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Our Constitution

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 18:38:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', '
')Bit like peak oil isn't it,


Not at all.
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Homesteader » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 20:06:12

On the way home today I was traveling on a state road which is lightly traveled. About 3 miles outside of a small town there was a state trooper in the road, car parked in a pull off. He was stopping everybody and demanding to see every drivers license as in he would walk up to the window and say "license" in a stern voice. No explanation, just acting like a dick. He would check out the inspection sticker on the windshield and the (I assume) registration stickers on the rear plates. At 3pm in the afternoon.

Very strange. A first for me. Perhaps tptb are warming up the water that us frogs are in?
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 20:08:30

You didn't happen to ask him why he wanted to see your license?
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 20:14:47

I saw a military convoy on the interstate frontage road on the way into the city last week! 8O


There was a radar speed detector placed on our county road the other day! 8O
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Homesteader » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 20:40:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'Y')ou didn't happen to ask him why he wanted to see your license?


I was the only car in my lane and I was puzzling over what was going on. I rolled down my window expecting the officer to at least have manners. So, short answer, no I didn't ask, didn't think quickly enough.

Talked it over with my wife. If there had been a reason, like a dui check, escaped convict or the like there would have been more than one officer, right? So why would they do this?
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby BigTex » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 20:54:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Homesteader', 'O')n the way home today I was traveling on a state road which is lightly traveled. About 3 miles outside of a small town there was a state trooper in the road, car parked in a pull off. He was stopping everybody and demanding to see every drivers license as in he would walk up to the window and say "license" in a stern voice. No explanation, just acting like a dick. He would check out the inspection sticker on the windshield and the (I assume) registration stickers on the rear plates. At 3pm in the afternoon.

Very strange. A first for me. Perhaps tptb are warming up the water that us frogs are in?


I wonder how many times that has happened.

If it is less than once a week I wouldn't be too concerned.

There are SOME law enforcement functions that are legitimate.

People should remember RULE #1 to being left alone--KEEP A LOW PROFILE.

If a police officer asks for your license, give it to him. If he wants to write you a ticket, let him. It's people who battle small law enforcement actions who get involved in larger law enforcement actions.

If a police officer is being an asshole, just let him be one and then go file a formal complaint.

How many government showdowns in recent memory have been triggered by relatively minor violations?

In the U.S. especially, there are SO MANY firearms that are legal to own, I will never understand why people want to go find illegal firearms that are going to bring them so much more trouble than they are going to be protecting themselves from.

Another thing that people should be mindful of is that law enforcement is a very fragmented set of agencies. I don't see that there is much in the way of a unifying agenda or set of objectives that connects all of the tentacles of the law enforcement apparatus together.

Fundamentally, law enforcement is a political exercise, in that prosecutors are elected officials at the state and local level and political appointees at the federal level. Understanding that is helpful in understanding why some people seem to get into SO MUCH trouble, while others seem not to every get in trouble at all.

A PERSON WHO DRIVES THE SPEED LIMIT AND PAYS HIS TAXES IS UNLIKELY TO HAVE ANY TROUBLE (OR EVEN CONTACT) WITH THE GOVERNMENT AT ALL!

In fact, if you have a good trunking scanner, you can spy on the authorities WAY more than they are ever likely to spy on you.

Some things to think about.
:)
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 12 Apr 2008, 21:50:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', '
')People should remember RULE #1 to being left alone--KEEP A LOW PROFILE.



AKA - Don't flounce.


I think the Dept of Homeland Security wants to be the agency that ties all the other law enforcement agencies together, but, I don't think it has probably gotten very far on that task so far.
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby seahorse » Sat 24 May 2008, 13:55:56

It appears our Constitution is being attacked by the Executive under his new war powers, probably it is dead. Interesting article that the US is holding someone declared by the President to be an "enemy combatant." This person was not a US citizen, but was living here legally. The person was apprehended by the FBI. I intentionally didn't use "arrest" bc arrest invokes Constitutional protections. The gov't's legal position is the person has no Constitutional rights and can be held indefinitely by the Fed Gov't.

Notice when you read the article he's been charged with credit card fraud, not any act to commit a terrorist act.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n early 2003, he was indicted on charges of credit card fraud and lying to the FBI.


Notice how he has apparently been held for the last 5 years now without a trial! Lying to the FBI? credit card fraud? As a lawyer, I can say if this is the best the FBI can come up with, they have nothing.

