[janeword]

If insurance companies are required to not fund abortions they should be

REQUIRED to fund all contraception.

Father's insurance should be REQUIRED to pay medical bills of childbirth.

NO CO-PAY required for birth control medicine or devices.

[AlexdeLarge]

[AlexdeLarge]

Your tax dollars at work. They did not read what the bill. They do not care what's in the bill. They are "literally" drunk with power.

Senator Max Baucus Drunk / Intoxicated on Senate Floor - Shouts Down Wicker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5Y9X5ggxzA

The buffoons have been invoking the name of their Patron Saint of Big government, the murdering drunk fat Ted kennedy, so much that maybe he came back from the beyond and possessed his body on the Senate floor. Like in the South Park Episode where they called back Biggie Smalls. Except now its Ted Kennedy, Ted kennedy, Ted Kennedy.

Time for a revolution......................

[smallpoxgirl]

As much as it pains me when this happens, I think Alex is basically right on the money with this one.

This is a power/money grab with absolutely no conceivable benefit to anyone's health.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'A')s much as it pains me when this happens, I think Alex is basically right on the money with this one.

This is a power/money grab with absolutely no conceivable benefit to anyone's health.

[rangerone314]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cloud9', 'A')lex, it never was about health care. It was and always has been about forcing all of us to enroll into the national insurance program. A lot of people are going to get rich. A lot of other people are going to go broke. If you want to find out who the winners are, look at the donor list for the Democratic Party.

[AlexdeLarge]

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', 'W')hen you go to vote in November, they should have the list of top donors published for each candidiate in the voting booth, so you can choose which industries you want to vote for.

Failing that, you could at least have a list of corporate logos next to the names when you vote. That would take up less space on a computer voting screen, and would add some nice color!

Voting does waste a lot of resources, though. It might be more efficient if we simply had the legal teams for corporations be Congressmen directly. Eliminate the middle man.

[DefiledEngine]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')As much as it pains me when this happens, I think Alex is basically right on the money with this one.

This is a power/money grab with absolutely no conceivable benefit to anyone's health.

[Cloud9]

Health care reform is a euphemism for mandatory health insurance that is designed to make all Americans buy insurance from those companies that support the Democratic Party.

This is no different than the King of England awarding the tea trade to one of his pals.

If you wanted healthcare for the poor, you would have expanded the existing free clinics and broken the AMA’s monopoly on medical schools. Flood the market with doctors and the price of medical care will plummet.

[AlexdeLarge]

Oh lighten up a little. The cartoons are funny and help drive home the point to our, not so literate, audience.

Here is one just for you!

[DefiledEngine]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')If you wanted healthcare for the poor, you would have expanded the existing free clinics and broken the AMA’s monopoly on medical schools. Flood the market with doctors and the price of medical care will plummet

[mattduke]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')fter laying the groundwork for a decisive vote this week on the Senate's health-care bill, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi suggested Monday that she might attempt to pass the measure without having members vote on it.

Instead, Pelosi (D-Calif.) would rely on a procedural sleight of hand: The House would vote on a more popular package of fixes to the Senate bill; under the House rule for that vote, passage would signify that lawmakers "deem" the health-care bill to be passed.

"It's more insider and process-oriented than most people want to know," the speaker said in a roundtable discussion with bloggers Monday. "But I like it," she said, "because people don't have to vote on the Senate bill."

[Sixstrings]

Pretty slimy, pretty hilarious, pretty much what Congress is all about.

They actually want to be able to say they did not vote for the Senate bill, lol. But the "deem and pass" is not unconstitutional (I'm surprised Karl Denninger has a post saying it is tickerforum). This is just language, you can say a bill is passed in many different ways. Voting to "deem a bill passed" is legally the same as voting to pass the bill.

What's a lot more unconstitutional is the modern practice of "presidential wars." Congress alone is supposed to declare war, not the President. Now what they do is go to war and then maybe get a congressional vote on it later.

[Tyler_JC]

So they are basically just making up the rules as they go. Lovely.

The first time I heard about this on the radio I thought they said, "Demon Pass"

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', ' ')Now what they do is go to war and then maybe get a congressional vote on it later.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', ' ')Now what they do is go to war and then maybe get a congressional vote on it later.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '
')But in practice, in your lifetime Ludi has Congress EVER refused to fund a presidential war? I sure can't recall one.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]1. This is a universal health care bill.

The bill is neither universal health care nor universal health insurance.

Per the CBO:

Total uninsured in 2019 with no bill: 54 million
Total uninsured in 2019 with Senate bill: 24 million (44%)


2. Insurance companies hate this bill

This bill is almost identical to the plan written by AHIP, the insurance company trade association, in 2009.
The original Senate Finance Committee bill was authored by a former Wellpoint VP. Since Congress released the first of its health care bills on October 30, 2009, health care stocks have risen 28.35%.


3. The bill will significantly bring down insurance premiums for most Americans.

The bill will not bring down premiums significantly, and certainly not the $2,500/year that the President promised.

Annual premiums in 2016, status quo / with bill:

Small group market, single: $7,800 / $7,800

Small group market, family: $19,300 / $19,200

Large Group market, single: $7,400 / $7,300

Large group market, family: $21,100 / $21,300

Individual market, single: $5,500 / $5,800*

Individual market, family: $13,100 / $15,200*


4. The bill will make health care affordable for middle class Americans.

The bill will impose a financial hardship on middle class Americans who will be forced to buy a product that they can’t afford to use.
A family of four making $66,370 will be forced to pay $5,243 per year for insurance. After basic necessities, this leaves them with $8,307 in discretionary income — out of which they would have to cover clothing, credit card and other debt, child care and education costs, in addition to $5,882 in annual out-of-pocket medical expenses for which families will be responsible.


