[IgnoranceIsBliss]

I need advice and fast.

My husband's father just called and wants to borrow $3,000 - $5,000 from us. WTF?

His dad is 65, and on social security. He has been a dentist all of his life. His wife is still working. They live in NJ. Awhile ago, we started getting calls looking for him from what sounded like bill collectors. I just spoke with another one yesterday. About 2 weeks ago, he told us he was going back to work as a dentist. He just opened a new practice (took over one where the other guy just died), and of course the cash flow is tricky. Billing insurance & waiting for them to pay doesn't cover the bills. He is only there 2.5 days a week now because of low patient volume.

What the heck do I do? We only have $5k in our bank account and we get paid in 2 weeks. Mind you, this puts us in a bind because we are on one income right now and it is LOW. We do have money in a stock account which my husband has been trading and making money on this summer. That money was actually given to us by my parents.

My husband is shocked that his dad has messed up this much, but mad at me for suggesting that we can't swing it. He also has 2 sisters and I don't know if my husband's father asked them for anything. (both make more than we do!!) It seems to me that we might never see this money paid back. My husband feels like he owes his dad because his dad gave him $5k back in 2002 to use as a down payment on a house.

HELP...

[kpeavey]

You and your family are the first priority. If you can't take care of yourself or are having trouble doing so, how can you help someone else?

If you are at a point where you can provide a loan, do it with the belief that you are not likely to recover that loan.

[Grautr]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('IgnoranceIsBliss', 'I') need advice and fast. My husband's father just called and wants to borrow $3,000 - $5,000 from us. WTF?
His dad is 65, and on social security. He has been a dentist all of his life. His wife is still working. --snip-- It seems to me that we might never see this money paid back. My husband feels like he owes his dad because his dad gave him $5k back in 2002 to use as a down payment on a house. HELP...

[IgnoranceIsBliss]

I also feel like the other two siblings should have to pony up as well. Maybe they are, I don't know. My husband is back on the phone with him right now to try to pry out some details.

We will take money out of our stock account I guess. (but that money was technically from my parents!!)

Man, this whole thing makes me want to puke. Both of our parents and his step parents are not well financially.

[perdition79]

I wouldn't lend them a dime. Period. If they have assets, they can sell those assets to kick the can a little further down the road. Lending sets a dangerous precedent, in that they will be back in the future for more, and the more they borrow from you, the more they will resent you.

Watching everything one has slip away is the only way one will learn to quit trying to live a fantasy.

[IgnoranceIsBliss]

At least my husband understands that this is a one time deal. We do not have any more money. Period.
I will be prepared for us to not get paid back.

Anyway, my husband says his dad and step-mom should absolutely sell their house and stuff. (they have a nice place in rural NJ) They do not need all that room and upkeep. (but the home would need major cleaning and repairs to be market ready)

I guess this is the wave of the future ~ first kids borrow from their parents and then your parents borrow from you!

Of course, this puts me in a weird spot. As my husband says, what would we do if it were your parents? (gulp) I guess this must be a last resort because he knows we don't make much with me staying home right now and my husband's teaching job.

[pup55]

I am probably closer to his age than I am to yours....

But you have to ask the question: How in the hell did this guy get to be a 65 year old dentist and not have $5K to show for it?

If he had some medical issues, accident, meltdown or some other natural cause, then that is one thing....

But if he liked fast cars, stripper wives that married and exploited him, addictions, and other bad habits that caused him to go through a career's worth of money, you have to say that no $5000 from you is going to help him, because he will certainly go through the next $5000 just as fast. It is quite likely to end up at the nearest casino, sitting on "red" , or elsewhere satisfying one of his other vices, if you are not careful.

You have to further ask the question: what difference will the $5000 make? If the terrible business conditions that cause him to only be working 2.5 days a week are still in place next week, which they will be, then you loaning him the $5K will do you no good at all.

You have to further ask the question: Why can't he get it someplace else? Banks will loan you some if you have some thing to show for it, particularly if you are fairly reputable.

Of course, a lot will depend on how you and the spouse share your finances, whether you both contribute to this little nest egg, and what the ownership is....

And you further have to ask the question: What is your capability to survive if one of you loses your job, and how will that be affected by you loaning out, and losing this $5000.

So I have to say, the preponderance of the existing evidence is, you should not touch this with a ten foot pole under any circumstances. How you tell the husband this is anyone's guess.....perhaps the fellow posters can give you this advice better than I, but I strongly suggest that you get his agreement. It may hurt his feelings, but he may very well have some common sense and know that you are right, and hoping that you will say "no" so that he can go back to dad and say "ignoranceisbliss says no".

Fifthly, or is it sixthly, you well know what the answer is, because if you are troubled enough about the question that you are asking people on the internet what you should do, you know deep down that the answer should be "no". If there was any doubt in your mind, the answer should be "no".

Your first responsibility is to yourselves. Tell him, "sorry, but we cannot do it."

[rangerone314]

I'd point out that with Medicaire & Social Security & other government services financed with debt, the old people are already borrowing from the next generation.

If he is in such dire straights, he should go to a bank and get a home equity line.

