[Delphis]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Armageddon', 'I')t really is hard to believe the sheer magnitude and intricacy of the web of deceit, fraud and outright lies that has been carefully woven around us!

[ClassicSpiderman]

The big sticking point of the Amero would be the natural anti-Americanism of the people in Canada and Mexico. They'd perceive this as US encroachment into their interests.

That's why I don't see it happening. Another monkey wrench is the 2nd amendment in the US. How will the social democrats of Canada/Mexico react when they are part of one North American country?

The trend lately has been to make movement and trade harder between the Canada/US. Canadians used to be able to go to the US with just a simple photo identification (such as a driver's license). Now, a passport is required.

The US congress has just voted down a modest project plan to allow about 100 Mexican trucks onto US highways and a border fence is being erected on the southern US border. These of course are political pressures put in place by angry constituents who want to cut off immigration (illegal and otherwise).

The bright side of a North American Union (at least for me) is that as soon as it takes effect, I'm going to Montana and buying several stockpiles of firearms.

[vision-master]

I mean, how would this play out?

Just enter the new currency with a rate of exchange for old dollars?

Of course Canada and Mexico would be part of the North American Union beforehand right?

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'I') mean, how would this play out?

Just enter the new currency with a rate of exchange for old dollars?

[mos6507]

I'm totally fine with the NAU, as long as it is something the american people really want. It's the idea that this would happen outside of normal due process that freaks me out.

[Delphis]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'I')'m totally fine with the NAU, as long as it is something the american people really want. It's the idea that this would happen outside of normal due process that freaks me out.

[gollum]

I guess my question is how will the dollar rate in exchange for decent quality toilet paper 5 years from now?

[EnergyUnlimited]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Armageddon', 'B')ut the main reason most people refuse to believe that a conspiracy even exists, is that we have all been brainwashed into believing that such a thing could never happen!

[LID]

As much as I used to hate them, I'm kind of fond of the ol loonie. At least vs. the alternative.

[mattduke]

The Amero has value only if you accept it.

[Starvid]

This Amero stuff is really extremely silly.

[The_Virginian]

Why is it any more silly than currency printed up in case of Nuclear war?

It may not exist YET, but trial balloons shot down one day, have a tendency to become policy the next.


IMHO it would SAVE the "american" way of life if they could sucker Brazil and Colombia into it.

It's not like we have a "real" dollar in any case...

[mmasters]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'I') mean, how would this play out?

Just enter the new currency with a rate of exchange for old dollars?

Of course Canada and Mexico would be part of the North American Union beforehand right?

[ClassicSpiderman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnergyUnlimited', 'D')on't you observe that influence of international law/international organizations is rather falling apart, not increasing?

You would need maybe 2 or 3 more generations enjoying exponential economic growth to get that NWO.

[Starvid]

It doesn't really make any sense.

The upside of a currency union is that it makes trade easier and cheaper.

The downside is that you can't set your own interest rate anymore.

The upside is only greater than the downside when inflation and unemployment are tightly coupled in the nations in the currency union and this only happens when the members of the union are on pretty much the same economic level and have their economies structured in pretty much the same way.

We have big problems with this in Europe (Germany and Nordics vs. Club Med and Ireland for example) so you can just imagine how disastrous it would be in the Americas.*

Sure, the US and Canada might work, but the US economy would dominate so completely the Canadians wouldn't be interested in joining.

We don't have that problem at all in Europe as no country, not even Germany, has such a hugely bigger economy than the rest of the pack.

Look at how close the non-Euro European interest rates are to the ECB rate, and the compare the US rates to those of Mexico, Brazil etc...

[Nickel]

There's no way we would agree to a currency union with the United States, let alone Mexico. The US dollar is the most over-extended, overvalued currency in the world, and once the keystone is finally pulled and the reserves in central banks around the world start to melt and flood back home, just how over-extended is going to terrifyingly obvious. It's going to be bad times for Canada no matter what, but the one saving grace is that we DO have a separate currency, we CAN set our own interest rates and offer bond issues in our own currency, and we DO have the ability to tailor our own economy to the needs specific to Canada as a result. If North America were a collection of a dozen smaller, similarly-sized and populated countries, with no one of them completely overawing, then something like an "amero" might fly. But that's not the North America we're living in.

Tighter integration with the United States right now would be suicide. We didn't merge our currency with the US dollar even when ours was worth only 62¢ US, so why would we do it now? Why would we volunteer to plug our life's blood into a bloated body on the verge of a five-alarm coronary?

When the US straightens out its economic fundamentals, steps down from trying to micromanage the universe at home and abroad, and is no longer a financial fire trap, maybe then something can be worked out. But it's not going to happen anytime soon, that's for sure.

[Nickel]

This, in fact, seems the be the direction in which we're heading now...

