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At the pump Thread (merged)

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Re: Boat owners feeling pain at the pump

Unread postby Specop_007 » Sat 24 May 2008, 13:38:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('shortonoil', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'R')ight now, today, people in poor countries are starving. People in rich countries are mad they cant drive their boat AND go on vacation.

Still think Peak Oil is a serious threat to rich countries??

Is this purposely myopic? If the poor are starving now, what will the rich likely be doing in a few years. That is the question? If you really think about it, you’ll go find a ham sandwich; while you still can!


The rich will still be eating. The middle class will still be eating.

Those of us in first world countries have a loooooong ways to fall before we risk starving to death. There will, literally, be BILLIONS that have died before we're at risk of starving to death.

You get rid of that many people and you free up a whole boatload of resources.
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Re: Boat owners feeling pain at the pump

Unread postby Micki » Sun 25 May 2008, 21:23:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he rich will still be eating. The middle class will still be eating.

Those of us in first world countries have a loooooong ways to fall before we risk starving to death. There will, literally, be BILLIONS that have died before we're at risk of starving to death.


Say oil goes to $400/bbl and US dollar drops to 25% of current value? (Not swaying this IS going to happen, but a dramatic drop in US$ is far from unrealistic) How much food will there be in the supermarket shelves?
How many supermarkets are even going to be in business?
If it is not on the shelves are people growing it themselves?
Given that amount of Americans who don't even know that supermarket milk comes from cows, I don't think we will see a lot of people suddenly growing their own stuff. If this is a result of a US$ drop, Americans will be tightening their belts a few notches while nations with strong currencies will be importing what ever and as much as they fancy.
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Re: Boat owners feeling pain at the pump

Unread postby frankthetank » Sun 25 May 2008, 22:38:13

MarkJ-

By looking at that chart, i guess idling doesn't yield good mpg? Weird. I would have thought just a slow cruising speed would get you good mileage. My guess would be that once you get on "plane" the hull lifts out of the water causing less drag. The slower the speed you go on "plane" maybe the better the mileage? That would make sense.

Big heavy boats can be pushed around by humans. I watched a guy at the boat landing last week push around a smaller houseboat by himself (he was on a dock). That had to be 1000's of pounds of boat he was moving. Once he initially got it moving, he pushed it around pretty easily.

Boat traffic was, from what my eyes could see, down a lot for a beautiful holiday weekend. I think people are scared.
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Pain at the pump

Unread postby k_semler » Mon 02 Jun 2008, 00:43:46

Here Lies the United States Of America.

July 04, 1776 - June 23 2005

Epitaph: "The Experiment Is Over."

Rest In Peace.

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Re: Pain at the pump

Unread postby municipal » Mon 02 Jun 2008, 03:39:14

There is a real advantage to these gas prices:
When you filll up, you can always top it to the next 5 dollars.

Parhump!

It is so expenisev that rats are carpooling from New Jersey!

Pahrump!

President Bush announced his plan to increase the number of barrels (of oil) produced. You hear his plan? He wants to make smaller barrels.

rumpa-rumpa-pump!

Gas is so expensive SUV now stands for sport utility victim

Pahrump!

Gas prices have risen again. Prices are so bad here in L.A. that guys in Beverly Hills are hiring hookers to siphon gas out of other people's cars

rumpa-pumpa-rarump.


How many have seen 'March of the Penguins'?...You know why they're marching? They can't afford gas

rimshot- pahrump


gas prices are going up!In other words, President Bush is back from vacation and back on the job.

pahrumpa-rumpa-rimshot-pump








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Re: Pain at the pump

Unread postby TWilliam » Mon 02 Jun 2008, 14:21:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('k_semler', 'h')ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWbjSnU1OCM


"We know what they're doin', we're not stupid..."

Actually, yes you are if, like a majority no doubt, you buy this guy's rap (not implying you do, k_semler).

This kind of crap is not the least bit helpful in bringing the public to an understanding about the drivers behind rising prices... :evil:
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby pictishbroch » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 13:55:39

Answers here.

http://gasoline-germany.com/international.phtml

Let´s here it for Hugo Chavez!!! at 5cents a Litre!

seriously folks.As you see from the chart the Europeans are paying way higher than the rest with the exception of Turkey who are having to pay by far the most.
In Europe and the UK we pay high taxes on fuel.

Germany

Fuel taxes in Germany are €0.4704 per litre for ultra-low sulphur Diesel and €0.6545 per litre for conventional unleaded petrol, plus Value Added Tax (19%) on the fuel itself and the Fuel Tax. That adds up to prices of €1.19 per litre for ultra-low sulphur Diesel and €1.37 per litre (approximately USD$7.615 per gallon) for unleaded petrol (Sep 2007).

and

United Kingdom

Main article: Hydrocarbon oil duty

From 2007-10-01 the main road fuel (petrol and diesel) duty rate in the UK is GBP£0.5035 per litre. The rate for biodiesel and bioethanol is £0.3035.[1] Value Added Tax (VAT), currently at 17.5%, is also charged on the price of the fuel and on the duty. At a pump price of 128.8p/litre (typical for diesel as at May 2008), this would put the combined tax at 69.53p/litre, or approximately USD$5.20 per US gallon. Thus without tax, the retail price would be 59.26p per litre, making a combined tax rate of 117%.

reduce taxes has to be the answer for us Europeans at least??

anyone any thoughts on this?
Last edited by pictishbroch on Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:03:27, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby Twilight » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:02:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pictishbroch', 'r')educe taxes has to be the answer for us Europeans at least??

anyone any thoughts on this?