If something bad happens with your family, who do you get money from?

Your parents probably didn't give you money so you could give to your husband's parents.

[misterno]

how come a retired dentist need money? They should be flush in cash

[AlexdeLarge]

You can't lend what you don't have, so he should understand. You would think he could get a credit card with a 5K limit.

He is family, and if he is good to his word and you trust him, help if you can. I would assume he would do it for you. But only if you can afford it.

Times are getting tough, and will be getting tougher........family is sometimes the only thing you can count on.

[Niagara]

Never loan money to friends/family.

Instead of loaning $5000, give him $500 and say "this is a gift, but that's all you're getting from us"

[rangerone314]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Niagara', 'N')ever loan money to friends/family.

Instead of loaning $5000, give him $500 and say "this is a gift, but that's all you're getting from us"

[eXpat]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('perdition79', 'I') wouldn't lend them a dime. Period. If they have assets, they can sell those assets to kick the can a little further down the road. Lending sets a dangerous precedent, in that they will be back in the future for more, and the more they borrow from you, the more they will resent you.

Watching everything one has slip away is the only way one will learn to quit trying to live a fantasy.

[blukatzen]

As the previous writers have said in this thread, you shouldn't bankrupt your own finances to save anothers'. And again, sound advice was written when said the burden, if borrowing from family, should be spread amongst the 3 children. (however, the father may be close to only the son, and not want the other 2 daughters or their husbands/in-laws to know of this arrangement.)

This is a tough situation because good arguments can be made on both sides of the coin, the father gave them the money for the down-payment of an initial house purchase back in '02. But then again, the parents of the wife gave money to the couple to prosper their nest egg/finances and NOT to give to the other 'in-laws".

I will tell you something though, if he does not pay back the money to the wife, (since it's primarily her wealth/contributions that are being used) she has a right to be very angry, and that anger sometimes leads to divorce......something to think about.

I would only let parents "so far" into the marriage, as I've heard NUMEROUS times of family meddling into marriages and breaking the couples up, due to conflicting loyalties. Sometimes it's money, sometimes it's about how to raise the grandchildren, or hobbies, or whatever, but parents have got to learn to be responsible for themselves, because the wake caused in this financial wreckage could be, in the long run, greater than just the 5000.00. That will, in retrospect, be seen as tiddly-winks.

Think long and hard about all the REPERCUSSIONS about what could happen and plan before hand so there's no blind-sidings and hard regrets. The "would-have, could-have and should-have's" follow around the rest of your life sometimes. Despite all the "good intentions" in the beginning.

[Maddog78]

Agreed.
I loaned $1000 to a friend and his wife who were going through a rough spell about a dozen years ago.
They were very appreciative and said they would pay us back as soon as possible.
They initiated contact with us less and less over time. When we initiated contact they would become resentful, thinking we were getting together to press for repayment when in fact we never mentioned the loan ever. Contact became less and less and I've heard nothing from this couple in 5 years or so now.

Another guy used to come by and borrow $200 about once every month or so and then pay us back when he got paid.
This cycle went on for about a yr. and half. One time he didn't pay us back. When I saw him around town he would always look nervous and avoid me. Then all of a sudden about a yr. later he showed up and handed me $300. He had won some kind of pool or something in a bar and was paying off all his old debts. He never borrowed money from us again.

[Aaron]

If he's in debt and needs to make some payments, find out specifically what these debts are, then approach whoever this is to verify the debt.

Then decide...

The information itself will tell you what to do.

If it turns out he owes money because he borrowed money somewhere to pay for an orphan's heart surgery, you may feel differently than if you find out that Bambi at the local strip bar needed Double D implants.

I agree with Pup here... unless there are extraordinary circumstances involved, I can't see how $5,000 will make much difference either way.

[Quinny]

I thought he lent you $5000 when you needed it.

[hardtootell-2]

I have had a lot of this kind of problem in my life and it has usually turned out very badly. It seems that debtors simply can't remember borrowing the money! Amazing. Then you are the bad guy for asking for it back. Often the borrower has some hidden "problem" like drugs or gambling. I try not to enable destructive habits.

A very wise friend of mine had the same problem (money borrowing relatives) with her family. Here's what she does now-

If a friend or relative asks to borrow say $5K, she turns the loan request into a smaller gift, say 5-10% of the loan value, so $250-500, or less if she is having her own problems. It is a gift. There are no future strings attached. It is non negotiable. She has helped and can have a clear conscience. Emotionally its done. The recipient still has to come up with the rest but that is their problem.

I love this as a simple, economical and emotionally tidy solution

If the person is mad at you for this- then tell them to get lost.

[vision-master]

Judge Jew'd can help!

[frankthetank]

It would depend on if i liked him or not Make him sign something in writing. If he tries to weasel out of it, take him on "Judge Judy"... She'll set him straight. This would actually be perfect for that show Dress up sleazy, however...makes it more entertaining

My mother in law went on a spending spree then filed bankruptcy... Close to $100K written off... She is doing a lot better now, financially (not pissing money away like she did)...although she has no credit cards. If i did it over i'd go her route... She got a couple of nice trips to Mexico out of the deal.