[TWilliam]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ainan', 'O')h sure, but thats in America, when TSHTF there it will give the rest of us a little more breathing room. I do understand this will have a massive impact on the rest of the world but we can probably get by.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ainan', 'O')h sure, but thats in America, when TSHTF there it will give the rest of us a little more breathing room. I do understand this will have a massive impact on the rest of the world but we can probably get by.

[darwinsdog]

I'm 52 also, Heineken, at least for a few more weeks.

Unlike you, what's surprised me has not been the rapidity of the Unraveling, but it's slowness. Studying the environmental sciences in the 1970s, we read Malthus, Garret Hardin, the Ehrilichs, about Hubbert's model & resource depletion, etc. We were well aware of "Peak Oil," anthropogenic mass extinction & climate change, all along. We fully expected the proverbial "shit to hit the fan" during the '80s or '90s, and certainly by the turn of the millenium at the very latest.

As a young guy I was jazzed by the prospect of the collapse of that unsustainable house of cards we call civilization, during my lifetime. The surprising thing to me has been that it's taken so long. Now that it's beginning to actually happen, I'm no longer very excited about it. On the one hand it may be remarkable to be living thru times of ecosystem collapse & mass extinction, but on the other I no longer have the youthful energy for heartily facing unpleasantness I may have once had.

You are correct that there are two clocks ticking: the personal life clock & the clock marking time until extinction of the ecocidal ape. Both clocks may well be approaching midnight. But it's the former clock that is the one that's important. We will die a bit sooner rather than later, perhaps, then no longer care or know what happens to our loved ones that survive us - if any.

I have a 10 yr. old granddaughter & I worry sometimes about her fate. There's no way that she's going to have as easy of a life as I have enjoyed, or that she has enjoyed up 'til now. But oh well, life is never certain & the best one can ever do is to cast one's genes into the future & hope for the best for the phenotypes that carry them. Nothing lasts forever so have a Heineken on this holiday weekend, Heineken. Relax & enjoy the moment and don't worry about what we know to be shortly in store for us all.

Best wishes.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('darwinsdog', 'I')'m 52 also, Heineken, at least for a few more weeks.

Unlike you, what's surprised me has not been the rapidity of the Unraveling, but it's slowness. Studying the environmental sciences in the 1970s, we read Malthus, Garret Hardin, the Ehrilichs, about Hubbert's model & resource depletion, etc. We were well aware of "Peak Oil," anthropogenic mass extinction & climate change, all along. We fully expected the proverbial "crap to hit the fan" during the '80s or '90s, and certainly by the turn of the millenium at the very latest.

As a young guy I was jazzed by the prospect of the collapse of that unsustainable house of cards we call civilization, during my lifetime. The surprising thing to me has been that it's taken so long. Now that it's beginning to actually happen, I'm no longer very excited about it. On the one hand it may be remarkable to be living thru times of ecosystem collapse & mass extinction, but on the other I no longer have the youthful energy for heartily facing unpleasantness I may have once had.

You are correct that there are two clocks ticking: the personal life clock & the clock marking time until extinction of the ecocidal ape. Both clocks may well be approaching midnight. But it's the former clock that is the one that's important. We will die a bit sooner rather than later, perhaps, then no longer care or know what happens to our loved ones that survive us - if any.

I have a 10 yr. old granddaughter & I worry sometimes about her fate. There's no way that she's going to have as easy of a life as I have enjoyed, or that she has enjoyed up 'til now. But oh well, life is never certain & the best one can ever do is to cast one's genes into the future & hope for the best for the phenotypes that carry them. Nothing lasts forever so have a Heineken on this holiday weekend, Heineken. Relax & enjoy the moment and don't worry about what we know to be shortly in store for us all.

Best wishes.

[sittinguy]

I'm in the 2012 group too. The possibility of a quick panic pop is real. And I don't think anyone has any clue
Agendas of the government and others
Resource limit
Natural eviro issues, a few man made.

Its a trifecta

I want to be done with my preps by the end of 08. I think I will have all of 09 to finish, but something will happen sometime in 09, And the sheeple will wake up, then its game on.

[pedalling_faster]

if they shut down the local public swimming pool, then i will go from being concerned/ motivated to being FREAKED.

fortunately, the local city attorney swims at the local pool, and intervened once already to keep it open.

swimming, i guess it's my liquid prozac.