Sure. What do you want to give up?
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby cudabachi » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:13:42

Actually, here in Venezuela, using the black market exchange rates for the U.S. dollar, 91 Octane costs $0.07/gallon and 95 Octane is priced at $0.11/gallon!
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby misterno » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:16:51

In Turkey, they pay $11.5/gal yet car sales are not declining
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby Peakoilpost » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:19:15

Here in The Netherlands we pay $10 per US gallon.

You'll get used to it :wink:
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby pictishbroch » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:33:04

well I guess we will just have to get used the new price paradigm!

jeez I remember when I first went to the pub a pint of beer cost 20 pence! really 20 pence a pint now a pint costs circa 1 pound 80 pence.

so in a few years when Petrol costs €2 a liter we will look back at the cheap good ol days same way we do with beer! :-D
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby pup55 » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:42:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s you see from the chart the Europeans are paying way higher than the rest



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2007, employer health insurance premiums increased by 6.1 percent - two times the rate of inflation. The annual premium for an employer health plan covering a family of four averaged nearly $12,100. The annual premium for single coverage averaged over $4,400.2


NCHC

I will trade you. I will gladly pay $10 a gallon for gas, in exchange for your health benefits.

Note that the above is just the health insurance premiums. Does not cover deductibles, co-pays, or other fees that they extort from you if you are actually sick.
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby vision-master » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:47:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pup55', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s you see from the chart the Europeans are paying way higher than the rest



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2007, employer health insurance premiums increased by 6.1 percent - two times the rate of inflation. The annual premium for an employer health plan covering a family of four averaged nearly $12,100. The annual premium for single coverage averaged over $4,400.2


NCHC

I will trade you. I will gladly pay $10 a gallon for gas, in exchange for your health benefits.

Note that the above is just the health insurance premiums. Does not cover deductibles, co-pays, or other fees that they extort from you if you are actually sick.


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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby pictishbroch » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 14:58:37

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pup55', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s you see from the chart the Europeans are paying way higher than the rest



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2007, employer health insurance premiums increased by 6.1 percent - two times the rate of inflation. The annual premium for an employer health plan covering a family of four averaged nearly $12,100. The annual premium for single coverage averaged over $4,400.2


NCHC

I will trade you. I will gladly pay $10 a gallon for gas, in exchange for your health benefits.

Note that the above is just the health insurance premiums. Does not cover deductibles, co-pays, or other fees that they extort from you if you are actually sick.


Perhaps America should take a closer look at how they run their health care system.Try a different approach.

In the UK we have the national health.Paid for by the tax payer.In Germany your employer pays your health insurance.

Health insurance

Almost everyone living in Germany has health insurance. Some 88 percent belong to a statutory health scheme and around nine percent are privately insured.

Up to a certain level of income (in 2005, € 3,900 gross per month or € 46,800 per annum), all employees are obliged to join one of the over 315 statutory health insurance schemes. Persons earning a higher gross amount than this are free to join a private scheme if they so desire. Subject to certain conditions, the statutory system also covers pensioners, the unemployed, trainees and students.

Employers and employees each pay half of the latter's health insurance contributions. These vary from company to company and in 2002 stood on average at 14 percent of gross earnings. However, there is an upper ceiling for the calculation of contributions. Even very high-income employees do not have to pay health contributions of more than seven percent of € 3,450. The employer pays the same amount. No contributions are payable for members of the family who do not work. From this point of view, employees with families are better off than single employees.

All insured persons have a free choice of panel doctors and dentists. The health insurance company pays the doctor's costs, as well as remedies, drugs, and appliances, hospital treatment and preventative health care. Patients have to pay a contribution towards medicines and certain services (spectacles, dentures). The treatment of children is exempt from such charges. The health insurance company pays all or part of the cost of curative treatment at a spa. In the event of sickness employees continue to receive their salary or wages from their employer for up to six weeks. Some collective agreements provide for an even longer period. After this the health insurance company provides sickness benefits for up to 78 weeks.
Last edited by pictishbroch on Tue 24 Jun 2008, 05:10:23, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby Peakoilpost » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 15:25:17

In The Netherlands you have an mandatory, affordable basic health assurance, commercial insurance companies can't refuse you. For a better coverage you can upgrade for a few hundred bucks a year extra. (here companies can select, but the competition is healthy). There is no relationship with employer/employment. I believe I pay approx. $2.400, for a single coverage top package ...

You're right, wouldn't want to trade it for $4 or $3 gas....
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Re: How much does the rest of the world pay at the pump?

Unread postby Starvid » Mon 23 Jun 2008, 16:27:50

We pay $8,5 a gallon.

I read this interview with people they pick up from the street. A middle aged couple, they drove 70.000 km per year. Almost two laps around the world. They grumbled and said a good price would be $7,5, and damn it, if prices reached $12,5 per gallon they would buy a horse! :lol:

Of course they won't. 8)
Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
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