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We got a shoutout from ABC News

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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby TheDude » Sat 16 May 2009, 01:14:45

Any chance of getting this on video?

The comments for the ABC story are pretty on-the-level so far, but for something more outré here's a link to those Nutty-nut-nut-nut-nut-nut-nuts at FreeRepublic.com.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')gree: the peak oil angle is stooopid liberal pipe dream to make us end our “obsession” with fossil fuels.


Agree! Image

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')overnment Motors closing 1100+ car dealerships. President and Speaker of the House using this “torture” BS to further diminish our national security, and ABC focuses on peak oil.


Agree! Image
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby wisconsin_cur » Sat 16 May 2009, 02:14:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', 'W')e are a planetary species, doomers cannot hope to survive for long or survive a life worth living unless they embrace that we are all one and that a species at war with itself is doomed.

I really no longer understand the doomer mindset, I did at one point, but believe my awareness has advanced to a state where it seems rather pointless.


Define planatary species and help me understand how your conception of doomerism makes life less worth living?

We have always been a species at war with itself. Has life never been worth living?

What does it mean to say that we are "one?" And how does a recognition that the planet cannot support our "one" if it numbers ~ 7 billion deny this fundamental unity that your articulate.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sat 16 May 2009, 03:00:42

Here's the link to the nightline segment:
http://abcnews.go.com/nightline

It's actually a pretty good piece for MSM. I think she came off very level-headed, and the piece struck me as respectful. Obviously, the changes she's made in her life have done her a lot of good healthwise.

Her comment about the $4 juice habit was funny. I find myself thinking that more and more, getting real stingy over things I used to buy without thinking.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Aaron » Sat 16 May 2009, 08:52:20

Image
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Aaron » Sat 16 May 2009, 09:23:33

Image

Doom! Doom I tells ya...

I'm Matt Savinar... & I approve this message.

Now is the time to invest in micro-solar equipment:!!!!!!

Don't forget your:

Image

You can't tell the genuinely concerned from the bat-shait-crazy loons without one!
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby mos6507 » Sat 16 May 2009, 10:37:38

RangerOne and Ayoob are famous for having their posts on network TV :)

I loved that she has square foot gardens. I can relate.

Seriously, I am going to show this segment to my family. I think it could be helpful in showing that this is a movement worthy of national interest. Of course, the next step would be the MSM actually digging into the science of peak oil rather than just presenting it as a human interest story, something like Crude by ABC (A for australia). We may have to wait for the next superspike for that.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby TheDude » Sat 16 May 2009, 11:00:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Aaron', 'Y')ou can't tell the genuinely concerned from the bat-shait-crazy loons without one!


:lol:

Image

Oh my God, the cows! THE COWS!

Eh, not as bad as I expected, but the whole thing probably registered to the general public in the opposite intended fashion. Who didn't get a little energy slaves tingle listening to her talk about huge parties, fun, trips abroad? Whereas now it's 4 mile walks and no juice, divorce, wood stoves, spartan decor.

Actually the most objectionable thing for me was how that girl pronounced "cauliflower." Spreek Engrish!
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby dinopello » Sat 16 May 2009, 11:16:27

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Aaron', 'N')ow is the time to invest in micro-solar equipment:!!!!!!


Does Matt or anyone sell a solar espresso maker ?

Image

That's what I'm talkin' about!
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 16 May 2009, 11:59:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')I really no longer understand the doomer mindset,



That seems evident, since you seem to think all doomers believe we should gun up and run off to isolated doomsteads and leave everyone else to their miserable fate. Not all doomers think that way.

But maybe I'm not understanding what you consider "the doomer mindset."

Maybe you can explain more about what you think "doomer" means.

If being a "doomer" means people get into square foot gardening, permaculture, and healthy living, I don't know what's the problem, actually....... 8O


<<<<<totally a doomer (my own definition, not yours)
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Aaron » Sat 16 May 2009, 12:06:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')I really no longer understand the doomer mindset,



That seems evident, since you seem to think all doomers believe we should gun up and run off to isolated doomsteads and leave everyone else to their miserable fate. Not all doomers think that way.

But maybe I'm not understanding what you consider "the doomer mindset."

Maybe you can explain more about what you think "doomer" means.

If being a "doomer" means people get into square foot gardening, permaculture, and healthy living, I don't know what's the problem, actually....... 8O


<<<<<totally a doomer (my own definition, not yours)


62% of dentists surveyed agree with you.

http://peakoil.com/modules.php?name=Surveys&op=results&pollID=233&mode=thread&order=1&thold=-1
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Sat 16 May 2009, 12:37:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dinopello', 'D')oes Matt or anyone sell a solar espresso maker ?


Not going to do you much good unless you live in Columbia or plan to make elm bark espresso. :P
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Stonemason » Sat 16 May 2009, 12:47:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('wisconsin_cur', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', 'W')e are a planetary species, doomers cannot hope to survive for long or survive a life worth living unless they embrace that we are all one and that a species at war with itself is doomed.

I really no longer understand the doomer mindset, I did at one point, but believe my awareness has advanced to a state where it seems rather pointless.


Define planatary species and help me understand how your conception of doomerism makes life less worth living?

We have always been a species at war with itself. Has life never been worth living?

What does it mean to say that we are "one?" And how does a recognition that the planet cannot support our "one" if it numbers ~ 7 billion deny this fundamental unity that your articulate.


The way we engage with each other is now planetary, in contrast to historical times when large groups of humans were unconnected in the sense that they didn't even know of the existance of the other groups.

