[Ludi]

Here's the response I got on another board after posting about the Guardian PO article: "I will give the Guardian credit for briefly giving the opposing view. As usual for them, they sensationalize what they want, and let the rest linger at the end of the article.

Meanwhile, folks like you wishing to live out their Mad Max fantasies are all a tingle in their naughty bits...(not that I don't have my own Tina-Turner-in-a-cage-inspired fantasies..."

Hw do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact? Personally, it makes me want to cry....

[Licho]

They are right, many people do want it to happen. Maybe it's something from subconsciousness, I don't know, but it's pretty apparent..

You can only convince them with facts, if you are able to present indisputable facts, who cares what do you believe in?

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

I would respond that unlike some people I have a good grip of reality and know that Mad Max isn't actually realistic or possible. If all they can quote as a possible reality is a movie made fantasy shows they really don't have a good grip on either their own world or any possible one.

Yeah, its enough to make you cry or bang your head against the nearest solid object but it just shows they will reject out of hand instead of actually thinking through what things would be like.

[Nike62]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'H')w do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact?

[Ebyss]

Whether you want it to happen or not won't "make it happen". What you or anybody else "wants" is completely irrelevant. Either it will happen or it won't. Now, we all know PO will happen, basic geology tells us that. The real question of course is when and how.

So, fine.. if they don't want to believe just because you "want" it, then that's their prerogative. The best you can do against a situation like that is to link to relevent and factual articles, the less "mad max" the better (LATOC.net is not a good choice here, as great as that site is. Best let them stumble across that one themselves). Use quotes from the article, and when they get snotty, just ask them to provide factual data and analyses that show that your data is wrong.

[Ludi]

It's so frustrating, because all I want to do is inform people, but I just end up being the butt of insults.

[Ebyss]

Yup, I know that feeling alright. There's only so many times you can be insulted and fobbed off by people who clearly know nothing of what they speak, and yet they mouth off as though they know everything. Point is, these are people you don't know... it really, REALLY is not worth letting them get you down in anyway. Best simply to say your bit, provide facts and links, and just laugh off anyone who tries to insult you. In a few years they're gonna be saying "Peak Oil? Sure I heard about that ages ago"... the jokes on them when they realise just how unprepared they really are.

Besides, what do you expect from the masses? They believe it when Bush says "everythings gonna be just fine".

[TrueKaiser]

i have seen that allot of people here want a fast doomsday type crash to happen.
i personaly belive it's cause they can't stand their current lifestyle. they long for the so called simpler life but will be scared ****less if it comes true no matter how macho they apear on the board.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

See I disagree, I am sure there are things most of us hate about the current state of affairs and although there are many of us who fear the doomsday thing. I don't think so many of can be catagorized as doomers.

If that were true the planning forum would be empty because the consensus would be there is no point in planning since its the end anyway.

Yes, there seem to be a lot of "gun nuts" here but they too are working towards the future. They are just a wee mot more protective than the rest of us.

[killJOY]

What's the difference between wanting it to happen and not wanting it to happen? Nothing, because wishes don't matter.

Everyone's a psychoanalyst. It's sickening.

[MicroHydro]

Scientists (see Harrison Brown, James Bonner and John Weir in "The Next Hundred Years" published by Caltech in 1957) have been arguing for a gradual transition away from fossil fuels for half a century now. That is because we did NOT want an economic crash or population die off. Environmentalists started Earth Day 35 years ago with the same type of concerns. Even at this late date, we wish to mitigate the effects of declining oil production as much as possible.

Having said that, I must admit that I would prefer that the oil URR is 2T bbl rather than 4T bbl or more. Since the scientists and environmentalists have been ignored, a geological limitation on human oil burning is the only thing protecting this planet from a runaway greenhouse effect.

[Jack]

You could always adopt my approach. Nod, smile, and respond "You're absolutely right. I do. What's more, I expect to make a profit on the deal."

Then walk away, grinning.

If people wish to make provocative statements, they should expect responses in like vein.

[chargrove]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')ou could always adopt my approach. Nod, smile, and respond "You're absolutely right. I do. What's more, I expect to make a profit on the deal."

Then walk away, grinning.

[4StringSlinger]

Do I want global unrest, riots, etc? All of my life's work, dreams, hopes crushed???

Fuck no.

But if it's gotta happen [and I do think it is probable], then bring it. Let's get this shit over with...while I'm still young, strong, motivated, prepared.

[Kingcoal]

PO is a theory that states that we have found all the easy and cheap hydrocarbons and from now on hydrocarbon recovery will get more and more expensive. I don't get any cat calls when I explain PO that way because there is a lot of evidence to that effect.

The problem is that many on this site link PO to another theory; oil apocalypse. This is not a scientific theory because, like most apocalyptic ideas, it is based on static, unchanging conditions. It’s kind of like people of old wondering how they were going to stay warm when all the firewood was used up.

Without technology, we'd still be living in caves, etc. Technology has allowed humans to create conditions to increase population. We need technology more than ever when confronting PO.

Explain things that way and you'll look at worst like a pessimist. Go the apocalyptic route and you will be ridiculed as you should be.

[JoeW]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', '
')Explain things that way and you'll look at worst like a pessimist. Go the apocalyptic route and you will be ridiculed as you should be.

[OilyMon]

I agree,

Jumping to conclusions should be left to religious fundamentalists, not scientific prognostications. The more people lump peak oil into a religious fanatacism the less respect the theory will get.

[skiwi]

I think I'll go along more with this meaning of the word

The Meaning of the word Apocalypse from Webster's Dictionary:Main Entry: apoc·a·lypse Pronunciation: &-'pä-k&-"lips Function: noun Etymology: Middle English, revelation, Revelation, from Late Latin apocalypsis, from Greek apokalypsis, from apokalyptein to uncover, from apo- + kalyptein to cover -- Date: 13th century.


We are living in strange and interesting times friends! And many times the word apocalypse comes up in regards to "the end of the world" etc. But as you can see above the REAL meaning of the word is to "uncover," a "revelation," to REVEAL.

.... and more than just peak oil

[hoplite]

"The truth hurts"
--my father



"Peak Oilers", by and large seem to be a group of depressed, n'er do wells whom, for whatever reason have not succeeded (financially, personally, spiritually whatever) and feel they need a clean slate to make their mark. Total socio ecomic breakdown gives them that clean slate- or level playing field that they believe has been denied them...

[turkishguy]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')Peak Oilers", by and large seem to be a group of depressed, n'er do wells whom, for whatever reason have not succeeded (financially, personally, spiritually whatever) and feel they need a clean slate to make their mark. Total socio ecomic breakdown gives them that clean slate- or level playing field that they believe has been denied them...