[mistel]

There seems to be a lot of DOOM and GLOOM on this site. While I believe Peak Oil is a fact, I doubt we are going to have raging mobs, a la MAD MAX. I'm no expert but it seems to me that while there was an increase in crime during the GD, society did not break down, and the crime was more prohabition related.
For instance, I have been thinking about what would be a good PO business. I have construction experiance and I was thinking I would start building zero energy homes (after I build one for myself). I have also seen a small bio-diesel processor that produces 1200 gallons a day at a cost of 60 cent/gallon. Ok, it cost $130,000 but if you sell your diesel for $1.60/gallon, you could make your money back in approx 110 days and stand to profit $1200 per day afterwards, not bad at all. I also have been looking into putting up a wind generator that would produce more than I use, and sell the rest back to the utility. Problem is, my utility, Ontario Hydro, makes it very difficult to sell power back to them. I expect this will change.
My point is, I think there are many people like me out there, and when oil breaks $100 BBL, there is going to be a flood of alternative energy hitting the market. No doubt it will be a rough ride, but I won't be heading for the hills yet (but I might keep a map handy)

[Specop_007]

More info on this home based diesel maker?

[jato]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')here seems to be a lot of DOOM and GLOOM on this site. While I believe Peak Oil is a fact, I doubt we are going to have raging mobs, a la MAD MAX. I'm no expert but it seems to me that while there was an increase in crime during the GD, society did not break down, and the crime was more prohabition related.

[TrueKaiser]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mistel', 'T')here seems to be a lot of DOOM and GLOOM on this site. While I believe Peak Oil is a fact, I doubt we are going to have raging mobs, a la MAD MAX. I'm no expert but it seems to me that while there was an increase in crime during the GD, society did not break down, and the crime was more prohabition related.
For instance, I have been thinking about what would be a good PO business. I have construction experiance and I was thinking I would start building zero energy homes (after I build one for myself). I have also seen a small bio-diesel processor that produces 1200 gallons a day at a cost of 60 cent/gallon. Ok, it cost $130,000 but if you sell your diesel for $1.60/gallon, you could make your money back in approx 110 days and stand to profit $1200 per day afterwards, not bad at all. I also have been looking into putting up a wind generator that would produce more than I use, and sell the rest back to the utility. Problem is, my utility, Ontario Hydro, makes it very difficult to sell power back to them. I expect this will change.
My point is, I think there are many people like me out there, and when oil breaks $100 BBL, there is going to be a flood of alternative energy hitting the market. No doubt it will be a rough ride, but I won't be heading for the hills yet (but I might keep a map handy)

[PenultimateManStanding]

I hope you are right TK. We don't really know however and this could turn out to be a ride straight down to the bottom for all we know.

[savethehumans]

Um....may I refer all you nice people to the Current Events Board, and the Panic is starting thread? Read some of the reactions to the mere news that gasoline has passed the $2 mark, and is climbing ever higher.

THEN come back and tell me that this nation's gonna get through this just fine....

[Chocky]

Of course it's not the end, yet. Sure it will happen eventually, but people are just terrible at accurately predicting events like that. Everyone who predicts an imminent catastrophe is going to look pretty silly when we're all still posting on this board in five year's time. Probably

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'i')n other words at least expect a lot more waco's and ruby ridge incidents to happen.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mistel', ' ')I have also seen a small bio-diesel processor that produces 1200 gallons a day at a cost of 60 cent/gallon. Ok, it cost $130,000 but if you sell your diesel for $1.60/gallon, you could make your money back in approx 110 days and stand to profit $1200 per day afterwards, not bad at all.

[sparkylab]

While I have been quite shaken recently about the rising awareness of PO (ie the politicians are starting to talk about it) and the quickening of events (it would seem) I'm not so sure either. Maybe I'm just thinking wishfully, but to me the american public will not connect the dots just yet . As for the gas prices canary - in CA and San Diego in particular - things have been well over $2 for several years now - people bitch and moan a lot but IMO they have gotten used to it. Unless a real instantaneous shock happens(house of saud falls etc) I think (hope?) the boiling frog metaphor will remain apt - at least in the short term.

[NevadaGhosts]

mistel,

Do more research before making such statements.

I suggest reading the following books:

The Party's Over: Oil, War and the Fate of Industrial Societies

Powerdown : Options and Actions for a Post-Carbon World

Oil Age is Over and End of Suburbia DVD

[PenultimateManStanding]

Hi sparkylab. Trespam, Jato, and I say hello. America's finest city.

[mistel]

Bio diesel info here http://www.olympiagreenfuels.com/

[mistel]

NevadaGhosts

I have read plenty, I went out and bought a copy of "the end of suburbia" after I saw it so I can give it to my local politician. I also read "the doomsday myth" which refutes PO or any shortages causing the end of civilization. In Denmark during WWII there was no oil available to the general public but they still managed to drive cars. You do some research and you will find some interesting pictures showing how they managed.
Gas is already over $5 gallon in Europe, they still manage to get around, the economy still runs. (perhaps better than USA's)

[NevadaGhosts]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')as is already over $5 gallon in Europe, they still manage to get around, the economy still runs.

[mistel]

NevadaGhosts

Please name one civilization in the history of the world that has collapsed due to the lack of a resource, Or is PO going to be a totally new phenomenum. I can think of one, but it is a unique example, not analagous to PO. I think PO is going to be a big ajustment, but we're not looking at the end of civilization.

And I put my money where my mouth is, I'm currently short oil, I'll post my results, good or bad. I am in a low risk option "fence" position that could continue till August 15th.

[maverickdoc]

NevadaGhosts, don't waste your time.

[mistel]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('maverickdoc', 'N')evadaGhosts, don't waste your time.

[TrueKaiser]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mistel', 'N')evadaGhosts

Please name one civilization in the history of the world that has collapsed due to the lack of a resource, Or is PO going to be a totally new phenomenum. I can think of one, but it is a unique example, not analagous to PO. I think PO is going to be a big ajustment, but we're not looking at the end of civilization.

And I put my money where my mouth is, I'm currently short oil, I'll post my results, good or bad. I am in a low risk option "fence" position that could continue till August 15th.

[mistel]

Quote "the roman empire collapsed due to over reach and depletion of their gold reserves etc"

I am not an expert but my understanding of the cause of the collape of the Roman Empire is that they were conquered by the Barbarians from the north. Also, when the last Empiror was replaced with a leader from the Barbarians, which historians say is when the Empire collapsed, it would have effected the average citizen very little. It was an orderly change of government, not "chaos" as the word collapse would suggest.

[HonestPessimist]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TrueKaiser', '
')you are correct. it is not the end, and it will not collapse as fast as most people here desire it too. as to why they are like this, some people seem to get a natural high at seeing others suffer. others seem a little angry at the fact in this kind of civilization they have no ability to make a difference or hold any real kind of power. so they gather what they think will not only help them survive a situation(the rapid, nearly overnight collapse) they falsely think will happen but will also put them in a position of power if it does.

chances are though unless a nuclear war happens or another multi mile long asteroid hits the earth they will just be siting on a cache of weapons, ammo, food, and water. waiting for this collapse to happen while the more rational people like you and me live on and adjust our lives to the slow decline. i would though keep a eye on these kind of people, they tend to try to make their desires come true when it is apparent they wont. in other words at least expect a lot more waco's and ruby ridge incidents to happen.