Notice how the prosecutor completely ignores the individual Constitutional rights guaranteed by the Consitution and instead believes the statute defines one's rights, not the Constitution.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hat's how Congress wrote the bill and "if they feel concerned about civil liberties, they can tighten up the language," he said.


I guess the prosecutory ignores the fact that legislation can be unconstitutional and that the Constitution is a limitation of Executive power.


Yahoo News

This is the very horse shit I was worried about when I started this thread.
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby seahorse » Thu 12 Jun 2008, 10:46:03

Interesting article concerning a new Presidential directive on collecting biometric data on KSTs (known suspected terrorists), note that US citizens may be KSTs.

Global Research
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby seahorse » Sat 21 Jun 2008, 08:45:10

When the world is viewed through the prism of peak oil, all things make sense. For example, a new Senate bill would require entities like Google, credit card companies, etc to report transactions to the Federal Gov't.


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So why does decreasing civil liberties make sense in a PO view of the world? Bc capitalism and democracy evolved together. Both rose in a world which new no limits on growth. If the world has finally grown to the point it can no longer support the growth of 6 billion people, or in America, the growth of 300 million people, it only makes sense that capitalism and democracy in their current forms cannot survive.
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Sat 21 Jun 2008, 10:49:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seahorse', 'S')o why does decreasing civil liberties make sense in a PO view of the world? Bc capitalism and democracy evolved together. Both rose in a world which new no limits on growth. If the world has finally grown to the point it can no longer support the growth of 6 billion people, or in America, the growth of 300 million people, it only makes sense that capitalism and democracy in their current forms cannot survive.


The more I think about that, the more I disagree with it. Totalitarianism is the most energy intensive form of government. It requires a lot of effort forcing people to do things they don't want to do. Surveilling them to make sure they're doing what you told them, etc. The problem in the US is that we haven't really had freedom for a long time. We've had nosy, intrusive, micro-managing, dictatorial government for a long time. Mostly we were willing to live with it because we were so intoxicated with our consumer gluttony that we weren't really all that interested in being free anyway. They were able to pass libraries of regulations to control us because we were placid and happy to be controlled. All those armies of bureaucrats that regulate our lives, as energy supplies contract they're going to be less and less viable. The generals of the beauracrat armies are carrying on with the same plan they've always had. More rules. More restrictions. Hire more bureaucrats. It's a joke though.

One of the first things DHS did after it was formed was send teams around the country to lecture all the local EMS people on the incident command structure. Any time theres a big crisis there supposed to be all this coordination and integration of local, state, and federal resources that rush to the scene and get coordinated by the incident commander so we have this vigorous and well coordinated response to any crisis. Sounds great on paper. Then came Katrina. There was no incident control. There were no state and federal resources. There were a bunch of local agencies scrambling like heck trying to piece together and make it up from scratch. It was all a big joke because DHS never had even a fraction of the resources it would need to make it's dreams happen.

The bureaucrats want what bureaucrats have always wanted: Total informational awareness and total control. Peak oil won't be the thing that finally makes their dream possible. Peak oil will be the thing that finally drives a stake through it's heart. They've got all these grandiose dreams of collecting everyone's biometrics and using it to control the world. Meanwhile in the real world, they can't even find an 8 inch knife in your carry on bag. They want google and ebay to divulge all their financial records. Are they going to hire the army of people they would need to parse all that data? No way. They may feed it into a computer to make sure the SSN's match up with tax return data. Even that I'm not so sure of. The number of people who never even file returns is in the millions. IRS doesn't have even a fraction of the manpower it would need to hunt them all down. If you happen to be in the 1% of non-filers that IRS decides to make an example of, then it's going to suck. That fear is what keeps the rest of us filing. The reality is that as the economy shrinks that's going to mean less taxes and ultimately less bureaucrats not more. Eventually we'll probably end up with this symbolic government in Washington that makes all these rules that everyone ignores because it doesn't have the resources to enforce them. The president will end up in the same position as the English Monarchy, a figurehead. All real power will end up returning to the local level.
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: Our Constitution

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Wed 09 Jul 2008, 18:11:32

Just a reminder that things could always be worse:

Image

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n this photo released by the official Xinhua news agency, a member of China's armed police operates a flame sprayer during an anti-terrorist drill held in Jinan, east China, on Wednesday July 2, 2008, roughly one month ahead of the Beijing Olympic Games. (AP Photo/Xinhua/Fan Changguo)
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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