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THE Bilderberg Thread (merged)

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THE Bilderberg Thread (merged)

Unread postby skiwi » Sun 08 May 2005, 10:32:34

Interesting doing a google news search and finding nary a mention in the mainstream news 8O

MEETING TO BE HELD IN POSH GERMAN RESORT HOTEL
European Bilderberg hunters have found the hiding place of this secretive cabal at a posh resort in this charming little city 40 miles from Munich. Their annual meeting is May 5-8...

BILDERBERG SCARED EUROPEAN NATIONALISM THROWING WRENCH IN PLANS
..A French referendum on the proposed EC May 29 has Bilderberg deeply concerned. The outcome is in doubt and defeat would be a severe blow to Bilderberg’s long-term effort to establish a globalist government...

..A German Bilderberg insider said the EC is in trouble for the same reason, he hopes, that the Free Trade Area of the Americas may fail: “outsourcing” of jobs...
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Unread postby EnemyCombatant » Mon 09 May 2005, 12:29:43

For those that are interested in learning more regarding the Bilderberg group.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/archive_bilderberg.html
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Unread postby EnemyCombatant » Mon 09 May 2005, 12:34:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')Today, America would be outraged if U.N. troops entered Los Angeles to restore order . Tomorrow they will be grateful! This is especially true if they were told that there were an outside threat from beyond, whether real or promulgated , that threatened our very existence. It is then that all peoples of the world will plead to deliver them from this evil. The one thing every man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario, individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted to them by the World Government."

Dr. Henry Kissinger, Bilderberger Conference, Evians, France, 1991
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Bilderbergers discuss energy scarcity

Unread postby venky » Thu 26 May 2005, 00:31:04

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Re ... tulin.html

I couldn't help but feel a sceptical on reading this piece. If this organization is as secret as the writer claims how could he describe their meeting this accurately.

On the other hand if there is any truth to this authors claims, I think his conclusion about an engineered recession or depression within two years is I think pretty reasonable.

Does anyone know anything regarding the Bilderberg group, verifiable stuff, I dont mean what you might have read on any conspiracy website.
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Unread postby skiwi » Thu 26 May 2005, 01:07:55

You could have searched for bilderberger and added to either of these two threads this month

http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic7719.html

http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic8206.html

Are you saying it's not secret. Maybe they really don't exist. After all
see how many mainstream news articles you can google for the month.
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Re: Bilderbergers discuss energy scarcity

Unread postby Tapas » Thu 26 May 2005, 01:19:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('venky', 'D')oes anyone know anything regarding the Bilderberg group, verifiable stuff, I dont mean what you might have read on any conspiracy website.


The Bilderberg Group does not have an official website. You have to glean most of the information about them by reading what other journalists and independent reporters have written.

Here is one such site that keeps a log of past Bilderberg Conferences.

http://www.bilderberg.org/bilder.htm

It is believed the future and direction of world policy and International affairs are discussed by members of this highly esteemed group. Members of the media who are granted the privilege of attending are sworn by secrecy from divulging the proceedings of these secret events.

In sharp contrast, the Council on Foreign Relations, the central think tank that shapes policy within the United States has an open public presence. Here is their website:

http://www.cfr.org/index.php

Lots of informative articles to be found here.
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Unread postby MicroHydro » Thu 26 May 2005, 02:50:37

www.fromthewilderness.com has an article today suggesting that "demand destruction" by raising interest rates won't work very well. There was only a 9.6% reduction in oil use 1980-1982 during a rather nasty high interest rate induced recession. Also, the twin deficits of the US pose a much higher risk of creating a full scale economic meltdown if high interest rate policies are followed. Better to just let inflation happen, people will conserve when oil is expensive.
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Unread postby Trab » Thu 26 May 2005, 11:05:46

The linked article at the top of the thread has some very interesting points about PO, what the Bilderbergers know, and what they may try to do about it:

While there has been some talk about a worldwide tax of some sort, here's the first I've heard about how and what they'll tax:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') much-discussed subject in 2005 at Rottach-Egern was the concept of imposing a direct UN tax on people worldwide through a direct tax on oil at the wellhead.




More proof that the majors know the score:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')ccording to sources, Bilderbergers estimate the extractable world's oil supply to be at a maximum of 35 years under current economic development and population. However, one of the representatives of an oil cartel remarked that we must factor into the equation, both the population explosion and economic growth and demand for oil in China and India. Under the revised conditions, there is apparently only enough oil to last for 20 years. No oil spells the end of the world's financial system.


That's oil to last, not years until peak, if I'm reading it right.

