fact the US still uses an outdated imperial measurement system dating back hundreds of years and not logical by any measures (5 inches 7/16th... WTF????!!!!) is the only proof we need of how uneducated the locals are.

[Windmills]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', 'F')inal appreciation of science is the understanding that evolution and God are not mutually exclusive.

[Tyler_JC]

The metric system has been partially integrated into the US education system.

All of my science classes talked about liters, grams, meters, and degrees centigrade. I don't recall every talking about "pounds or gallons of oxygen".

With regards to the American education system, we have to remember that there is a HUGE gulf between the average inner city school and the average school in an upper middle class suburb.

In the state of Massachusetts, 80% of high school students get their diploma within 4 years. But this number is statistical nonsense.

In the nicer suburbs, the graduation rate is over 95% and most of the students go on to get college degrees.

In urban districts, only about 60% of students actually end up with a high school diploma and few students go on to a 4-year college.

Naturally, if someone can't even finish high school, it seems highly unlikely that he or she will be able to understand genetics or global warming or Peak Oil or anything else of importance.

Perhaps we should require a GED before letting someone register to vote?