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Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby vision-master » Sun 08 Mar 2009, 09:51:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('POAlex', 'G')iven what television and the movies dictate, its no wonder.

Alex



Yeah, blame it on Show-Biz. :)

I'm an artist by profession and avocation, so it's hard for me to see myself as other than someone who makes stuff. I make some kind of stuff almost all the time, in various media. It's just what I do, for love and for money. If I became crippled and unable to make things, it would be very difficult for me. It's hard for me to just "be" without some project as a goal.


You sound like my Sister. She has had RA for over 15 years now and had to quit her business years ago.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Pretorian » Sun 08 Mar 2009, 10:11:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RonMN', '
')But anyhoo, my point was that it's well OVER HALF the people I know that seem to have a major malfunction of MY job sitch. Much more than 31%.



What happens is that these people considering you to be a part of what they are in their "social hierarchy". Having a friend/relative who is, say, a programmer makes them feel better about themselves over someone like them who has a blue-collar worker friend, let alone unemployed. A woman is more likely to put up to an ugly guy with a nice car than to an average guy with an ugly car, to an ugly guy who(says that he) has a nice job than to an average or even cute guy who says he is unemployed/cleaner/other low-ball profession, even if she knows she won't see any of them after 8 am tomorrow
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Ludi » Sun 08 Mar 2009, 12:36:53

That's so sad, VM. Has she found other things to do with her time that she finds rewarding?
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby vision-master » Sun 08 Mar 2009, 13:01:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'T')hat's so sad, VM. Has she found other things to do with her time that she finds rewarding?


Stained glass is her latest hobby.

That and keeping the new wood stove going. I don't know how she does it with RA and all.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Sixstrings » Sun 08 Mar 2009, 18:23:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')nd more than half the people I know can't deal with that fact.

This is accross the entire spectrum (friends, family, neighbors, ex-coworkers, etc.). Some "worry" about me while others think I'm plain stupid or lazy (I'd agree with lazy but after 25 years of working, I deserve a break) and some simply wont even talk to me any more.


You're a grown adult and don't need my advice, but I'll throw a word of caution in anyhow. It's very true that the longer a person is out of the regular workforce, for whatever reason, the harder the adjustment when they get back in.

Fact is, working for a boss man just plain sucks. Most folks who are working don't realize just how much it does suck until they get a taste of freedom. ;) So anyway, if you know you've got to get another 9-5 type job, better to do it sooner than later methinks.

I'm being a bit tongue in cheek here, but work really is important psychologically. This is a problem many freelance writers and artists have, where they just don't get enough social interaction working solo from home. There was a lady interviewed on CNN the other day, a successful writer, who got a job in retail just to be around people.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby WildRose » Mon 09 Mar 2009, 15:16:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '
')This is a problem many freelance writers and artists have, where they just don't get enough social interaction working solo from home. There was a lady interviewed on CNN the other day, a successful writer, who got a job in retail just to be around people.


I generally agree, although personality and individual circumstances are part of the equation, too. I work in a profession (30 years) that now requires me to work from a home office. I'll be transitioning to that over the next couple of months. Some of my colleagues have found it very difficult, as they become quite hermit-like and have to force themselves out for lunch with a friend, a movie, etc. just to be out with other people. For me, my life is so busy with family, a canine friend to walk daily, and several outside interests that I'll be juggling my work schedule at home with all of the other stuff. I really don't have a chance to get lonely! As you stated above, some people, when they decide to take on a second job, do something totally different to balance their needs.

I definitely agree that the longer a person is out of the work force, the harder it is to return. For some, this creates great anxiety; for others, the independence from being self-employed makes it hard to resume working for someone else.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Pops » Mon 09 Mar 2009, 17:06:28

What a silly thing to be depressed about.

"What do you do?" asks the guy at the next gas pump.

Do you say:
"I (insert occupation)."

Or do you say:
"I cuddle my kids, spoil my grandkids, hug my husband/wife, go to dinner twice a month with friends, pick a rose every day and never kick my dog."

Even if you do...


So when a pollster asks you the same question, how do you answer?


Don't you have anything else to be depressed about?
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Tyler_JC » Mon 09 Mar 2009, 22:52:50

What's wrong with being proud of one's career?

Professors, doctors, scientists, and even lawyers provide a valuable service that make our current wonderful lives possible.

Why shouldn't they be proud of and identify with, their careers?

People who are thrilled with their jobs are nearer to the top of the social hierarchy. They tend to have more education and are paid better.

The people who tend to hate work and despise their bosses are people near the bottom of the social hierarchy. They tend to have less education and lower salaries.

This isn't a new phenomenon. It's just life on planet earth.

If you want to move up, educate yourself and acquire useful skills that will put you in a stronger position to move up the ladder.

If you don't give a flying F*** about moving up, stop worrying about the ladder and escape the rat race.

Pops is clearly in the second camp. He appears to be quite satisfied with his life, I suggest following his lead if that's your thing.

Moreover, it's not just high salaries that lead to high identification with one's career. Teachers, firemen, and police officers are middle class but they are such respected members of their communities that the mention of their career always results in a positive reaction from others. I have no data on this, but I imagine that they are more proud than most of what they do for a living.

I would put soldiers in the same category as police officers but with an even stronger career identification based on the nature of military work.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby strider3700 » Tue 10 Mar 2009, 00:43:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tyler_JC', '
')Pops is clearly in the second camp. He appears to be quite satisfied with his life, I suggest following his lead if that's your thing.