Doomerism holds that each person goes out for himself. Life is symbiotic and emergent. If we weren't separating ourselves into nation states and basically doing nothing more than fighting with each other over the resources, we could instead work together to create abundance for everyone realising that one is only as healthy as the rest of his or her species. If people weren't in a survival fear mode of everyone else, human behaviour would change as a result, understanding that environmental conditioining creates a large part of human behaviour.

There is no proof that 7 Billion people cannot survive on the planet with advanced technology and education into the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the earth. Sure, the way we utilise technology for profit now notwithstanding.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Stonemason » Sat 16 May 2009, 12:53:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')I really no longer understand the doomer mindset,



That seems evident, since you seem to think all doomers believe we should gun up and run off to isolated doomsteads and leave everyone else to their miserable fate. Not all doomers think that way.

But maybe I'm not understanding what you consider "the doomer mindset."

Maybe you can explain more about what you think "doomer" means.

If being a "doomer" means people get into square foot gardening, permaculture, and healthy living, I don't know what's the problem, actually....... 8O


<<<<<totally a doomer (my own definition, not yours)



First off, Ludi, just like to mention that I always look forward to reading your posts in threads as I seem to enjoy them.

My concept of doomer was what you mentioned first, the idea that any one organism can survive without its community. All of things you mentioned are not part of the doomer mindset as I envision it, and I see nothing wrong with engaging in them. It's the thought that I articulated above that I don't understand.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby mos6507 » Sat 16 May 2009, 14:21:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')There is no proof that 7 Billion people cannot survive on the planet with advanced technology and education into the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the earth. Sure, the way we utilise technology for profit now notwithstanding.


There is plenty of proof that 7 billion people cannot survive on this planet based on current trendlines. If there is a way forward that avoids die-off, it will most certainly require the sort of universal participation in mitigation that humanity has never experienced before. The green movement and permaculture have been around long enough that if it were really going to take off, it would have already. I just don't see the rate of adoption accelerating enough to significantly alter the final outcome. Even if we are wildly successful in spreading the message, it is likely to still fall far short of the mark. Hope for the best, and by all means do your part, but prepare for the worst. I find the likelihood of a zero-die-off * scenario to be very remote.

* By die-off I mean death by war, disease, famine, etc..., not reduced birthrates due to family planning--in other words, the nasty sh*t.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby mos6507 » Sat 16 May 2009, 14:33:14

I think what most of us are looking for in MSM coverage like this is some sort of sign that doomer prepping is going mainstream, as it would certainly help blunt the crash in the end. Social movements tend to follow a pattern. I think this quote says it best:

"First they ignore you, then they mock you, then they fight you, then you win." M. Gandhi
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 16 May 2009, 15:10:21

]$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')There is no proof that 7 Billion people cannot survive on the planet with advanced technology and education into the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the earth.


Why would people who have education into the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the Earth find a population of 7 billion people helpful or useful? Why would you want to maintain such an enormous population? Personally, I think there's little evidence a population of 7 billion is sustainable, no matter how they live. Why would population reduction ("birth control") not be a part of a plan to mitigate the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the Earth? What do you mean by "advanced technology"?

Just curious about your thoughts on these points.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Ayoob » Sat 16 May 2009, 15:14:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Aaron', '[')img]http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/1041/poss.jpg[/img]


ooooooooOOOOOOOH SNAP!!!

How much of it did they put up?
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Stonemason » Sat 16 May 2009, 15:25:30

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos', 'T')here is plenty of proof that 7 billion people cannot survive on this planet based on current trendlines. If there is a way forward that avoids die-off, it will most certainly require the sort of universal participation in mitigation that humanity has never experienced before.


I agree.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'W')hy would people who have education into the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the Earth find a population of 7 billion people helpful or useful? Why would you want to maintain such an enormous population? Personally, I think there's little evidence a population of 7 billion is sustainable, no matter how they live. Why would population reduction ("birth control") not be a part of a plan to mitigate the problems of overshooting the carrying capacity of the Earth? What do you mean by "advanced technology"?

Just curious about your thoughts on these points.


They wouldn't find it useful, but would most likely use that knowledge to plan their actions, i.e. population reduction through planning as you mention.

Not even advanced technology, but methods of growing food such as aquaponics, cities being built in the oceans, etc. As Carl Sagan said, "imagination can take us to worlds that never existed, but without it we go nowhere."
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 16 May 2009, 15:29:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Stonemason', '
')Not even advanced technology, but methods of growing food such as aquaponics, cities being built in the oceans, etc. As Carl Sagan said, "imagination can take us to worlds that never existed, but without it we go nowhere."



Sorry, I still don't know what you mean by "advanced technology."

Why would you want to build cities in the ocean? What advantage would there be to such an undertaking? Not saying you shouldn't do it if you want to, just not sure why you would except for the "It's Keen!" factor. Sort of like cities in space, but slightly easier.
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Re: We got a shoutout from ABC News

Unread postby shortonoil » Sat 16 May 2009, 15:42:11

Stonemason said:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')y concept of doomer was what you mentioned first, the idea that any one organism can survive without its community. All of things you mentioned are not part of the doomer mindset as I envision it, and I see nothing wrong with engaging in them. It's the thought that I articulated above that I don't understand.


Saying in Africa, “a lone baboon is a dead baboon”. Its called complex culture, and its been well researched. Evolutionary physiology is the field to look at, Tooby and Cosmides in particular. Real Doomers don’t plan on living in a cave, they know that Homo erectus probably only had a life expectancy of about 18 years. Tooth decay was the #1 killer. Real Doomers hope that when modern civilization unravels, if they can position themselves just right before the collapse, they might increase their life span a little.

Real Doomers know that living in the woods is only going to work for those who were born part squirrel!




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