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'C')anada-EU trade proposal rivals scope of NAFTA
Plan to lift barriers for goods and labour to be discussed at summit after election

The Globe and Mail
September 18, 2008 at 2:00 AM EDT

LONDON — Canadian and European officials say they plan to begin negotiating a massive agreement to integrate Canada's economy with the 27 nations of the European Union, with preliminary talks to be launched at an Oct. 17 summit in Montreal three days after the federal election.

Trade Minister Michael Fortier and his staff have been engaged for the past two months with EU Trade Commissioner Peter Mandelson and the representatives of European governments in an effort to begin what a senior EU official involved in the talks described in an interview yesterday as “deep economic integration negotiations.”

If successful, Canada would be the first developed nation to have open trade relations with the EU, which has completely open borders between its members but imposes steep trade and investment barriers on outsiders.

The proposed pact would far exceed the scope of older agreements such as NAFTA by encompassing not only unrestricted trade in goods, services and investment and the removal of tariffs, but also the free movement of skilled people and an open market in government services and procurement – which would require that Canadian governments allow European companies to bid as equals on government contracts for both goods and services and end the favouring of local or national providers of public-sector services.

Previous efforts to reach a trade pact with Europe have failed, most recently in 2005 with the collapse of the proposed Trade and Investment Enhancement Agreement.

But with the breakdown of World Trade Organization talks in July, European officials have become much more interested in opening a bilateral trade and economic integration deal with North America.

A pact with the United States would be politically impossible in Europe, senior European Commission officials said.

A newly completed study of the proposed deal, which European officials said Prime Minister Stephen Harper decided not to release until after the election, concludes that the pact would increase bilateral trade and investment by at least $40-billion a year, mainly in trade in services.

Ottawa officials say they have overcome what they see as their biggest hurdle: the resistance of provincial governments to an agreement that would force them to allow European corporations to provide their government services, if their bids are the lowest.

Although Ottawa's current list of foreign-policy priorities does not include European issues, European and Canadian officials say Mr. Harper has been heavily engaged with the proposed trade pact.

The two governments have completed a detailed study of the proposed agreement that will be unveiled shortly after the election, should the Conservatives win.

Both Ottawa and Brussels have had staff work on a draft text for a deal they had hoped would be introduced at a Canada-EU summit, to be attended by French President Nicolas Sarkozy, European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso and Mr. Harper in Montreal on Oct. 17. France currently holds the rotating presidency of the EU, and Mr. Sarkozy has said that he hopes to make economic integration with Canada one of his accomplishments.

Last Wednesday, a top Ottawa trade official wrote to Mr. Mandelson to propose “the launch of comprehensive negotiations toward a closer economic partnership at the Canada-EU Leaders Summit, to be held on October 17,” and stressed that all 13 provincial and territorial governments had agreed to the proposed pact at a July 18 meeting in Quebec City.

Because of the election, Mr. Harper appears to have decided not to unveil a full text of the proposed agreement, but instead to use the summit to inaugurate the trade talks with the launch of a “scoping exercise” that will quickly set the goals of the pact and lead to formal “comprehensive trade and investment negotiations” to begin in “early 2009,” according to communications between senior Canadian and European officials examined by The Globe and Mail.

Proponents, including all of Canada's major business-lobby organizations, are in favour of the deal because it would open Canadian exporters to a market of 500 million people and allow the world's largest pool of investment capital into Canadian companies without restrictions.

Because Canada's fractious provinces have killed attempts at a trade pact in the past, Europe is demanding that Canada accept a more far-reaching agreement than Canada and Europe had attempted before, in an effort to win a stronger commitment, EU officials said.

Major “deal-breaker” conditions, officials said, include full agreement by all 10 provinces, especially on the issue of European companies providing government services, and what are known as “geographic indicators,” which forbid products such as champagne and feta cheese to be produced under those names outside their nations of origin. Controversially for Canada, this may soon be extended so only English producers can use the name cheddar on their cheese.

However, both sides agree that there is far more political will to negotiate a major deal, on both sides than there ever has been.

“I am far more optimistic this time than I've ever been in the past. … I feel very confident that we will be able to launch something on Oct. 17 that will give us a better chance than we've ever had before to get a full deal in place,” said Roy MacLaren, head of the Canada-Europe Round Table, a pro-trade business organization that has been heavily involved in the negotiations.

As a trade minister in the Jean Chretien government and later as a diplomat, Mr. MacLaren was involved in several previous attempts at a Canada-EU pact.

[Typo]

I don't think the Amero will happen because the name sounds completely retarded. Come up with a better one and then maybe I'll approve it.

[EnergyUnlimited]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Nickel', 'T')here's no way we would agree to a currency union with the United States, let alone Mexico.

[EnergyUnlimited]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Typo', 'I') don't think the Amero will happen because the name sounds completely retarded. Come up with a better one and then maybe I'll approve it.