by TheTurtle » Sun 10 Dec 2006, 11:26:09
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PolestaR', 'I')'m sorry that you might think me calling you a cornucopian makes you believe you are like some others here. It is a scale and you certainly are near the end of it. However anyone who refuses to accept the reality that things might turn out really bad is living in denial. It is a dream you have that things will turn out in a way which will allow your current situation to keep you alive. I can't predict the future, nor can you. So I find it ridiculous that someone can tell me "xxx doesn't fit - even into my most pessimistic plans" , especially when "XXX" is the most respected plan for dealing with hordes.
See, as Ludi suggested, you really haven't read much of what she and I have written over the past couple of years.
To summarize
my basic TEOTWAWKI philosophy: I think life as we know it is doomed. I think we will go through the next 5 years with a gradual disintegration of the western lifestyle and then everything will collapse into total Mad Max chaos. I think there will be large-scale rape, murder and cannibalism within the coming decade. I am willing to admit that my time-frame may be off in either direction, but I have no doubt that dark ages are ahead of us within my lifetime (and, remember, I statistically have fewer decades ahead of me than I have already lived).
As for my opinion of retreats, I view them as little more than the survialist's chimera ... the place to make one's last stand. But hey, last stands are just that, you hold off the hordes and then you die.

My post-apocalypse reality is informed by the Indian Wars in 19th century United States. The Lakota had their retreats ... their "safe-havens". They would go there and they would set up camp and they would wake one morning to find their camp surrounded by the US Army who would then mow them down with Gatling guns. No, the Turtle Tribe will not flee to a retreat. The Turtle Tribe draws its inspiration from the Apache under Geronimo who, along with 35 warriors and over 100 non-combatants, kept most of the Mexican Army and over a quarter of US Army tied up for years. They did this by blending into the wilderness and living as nomadic hunter-gatherers.
My worst-case plan is for the Turtle Tribe to simply blend quietly into the wildnerness areas of southern Missouri and northern Arkansas, where we will live as nomadic hunter-gatherers (and I don't plan to wage war on anyone, so we should have it easier than Geronimo had it

). We have not yet reached the point where we can walk into the woods with nothing but the clothes we are wearing, but we are working in that direction.
I am also realistic enough to recognize that I and mine could just as easily be part of the massive die-off to come. There are no guarantees.
So please, just because I now spend my time on these boards suggesting that we should all treat each other nicely, don't think I can't see what is down the road. And please, don't call me a cornucopian ever again - I spit on both biofuels and fusion.
And I also think that Peak Oil is the least of the problems which lie ahead of us.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PolestaR', 'I') don't want to live in isolation, but I guess living with 20-30 people would be isolating to some. It's best to live that way until most people are dead I feel.
Hey! That's exactly how I feel.