5. This plan is similar to the Massachusetts plan, which makes health care affordable. Many Massachusetts residents forgo health care because they can’t afford it.

A 2009 study by the state of Massachusetts found that:

21% of residents forgo medical treatment because they can’t afford it, including 12% of children
18% have health insurance but can’t afford to use it


6. This bill provide health care to 31 million people who are currently uninsured.

This bill will mandate that millions of people who are currently uninsured must purchase insurance from private companies, or the IRS will collect up to 2% of their annual income in penalties. Some will be assisted with government subsidies.


7. You can keep the insurance you have if you like it.

The excise tax will result in employers switching to plans with higher co-pays and fewer covered services.
Older, less healthy employees with employer-based health care will be forced to pay much more in out-of-pocket expenses than they do now.


8. The “excise tax” will encourage employers to reduce the scope of health care benefits, and they will pass the savings on to employees in the form of higher wages.

There is insufficient evidence that employers pass savings from reduced benefits on to employees.


9. This bill employs nearly every cost control idea available to bring down costs.

This bill does not bring down costs and leaves out nearly every key cost control measure, including:
Public Option ($25-$110 billion)
Medicare buy-in
Drug reimportation ($19 billion)
Medicare drug price negotiation ($300 billion)
Shorter pathway to generic biologics ($71 billion)


10. The bill will require big companies like WalMart to provide insurance for their employees

The bill was written so that most WalMart employees will qualify for subsidies, and taxpayers will pick up a large portion of the cost of their coverage.


11. The bill “bends the cost curve” on health care.


The bill ignored proven ways to cut health care costs and still leaves 24 million people uninsured, all while slightly raising total annual costs by $234 million in 2019.

“Bends the cost curve” is a misleading and trivial claim, as the US would still spend far more for care than other advanced countries.

In 2009, health care costs were 17.3% of GDP.

Annual cost of health care in 2019, status quo: $4,670.6 billion (20.8% of GDP)

Annual cost of health care in 2019, Senate bill: $4,693.5 billion (20.9% of GDP)


12. The bill will provide immediate access to insurance for Americans who are uninsured because of a pre-existing condition.

Access to the “high risk pool” is limited and the pool is underfunded. It will cover few people, and will run out of money in 2011 or 2012
Only those who have been uninsured for more than six months will qualify for the high risk pool. Only 0.7% of those without insurance now will get coverage, and the CMS report estimates it will run out of funding by 2011 or 2012.


13. The bill prohibits dropping people in individual plans from coverage when they get sick.

The bill does not empower a regulatory body to keep people from being dropped when they’re sick.

There are already many states that have laws on the books prohibiting people from being dropped when they’re sick, but without an enforcement mechanism, there is little to hold the insurance companies in check.


14. The bill ensures consumers have access to an effective internal and external appeals process to challenge new insurance plan decisions.

The “internal appeals process” is in the hands of the insurance companies themselves, and the “external” one is up to each state.
Ensuring that consumers have access to “internal appeals” simply means the insurance companies have to review their own decisions. And it is the responsibility of each state to provide an “external appeals process,” as there is neither funding nor a regulatory mechanism for enforcement at the federal level.


15. This bill will stop insurance companies from hiking rates 30%-40% per year.

This bill does not limit insurance company rate hikes. Private insurers continue to be exempt from anti-trust laws, and are free to raise rates without fear of competition in many areas of the country.


16. When the bill passes, people will begin receiving benefits under this bill immediately

Most provisions in this bill, such as an end to the ban on pre-existing conditions for adults, do not take effect until 2014.
Six months from the date of passage, children could not be excluded from coverage due to pre-existing conditions, though insurance companies could charge more to cover them. Children would also be allowed to stay on their parents’ plans until age 26. There will be an elimination of lifetime coverage limits, a high risk pool for those who have been uninsured for more than 6 months, and community health centers will start receiving money.


17. The bill creates a pathway for single payer.

Bernie Sanders’ provision in the Senate bill does not start until 2017, and does not cover the Department of Labor, so no, it doesn’t create a pathway for single payer.

Obama told Dennis Kucinich that the Ohio Representative’s amendment is similar to Bernie Sanders’ provision in the Senate bill, and creates a pathway to single payer. Since the waiver does not start until 2017, and does not cover the Department of Labor, it is nearly impossible to see how it gets around the ERISA laws that stand in the way of any practical state single payer system.


18 The bill will end medical bankruptcy and provide all Americans with peace of mind.

Most people with medical bankruptcies already have insurance, and out-of-pocket expenses will continue to be a burden on the middle class.
In 2009, 1.5 million Americans declared bankruptcy
Of those, 62% were medically related
Three-quarters of those had health insurance
The Obama bill leaves 24 million without insurance
The maximum yearly out-of-pocket limit for a family will be $11,900 (PDF) on top of premiums
A family with serious medical problems that last for a few years could easily be financially crushed by medical costs.
http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2010/03/19/fact-sheet-the-truth-about-the-health-care-bill/

[heroineworshipper]

Still remember 1999 when just 1 more medicare tax increase was going to fix everything.