[Narz]

I forget how stupid these threads get. Have fun with them Bill.

[TWilliam]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Narz', 'b')eyondveg is a little reactionary (to put it mildly), picking on easy targets & is as guilty of ideology as the most wet behind the ears new vegan. I know the site well.

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('billg', 'y')eah...things still die with a vegan diet...in fact i just stabbed a baby snake to death with a pitchfork a couple days ago

[2cher]

To finish this argument out... I am bigger, I am badder, and I will eat what I want and do what I want. If you want to eat nothing but straw, be my guest! You want to dictate what I eat or what I do? You ain't bad enough. So stop with your sad pathetic little guilt trips about the poor animals or some retarded notion that eating animals hurts the environment, because it doesn't. It is called the food chain, we are on top, they are beneath us. If other countries and the other 6.8 billion people want the same food, they can fight me for it.

The worlds population is to high anyway, it is time for governments to start making hard choices about population growth and start limiting births and the age it's citizens can attain. Get rid of social programs that allow life's failures to continue to survive. This means not only SS, Medicare, and welfare. It also means humanitarian aid to foreign countries. It also means emptying the prisons of violent offenders, child molester, and rapists by lining them up and executing them.

[Narz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('2cher', 'T')o finish this argument out... I am bigger, I am badder, and I will eat what I want and do what I want. If you want to eat nothing but straw, be my guest! You want to dictate what I eat or what I do? You ain't bad enough. So stop with your sad pathetic little guilt trips about the poor animals or some retarded notion that eating animals hurts the environment, because it doesn't. It is called the food chain, we are on top, they are beneath us. If other countries and the other 6.8 billion people want the same food, they can fight me for it.

The worlds population is to high anyway, it is time for governments to start making hard choices about population growth and start limiting births and the age it's citizens can attain. Get rid of social programs that allow life's failures to continue to survive. This means not only SS, Medicare, and welfare. It also means humanitarian aid to foreign countries. It also means emptying the prisons of violent offenders, child molester, and rapists by lining them up and executing them.

[2cher]

If that was your attempt at trying to get a rise out of me... forget about it, I don't swing deleted

[billg]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', '
')
Ever see a vegetarians' shopping cart at a Whole Foods Market? Full of packaged vegan crap. Preserved tofu in plastic. Boxes of frozen organic vegan entrees. Fancy pasteurized (dead) bottled fruit juices. Whole wheat crackers in plastic wrap. Petroleum every bit of it.

[Narz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('2cher', 'I')f that was your attempt at trying to get a rise out of me... forget about it, I don't swing retard

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'A')lso, if you dislike killing, mind me asking what are you doing with all those harmless plants that you are munching on? Who had ever said that its ok to kill plants but not ok to kill animals?

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('2cher', ' ')If other countries and the other 6.8 billion people want the same food, they can fight me for it.

[aldente]

Seriously, to quit eating and drinking all toghether is not a bad idea and probably the mandatory prescribed measure of the near future anyway.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inedia

[Katuhaukka]

Although the soybean is everywhere it's invisible, embedded in livestock and poultry products. Most of the world harvest ends up in such products as milk, eggs, cheese, chicken, ham, beef, and ice cream.

Meat eating has risen very fast during our life time on global scale.
Of course its because of population growth but also because our eating habits have changed. Daily meat eating has not been common in western society before our generation. It has largely been more like weekend habit.
It's easy to see why it has not been possible before the oil-age.
Would a village feed 10kg's of protein to get 1kg in exchange?
Not if they didn't have oil to run the machines.

It has not been daily habit in asian societies either and now its spreading just like the western way of oil consumerism in general.

Pork need to eat about ten times the bean protein so they can grow 1 kg meat protein.
That equals about 10kg's of soybeans to produce 1kg pork meat.

Meat industry's carbon dioxide emissions are about 18% of total world emissions. The methane emissions are harder to estimate but you can only guess.

What I find funny is that meat eating seems to be some kind of manly-man-ego habit for some.
Killing a cow doesn't sound very macho to me. And sausage? Gimme a break..

Personally I have been vegetarian for about 12 years and the arguments about beans based diet not giving enough nutrients is ridiculous.
Spices and cooking skills are what makes bean foods taste great.
I eat soybean foods maybe once in two months. I prefer adzuki ,kidney,and black eye beans.

from this link you can find table with meat consumption numbers kg per person per year http://www.worldwatch.org/node/1626

[billg]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')t's time for humanity to grow up...

[Pretorian]

So so far we have not heard even 1 ( one, Ohara, Neal, Emily ) argument for vegetarianism. Enviromental, Humanitarian (or whatever is for reducing suffering thing) and Health claims do not hold any water as I/we previously showed. None. So whats left there?

[dohboi]

aldente, here is a quote from the link you posted:

"Scientific basis

Nutrition science indicates that fasting for extended periods leads to starvation, dehydration, and eventual death. Carbohydrates, fats, and proteins are the body's only observed sources of energy.[2][3][4] In the absence of calorie intake, the body normally burns its own reserves of glycogen, body fat, and muscle. Breatharians claim that their bodies do not consume these reserves while fasting.[5]

Few breatharians have submitted themselves to medical testing; of those that have, none have undergone peer review with results independently reproduced. In a handful of documented cases, individuals attempting breatharian fasting have died.[6][7] Other studies of alleged breatharians have exposed them as frauds.[8]"

Nearly all of the posts, especially most anti-veg ones, on this thread are truly idiotic. Nearly all intelligent life seems to have exited this forum.

[Narz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'S')o so far we have not heard even 1 ( one, Ohara, Neal, Emily ) argument for vegetarianism. Enviromental, Humanitarian (or whatever is for reducing suffering thing) and Health claims do not hold any water as I/we previously showed. None. So whats left there?

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Narz', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'S')o so far we have not heard even 1 ( one, Ohara, Neal, Emily ) argument for vegetarianism. Enviromental, Humanitarian (or whatever is for reducing suffering thing) and Health claims do not hold any water as I/we previously showed. None. So whats left there?

[SeaGypsy]

As an ex vegan of 15 years I can say somethings about this.
Anyone who has lived in prime dairy country has seen how productive the same land is under different crops.
Prime dairy land is prime farm land full stop. In terms of nutritional value of yeild per acre; dairy is extremely inefficient by comparison to nut crops for instance.
Another issue is the speciesist one.
Here in Australia we have a lot of natives which are way more efficient and less damaging to the land than beef. Similar is true of latin America.
Why an adult mammal has to continue suckling at the breast beyond infancy is another question.

[billg]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')t's time for humanity to grow up...