And, talk of demand destruction as a stop-gap measure to buy some time:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'C')onclusion: Expect a severe downturn in the world's economy over the next two years as Bilderbergers try to safeguard the remaining oil supply by taking money out of people's hands. In a recession or, at worst, a depression, the population will be forced to dramatically cut down their spending habits, thus ensuring a longer supply of oil to the world's rich as they try to figure out what to do.


Egads... 8O
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Unread postby Trab » Thu 26 May 2005, 11:11:27

Forgot one:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')nother Bilderberger asked about hydrogen alternative to the oil supply. The US government official agreed, gloomily, that hydrogen salvation to the world´s imminent energy crisis is a fantasy.
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Unread postby marko » Thu 26 May 2005, 11:53:12

I've read about the Bilderberg conference from enough sources (admittedly all online) to be convinced that the conference really exists. From what I understand, the Bilderberg organization, which maintains a small semi-nomadic office in the Netherlands, releases the list of attendees to the public. I seem to recall that either the organization releases a list of general topics discussed after the meeting, or that attendees are allowed to refer generally to the topics discussed, but they are forbidden to go into details and particularly forbidden to say who said what.

This allows enterprising investigators to find out in general terms what went on, especially since opinions will differ on what constitute details. I have not come across the source listed at the top of this thread, so I don't know how reliable he is and whether what he says is true.

I must say that I cannot imagine the Bush administration permitting a UN-imposed tax on oil. This would be diametrically opposed to everything they stand for. I am certain that this is a dead letter.

As for demand destruction by crashing the economy, this seems more plausible to me, despite this snippet from MicroHydro:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MicroHydro', 'w')ww.fromthewilderness.com has an article today suggesting that "demand destruction" by raising interest rates won't work very well. There was only a 9.6% reduction in oil use 1980-1982 during a rather nasty high interest rate induced recession. Also, the twin deficits of the US pose a much higher risk of creating a full scale economic meltdown if high interest rate policies are followed. Better to just let inflation happen, people will conserve when oil is expensive.


I must admit that I could not find the article he refers to on that website, so I will address his synopsis. According to this snippet, "demand destruction" by raising interest rates won't work well because high interest rates brought only a 9.6% reduction in oil use in the 1980-82 recession. Meanwhile, the twin deficits of the US pose a risk of an economic meltdown if interest rates are raised. This is both internally contradictory and badly reasoned.

If the goal is to destroy demand, then surely an economic meltdown would be the most effective way to do it. An economic meltdown did not happen in the early 80s because the finances of the US at that time were more generally sound.

I would argue that the US has a triple deficit: the current account deficit financed by foreign lending, the fiscal (federal budget) deficit, and a consumer spending deficit (spending above and beyond income financed by bubble-induced real estate appreciation). These three things are the only reason that the US economy is not already in a severe recession. The distortions and imbalances that have been allowed to grow under the triple deficits have further undermined the viability of the US economy. These imbalances guarantee that when a credit crisis or drop in demand in the US occurs (for example because of higher interest rates), there will be an economic meltdown that will probably be far worse, in the Americas and in East Asia, than the Great Depression of the 1930s. Actually a depression comparable to the 1930s would be a best-case scenario in my view.

Such a depression would result in a very substantial drop in demand for oil.

It would also facilitate the centralization of wealth in the hands of the superrich, who would be left standing as creditors and as the holders of most of the physical assets in the US. This would happen when millions of middle-class Americans are forced into default on their mortgages, when corporations go into bankruptcy and are liquidated, and when banks fail and their mortgage portfolios are distributed to creditors.

True, even the superrich would see a temporary drop in their income. But they have far more income than they need, and this would be a small price to pay for obtaining total control of what is still one of the richest countries in the world in terms of physical assets and a skilled labor force.
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Unread postby MicroHydro » Thu 26 May 2005, 12:33:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('marko', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MicroHydro', 'w')ww.fromthewilderness.com has an article today suggesting that "demand destruction" by raising interest rates won't work very well. There was only a 9.6% reduction in oil use 1980-1982 during a rather nasty high interest rate induced recession. Also, the twin deficits of the US pose a much higher risk of creating a full scale economic meltdown if high interest rate policies are followed. Better to just let inflation happen, people will conserve when oil is expensive.


I must admit that I could not find the article he refers to on that website.