[Armageddon]

Great thread. I am not sure when a total collapse will occur, but 2008 will be the last normal year as we know it year. Life will look different by 2009. Michael Rupport has been 100% correct, just a few years early on his predictions. Once I saw housing skyrocket in price and people refi'ng every bit of their equity, I knew things were getting close. Maxed out credit cards and upside down house loans are the last sign. US auto and airline industries are just about over too. Add that to the housing crash, and you are talkng about millions of jobs in jeopardy. I would bet atleast 75% of jobs are somehow tied directly or indirectly to these three industries. The game is over. " How about a nice game of checkers ? " Anyone remember that movie that was from ? I will give you a hint. WOPR

[lper100km]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Werdna', 'm')ost post's on this thread seem to point to 2012 as the real 'big' year for it to go t*ts up.

i live in Greenwich, London and we are hosting the olympic games that year for which i am being heavily taxed to pay for all the building programmes!
how ironic is that!
damn that London mayor for bidding for the games!

[Armageddon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cbxer55', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Armageddon', ' ') The game is over. " How about a nice game of checkers ? " Anyone remember that movie that was from ? I will give you a hint. WOPR

[pedalling_faster]

well, i've been a little slacker-ish on the food preps.

so i thought i would use this thread to give me some incentive in that regard. and to get in the habit of shopping twice a week, once for "regular food", the other for "crash prep" food. crash prep food being food that doesn't require refrigeration.

so i bought 20 # of rice, 20 # of pinto beans, and about 30# of canned fruits & vegetables, tuna fish, etc.

now i have to learn to cook pinto beans, and to make the pinto beans taste good.

a few people said, "you were just shopping this morning", so i said, "i'm going camping ... that's the short version".

"preparing for when the trucks stop delivering food to the market", that's i guess what i'm preparing for.

i guess that it feels wierd to do this because i'm on new territory, preparing for something that hasn't happened. also because it forces me to deal with the fact that i don't like rice & beans, yet.

on the plus side, i gave my vermiculture worms some water, and they are looking very healthy. somehow it's easier for me to stomach eating earthworms than some of the other protein alternatives i hear people talk about.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cbxer55', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', ' ')
I'm doing my bit for survival this weekend. Bought another 120 rounds of ammo. Bought a coupla more bottles of Jack. (These I keep stockpiling.) Am installing a whole wall of cabinets in the basement for storage of canned food.

[patience]

Steel that I use for our farm repair shop has gone up about 50% this year, wholsale. So, I'm stocking up on whatever scrap I can find at a bargain. Now I have to figure out how to keep the local punks from stealing it as things get worse. No problem so far, but it will be a risk, I'm sure.

There isn't enough time, whatever we have. I can see now that there will be all manner of stuff that I will wish I got done, somewhere down the road.

[DantesPeak]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gnm', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', 'O')ne way of thinking about investing in ETFs like USO, UNG, GLD, SLV and FXF is not as an investment, but more as an insurance policy.

If noting bad happens, you may lose some of your premiums, but if things get ugly these deployments of capital are likely to preserve purchasing power and protect your assets.

[eastbay]

According to this article in the Sydney Herald, it's time to prepare for pain (last paragraph).

So how much time? Not much.

[Armageddon]

I have been studying the Bible and peak oil for over 5 years, and for the first time at our subdivision 4th of July block party, people are finally realizing that things are not right. My neighbors are actually stocking up on water, food and ammunition. Wow, just wow. Damn, I am drunk right now, and it feels very good. I told them to add firewood to their stockpiles. For some reason I have been very irratible lately. I am a mean sob, and have been in an ass kicking mood for atleast 6 months. Not sure why. Something is just not quite right. I think we are living in the last days of this current system of things. 2009 will be very different that right now. ok, off to bed.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hogan', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ainan', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ainan', 'O')h i think we have plenty of time before TSHTF, a good 5-10 years at least. Of course if you factor in the 'credit crunch' issue, it could be next year. :8O:

Many people here on PO.com are getting on a bit and I think they want the 'collapse'. They have lived good lives and (quite rightly) want to see this horrible system we live in destroyed. It clouds their judgement.

Of course you could quite reasonibly argue the fact I'm in my early 20s with no physical preperations yet clouds my judgement.

[benzoil]

I think we're all panicking too much, too borrow a phrase. The path downward is not a smooth slope (or smooth curve). It is a series of steps. Right now we're on a quick downward step. Soon enough, people will adjust or the rate of change will slow and we will plateau for awhile. Then, we'll hit the next step.

Since societies are adaptive systems those plateaus will give people time to adjust or just let the frog get used to the new water temp. "Adjusting" does not mean implementing a hydrogen economy or inventing fusion. Simply that society does things like insulate homes, swap out SUVs for hybrids, move closer to work, start on some megaproject or another and other things that mitigate. These things will slow down the rate of change.

They won't stop it, however, but I think that 2015-2020 is a reasonable timeframe for when TSHTF. That may depend on how you define TSHTF, but I think we have a few more years after 2012 to get those permaculture gardens established.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('benzoil', '
')Since societies are adaptive systems those plateaus will give people time to adjust or just let the frog get used to the new water temp.