[gg3]

The problem isn't Bill Gates' billions, it's Bob & Betty on the bread line.

Now this becomes a rather difficult issue from the libertarian perspective, because on one hand we want to see success rewarded, and we don't want Big Brother in the board room any more than in the bed room.

But on the other hand, empirically, income disparity is the single largest predictor of social unrest. When the Haves keep having more, and the Have-Nots keep having less, sooner or later the Have-Nots decide they've had enough, and then they have a revolution.

One way or another, we have to deal with this.

[The_Toecutter]

I agree with what gg3 said.


It becomes a much easier decision in cases where certain people make their billions off of cheating tapayers with corporate welfare schemes, making the arms used for killing people in illegal wars and lobbying for those wars, using immenent domain to unconstitutionally remove people of their property, damaging someone's property with their wastye products without compensation, or stalling those viable technologies that would aid in conservation.

[grink1tt3n]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TreebeardsUncle', 'L')ooks like another depression like that is on the way. However, more protective measures are in place now to prevent such extreme crashes as in 29. Also, the government is more inclined to spend itself out of a depression now than in the early 30's under Hoover.

G

[seldom_seen]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TreebeardsUncle', 'H')owever, more protective measures are in place now to prevent such extreme crashes as in 29.

[bshirt]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TreebeardsUncle', 'L')ooks like another depression like that is on the way. However, more protective measures are in place now to prevent such extreme crashes as in 29. Also, the government is more inclined to spend itself out of a depression now than in the early 30's under Hoover.

G

[aldente]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '
')... or stalling those viable technologies that would aid in conservation.

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hat makes you think that conservation is a good thing?

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TreebeardsUncle', 'L')ooks like another depression like that is on the way. However, more protective measures are in place now to prevent such extreme crashes as in 29. Also, the government is more inclined to spend itself out of a depression now than in the early 30's under Hoover.

G

[deMolay]

And threadbare like your Communist Ass Kissing Hero Trudeau said when the USA gets the sniffles Canada gets pneumonia...Better find your begging bowl...

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'A')nd threadbare like your Communist Ass Kissing Hero Trudeau said when the USA gets the sniffles Canada gets pneumonia...Better find your begging bowl...

[Polemic]

... And when economic depression brings our living standards and income down to par with Mexico, the "New Deal" will be the North American Union.

Canada Free Press: Welcome to the No-Man's Land of the 'North Americanist'

[Polemic]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Banff North American Forum documents state on more than one occasion of the need to narrow the gap between the average Mexican income and its northern neighbours and that this might be the single most important issue on the North American Agenda. The question is how will they do it? And how much will the average Canadian and American incomes suffer?

[gg3]

Beyond a certain level, economic disparity is also the greatest predictor of violent social unrest. The problem here is not with a few people being super-wealthy, it's with a large number being so poor that they have nothing to lose by going into revolt mode.

Thus the necessity for a homeopathic dose of socialism as a preventive measure: unemployment coverage, disability coverage, and even welfare, to assure a basic standard of living.

[Kingcoal]

The way I look at it, instead of looking at the 20 century as the norm, look at it as a temporary boom. It was a boom fueled by cheap oil. The world economy has always been a trickle down affair. The wealth produced by cheap oil trickled down to the masses and they obtained some status they never had before. Egalitarian ideas blossomed and made people feel as though progress had been made towards providing a minimum standard of living for all.

Peak oil seems to be pushing the world back to the norm for humanity, which is where most of the wealth is concentrated among the very few. Pick any time before the oil age and you'll find that the average person was little more than a peasant, owning nothing and completely at the mercy of the wealthy.

I'm not a complete doomer however. It should be interesting to see how much the technology we've developed during the 20th century will help us.

[gg3]

Egalitarian ideas also blossomed in 1776 and for a time thereafter.

What was different: lower population, more land, the ability of individuals to be self-supporting and even self-sufficient.

As population grows, liberty as well as equality takes a hit.

[Chaparral]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gg3', 'A')s population grows, liberty as well as equality takes a hit.

[emersonbiggins]

Beautiful quote below (emphasis mine). Nope, nothing to worry about, folks... Good times are a-here!
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ood Times, Bad Mood
What are Americans so grumpy about? Steve Chapman | June 28, 2007
Americans have many reasons for gloom. The war in Iraq has yet to turn around, we can't agree on a solution for illegal immigration, and Lindsay Lohan isn't cute anymore. We also have one reason to be happy: the economy. But right now, we're in the middle of a good funk, and we don't want to let any sunshine spoil it.
When it comes to the economy, the national mood is a combination of dissatisfaction and fear. A recent Gallup poll found that 66 percent of Americans think national economic conditions are "only fair" or "poor." And we remember the old proverb: It's always darkest just before it goes totally black. Fully 70 percent think the economy is getting worse, compared with 23 percent who discern signs of improvement.

In the midst of a recession, a depression or the Irish potato famine, our morose outlook would make sense. But at the moment, it seems to have no basis in reality.
Unemployment stands at 4.5 percent, down from the peak rate of 6.3 percent four years ago. The stock market is near record levels. Economic growth, which slowed in the first quarter, has since rebounded. Inflation is running below 3 percent. But to paraphrase the old country song, we've enjoyed as much of this as we can stand.

It's true that not all the economic news is golden. Some people are out of work or drowning in debt. Gas prices are painfully high. People who expected their home values to keep climbing, no matter what, are learning the definition of the term "bubble." Health care and college costs, however, seem permanently immune to the law of gravity.
But even in the best of times, some trends fall below average. Taken as a whole, the economy is plenty healthy. So why do we insist on seeing it as sickly?

One reason is that we've gotten so accustomed to prosperity that we take it for granted. From 1971 through 1997, the unemployment rate never once fell to the level we now enjoy. In the 1970s, annual inflation was frequently in double-digits. Recessions used to come along every four or five years, but since 1991, we've had only one downturn, a mild one back in 2001.
Another reason for the pessimism is that we mistake the few bad indicators for a broad trend. When gas prices soar, it's tempting to conclude that we're on the verge of economic turmoil so awful that we will soon be eating tree bark to stay alive. Never mind that other prices are reasonably stable, and that the national economy has absorbed higher fuel costs without too much strain.
In one sector where prices have been dropping, of course, the trend is taken as cause for panic: home sales. But what is bad for home sellers is good for home buyers. Most of us are both, which makes the whole phenomenon pretty much a wash.
...

[firestarter]

Chapman's article was on the editorial page of the Chicago Trib earlier in the week(he's long time member of the paper's editorial board). He's billed as a libertarian, and well he might be, but it is a libertarianism of the Chicago School, monetarist variety. Perhaps if he came out of his ivory tower bubble (and stop kissing up to his bought and paid for peers/shills at the paper) he'd be able to more accurately comment on the the real state of things economic. On the other hand, he can't bite the corporate hands that feed him, now can he

[seahorse]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut what is bad for home sellers is good for home buyers. Most of us are both, which makes the whole phenomenon pretty much a wash.

[coyote]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', 'L')ooking at "employment rate", seeing it's "low", and then concluding that the economy is doing great would be like an ER doc taking the pulse of a new arrival, determining it's 65, and concluding, "this man is healthy - doing great", notwithstanding the knife sticking out of his head.