If only it was that simple.
I originally was a programmer, then I became a software engineer then I managed programmers and software engineers. I was making 6 figures and spent time selling software for 100's of thousands that managed inventories worth 10's of millions to companies worth billions. I rubbed elbows with people that regularly show up in news stories about the oil industry and they listened to and respected my opinion on some aspects of their business. Then 5 months ago I became a stay at home dad. And I now spend my days changing diapers, cleaning the house and grocery shopping weekly. Both physically and emotionally this is the harder job, hell even mentally I find this more challenging in many ways(but not all) but I still have trouble defining myself as a stay at home dad.

When people ask what I'm up to these days I say "I'm a stay at home dad" but quickly add "I do the occasional contract when it's interesting though" which is only the slightest bit true. Really I've looked at one possible contract for about 15 minutes. I don't overly want it but I still insist on maybe taking it just because I have trouble letting that IT past go.

I'm far happier with my new career but as was pointed out elsewhere I get the feeling I'm being looked down on for having been successful enough and having made the right choices to get out of the old career. I do get the occasional envious comment but nowhere near as many as I used to get when I talked about being wined and dined by giant companies.

The only good news is that link with my old career is gradually wearing off. I'm starting to develop a reputation for knowing about growing vegetables on my street. This year I've had more requests for info on when to plant what then I have for what causing problems with my PC. Noone has asked me for parenting advice though. Of course I haven't been at it that long so I can't blame them. Hell I don't trust my own ideas on parenting sometimes. I do think I've got this home finances/budgetting thing going pretty good though. Never thought I'd grow up to be a coupon clipper when I was in university learning parallel programming and natural language processing.

Life is funny sometimes.
shame on us, doomed from the start
god have mercy on our dirty little hearts
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Sixstrings » Tue 10 Mar 2009, 01:57:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')'m far happier with my new career but as was pointed out elsewhere I get the feeling I'm being looked down on for having been successful enough and having made the right choices to get out of the old career.


Wow, that's pretty interesting. Even though you did so well at your previous career that you can AFFORD to be a stay at home dad, you pick up on others' slight disapproval. It's almost as if the rat race is an end in and of itself, and nobody really wants to see someone step away from it and try something different.

For my part, I've been a salesmen for most of my life. I'm pretty good at it. But for the most part, I've sold products that people did not *really* need, and nothing I ever *genuinely* believed in. Sales is a field of work that eats at you, it's so up and down. When your numbers are down, you feel worthless. When you're on fire, well, you're all that and a bag of chips.

But in the end, that kind of work has left me very jaded. I trust nothing that comes out of Big Business. I can smell BS from 100 miles away. Since there's so much BS out there, I really do wish I could just be more naive about the world -- I think I'd be happier.

The worst part of sales are those instances where you're really deceiving people. Withholding information that a neutral advisor would otherwise provide, that sort of thing. One thing I can say, I never outright lied. I never, ever, played those games of just pushing the contracts over to see if the customer would just sign it. (I always explained everything they were agreeing to)

What I did do though is use the force of my personality to persuade people to make decisions that were in my interest, not theres. But oh well, this is America, right? That's what they call capitalism.

Lately I've been thinking about a radical change, like maybe healthcare. I feel like I want to do something REAL for once. I don't care if it isn't glamorous. I'd like to *genuinely* help people, at times when they need it the most. Another thing that has me thinking in this direction is what we all know about the uncertain future. I'm not wealthy, and hold no advanced degrees (just a liberal arts AA).

So I don't really have a lot of options in an economy that looks to be falling apart more and more over a period of years. I figure healthcare will hold up the longest, one way or the other.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby Pops » Tue 10 Mar 2009, 15:24:44

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tyler_JC', 'P')ops is clearly in the second camp. He appears to be quite satisfied with his life, I suggest following his lead if that's your thing.


:lol:

Once again I didn't express my point well it seems.

If I "Do" x then that is how I identify myself - if my "job" is Ditch Digger then that is how I identify myself - how is that such a hard thing to understand?

Should I recite all the things I do with my wife and kids and dogs and gerbils and oh btw I dig ditches (am a high powered doctor or whatever) at the gas pump?


Why do I even reply to threads like this ...
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby scarly » Tue 10 Mar 2009, 16:37:29

I used to be a houskeeper, and people always assume you are stupid. It is great you can pretend your stupid, even though you might actually not be. My clients usually found out I didn't apply to thier stereotype. I loved housekeeping, it was a fullfilling job. You went in, cleaned someones house, and you think it must be nice to come home to a clean house. It was even more fullfilling when you were helping out an older couple, who couldn't do the work. But no one ever thinks about that kind of thing when they think of a housekeeper.
I now work in a different field due to economic reasons. It doesn't pay near the same and it should. It to me is an unappreciated job. I am a paraprofessional. Means I work with the handicapped. It too is a fullfilling job, but it seems it has the same stereotype. Of course I keep getting from my boss I need to go to school get a four year degree so I can be a case manager. I hated school, never liked someone telling me how to think.
I don't believe in a job saying who you are, don't get hung up on it. Truth is my job isn't me. What I enjoy doing on my own time, my hobbies, I consider that more of me. Cause it is a choice as to what I do as a hobbie. Jobs, hell careers come and go. Why make that a representation of you. It is just a source of paying necessary bills. Work is work go live your life and enjoy the time you got, it shouldn't matter what someone else thinks.
I like people no matter what they do, what is on the inside is really what matters.
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby vision-master » Tue 10 Mar 2009, 16:46:37

I was a janitor in the public shool system in my early 20's. Those old farts (janitors) taught me more than any school ever did. They always called teachers educated dummies. :lol:
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Re: Depressing poll about identity being defined by career

Postby katkinkate » Thu 12 Mar 2009, 06:22:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'D')epends on what kind of work you do. I never found fulfillment through work. The more I knew the worse I was treated.


Oh yeah! And the more work you managed to fit into your day the more they gave you. And everyone just took you for granted. Been there and left.
Kind regards, Katkinkate

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but the cultivation and perfection of human beings."
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