Scroll down to Open shift to the Euro would further lock-in higher oil prices : http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/w ... es.shtml#1

There is a huge political risk in total economic meltdown, even for the rich. Nothing is more volatile than a mass of unemployed people with nothing to lose. Ironically, the lack of a political opposition in the US makes the situation worse. Replacing the corporate republican figurehead with a corporate democratic figurehead is unlikely to reassure anyone. Recall that non-voters are a near majority. People disillusioned with the system will gravitate towards nilism and anarchy. It is far from clear that the (very non-rich) police and military will be willing to use force against the former middle and working classes. The downside risk is French Revolutionary level violence. Recall the 1992 Rodney King riots, imagine the same all over America, including people who used to have good jobs and mortgages.
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Unread postby Trab » Thu 26 May 2005, 12:52:51

The Bilderbergers (for lack of a better name), do exist. Whether they exert the kind of control over world events that some journalists & authors claim is up for debate. The number of world leaders in politics & business that are attendees certainly mean that topics of discussion during the meetings will sooner or later end up in policy discussions.

The levels of secrecy about their actual discussions probably fuels a number of the conspiracy rumors that float around about them. Since we really don't know what they do talk about (it's all hearsay & rumor), people are free to reach conclusions that may or may not have anything to do with what really goes on.

I think it's safe to say that their meetings give birth to a number of talking points for many of the major issues on the planet today. Whether it's part of the central cabal of the NWO is another story. :)
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Unread postby venky » Thu 26 May 2005, 12:56:17

Could these people actually trigger a depression by raising interest rates? Whatever some people may think, there must be limits to the power of the Bilderbergers. There is no runaway inflation threatening the economy as in the 80's justifying such a hike. How will the Fed be able to justify such a hike?
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Unread postby Trab » Thu 26 May 2005, 13:02:08

I'm no expert, but I believe that by reducing the money supply (M1 or M3, one of those), they can effectively reduce American's ability to buy much of anything due to a lack of cash. This is more or less what happened in the Great Depression as I recall.

This will, of course, have major implications for everyday , middle and lower class Americans, but they people calling the shots aren't too worried about that, I think. When you're on the receiving end of the wealth re-distribution, depression can be a good thing... :(
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Unread postby frankthetank » Thu 26 May 2005, 14:14:51

They'll probably throw another law in the books making non payment of mortgage payments punishable by prison time/labor camp :)

I think interest rates are going up up up...The Fed knows that current rates of return are about zero when inflation is taken into account. People like a return on their money.
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Unread postby threadbear » Thu 26 May 2005, 14:45:30

I posted this article on Bilderbergers and supranational control in the open discussion section, in the thread Enemy Combatant, dis is for you.

I'll repost here. It's a valuable article even though it's on a pretty daffy looking website.

Jon Rappoport:
But now a host of problems is surfacing. The older fronts, who are suddenly inheriting the task of running the show while the seven cartels wrangle with each another and kiss and make up, these older fronts are themselves in trouble. The older groups, the ones which created the cartels, are themselves weakening.

The Bohemian Grove, for example, has so diluted its membership that it no longer can call itself a real secret government. Many lower level players can come to the summer meetings in California and play weird games in the forest. The NY-based Council on Foreign Relations has fallen into near-senility at times. Its summer 2000 meeting on terrorism degenerated into a goofy puerile exercise in “brainstorming”, with no real leadership handling things. The Bilderbergers as well are getting old. The men who formerly planned many planetary OPS are, more and more, spinning their wheels, handling lower-level business deals, and reminiscing about glories past

http://www.halexandria.org/dward341.htm
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Unread postby EnemyCombatant » Thu 26 May 2005, 15:03:35

Are the elites really loosing control? Perhaps this explains the mad dash to the finish line. These jokers are hard to figure.

There are pyramids within pyramids as far as the secret societies are concerned.

Regarding inflation, I just learned yesterday that the inflation figure excludes energy and food. You learn something new everyday I guess.
Now why didn't I take the blue pill.
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Unread postby zed » Fri 27 May 2005, 00:17:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnemyCombatant', '
')Regarding inflation, I just learned yesterday that the inflation figure excludes energy and food. You learn something new everyday I guess.


Everybody that uses the government figures should be aware of this. In my opinion, it means the inflation figures exclude reality.
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Unread postby linlithgowoil » Fri 27 May 2005, 05:00:25

why on earth would inflation exclude food and energy? can someone explain this to me? aren't these the most important items to consider inflation on, given that they are essentials - rather than plasticky things from china and dvd's?

i dont get it.
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Unread postby Trab » Fri 27 May 2005, 11:19:33

linlithgowoil,

My guess is that if those figures were included in calculations for inflation, it would be impossible for the US government to paint such rosy pictures of how the economy is doing. Even though people feel to pinch in terms of gas & heating oil prices, it's easy for them to spot is since the prices fluctuate wildly.

Food, on the other hand, increases slowly, for the most part. Many consumers won't notice that the cost of a vegetable has risen from, say, $.70 to $.78 per pound, to use a totally random example. That's an 11% rise in costs that most Americans would have no clue about.

No need to get everyone worked up, you know... bad for business. :)
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