[yull]

Remember the oil price affects us well beyond what we pay at the pump. If I recall right only a minority of oil consumption is used for personal residential transport - most of it goes into industry, trade, airlines, food, plastics, extracting other resources etc etc. The price of gasoline is only the very tip of the iceberg and it's effects elsewhere probably affect us more than that price at the pump.

[Neuromancer]

"Remember the oil price affects us well beyond what we pay at the pump. If I recall right only a minority of oil consumption is used for personal residential transport - most of it goes into industry, trade, airlines, food, plastics, extracting other resources etc etc. The price of gasoline is only the very tip of the iceberg and it's effects elsewhere probably affect us more than that price at the pump."



That is right. Some people tend to see only the impact on driving, but this is much bigger. Industry, agriculture ... it's all about oil.

Hard times. ahead.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Drifter', 'I')'m still trying to figure out why so many people cannot see the big picture. Maybe they don't want to see it.

Newer members here, please listen to what MQ and DP are saying. They know what they are talking about.

There is no realistic, large scale replacement for crude oil and natural gas. None. That's what makes peak oil so serious. Unrestricted growth cannot continue any more. We have reached the limits of modern society. So-called alternative technologies are all dependent on the availability cheap oil and gasoline to build and maintain. So is large-scale farming (fertilizers, farm equipment, and food transportation).

Gasoline isn't the only thing that will soon become unaffordable. Everything is about to become very expensive, because modern society cannot function normally without cheap and abundant fossil fuels.

And Monte, I agree about gasoline use in the US. Most Americans will cut back on everything else to be able to continue driving. The dependence and automobile love affair runs that deep

[nocar]

Fredrik, I think it is a terrible bad idea for European countries to try to lower motor fuel prices. Low income people, especially women, already live without owning a car. They manage with public transport, bicycles and an occasional taxi and so can a lot of other people who currently drive cars.

For people in the countryside with little public transport, who might get into hardship due to high oil prices, it is much better to give them some general tax rebates or 'country living allowances'. That way they can either afford higher driving costs or become creative with car pooling or do shopping for their neighbors while doing their own and other such solutions that save gasoline.

nocar

[sittinguy]

At $4 a gallon alot of people are already consolidating their trips out. A couple weeks ago My aunt invited us to dinner, she lives about 20 miles away. And on the way me and the wife were trying to figure out for fun if the $12 in gas was worth it. Naturally it was worth it to spend time with the family and she was making ribs for dinner. But we were actually doing the math.

I think the same thing about people driving no matter the cost. I used to think $6 was a tipping point, but I have raised it to $7

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '
')Electric cars will solve everything, according to some. We'll just switch over.

Electric farm tractors! Why not?

Plenty of coal left for electricity. And don't forget those thorium breeder reactors.

Plug in and go!

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('abelardlindsay', 'T')hat many people absolutely refuse to consider carpooling I think is really funny.

At some point over the past 20 years middle class Americans -- especially women -- became absolutely petrified of strangers.

[hironegro]

I think we are going to see a lot of demand destruction before it hits 250. When the price goes to 5 dollars a gallon people will cancel trips and carpool. I think we'll see a more people cutting back on dinning out and eating processed foods, and simply buy produce, chicken pork, and bread.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('hironegro', 'I') think we are going to see a lot of demand destruction before it hits 250.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('hironegro', 'I') think we are going to see a lot of demand destruction before it hits 250.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '
')Electric cars will solve everything, according to some. We'll just switch over.

Electric farm tractors! Why not?

Plenty of coal left for electricity. And don't forget those thorium breeder reactors.

Plug in and go!

[cube]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '.')..
I don't think the societal groupthink response to our problems (electric and H cars, thorium reactors, biofuels, all that other techno stuff) is good. Forget perfect.

[Fredrik]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nocar', 'F')redrik, I think it is a terrible bad idea for European countries to try to lower motor fuel prices. Low income people, especially women, already live without owning a car. They manage with public transport, bicycles and an occasional taxi and so can a lot of other people who currently drive cars.

For people in the countryside with little public transport, who might get into hardship due to high oil prices, it is much better to give them some general tax rebates or 'country living allowances'. That way they can either afford higher driving costs or become creative with car pooling or do shopping for their neighbors while doing their own and other such solutions that save gasoline.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Fredrik', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nocar', 'F')redrik, I think it is a terrible bad idea for European countries to try to lower motor fuel prices. Low income people, especially women, already live without owning a car. They manage with public transport, bicycles and an occasional taxi and so can a lot of other people who currently drive cars.

For people in the countryside with little public transport, who might get into hardship due to high oil prices, it is much better to give them some general tax rebates or 'country living allowances'. That way they can either afford higher driving costs or become creative with car pooling or do shopping for their neighbors while doing their own and other such solutions that save gasoline.

[VMarcHart]

My 2 cents.

$250/bbl, or $10/gas (or whatever it will be), will be tough, but not disastrous. I'm wingging, but I assume few on this site know what disastrous really means. My grandparents lived WWII; 6 disastrous years. We have it easy.

$10/gas disastrous? Nah.

[ColossalContrarian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('VMarcHart', 'M')y 2 cents.

$250/bbl, or $10/gas (or whatever it will be), will be tough, but not disastrous. I'm wingging, but I assume few on this site know what disastrous really means. My grandparents lived WWII; 6 disastrous years. We have it easy.

$10/gas disastrous? Nah.

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ColossalContrarian', 'w')e're a lot more dependent on oil now than we were during ww2. you can't even fathom the impact $10 gas would have on the US economy.

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('VMarcHart', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ColossalContrarian', 'w')e're a lot more dependent on oil now than we were during ww2. you can't even fathom the impact $10 gas would have on the US economy.