[Gerben]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'W')e must have a paradigm shift in our thinking about the world.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gerben', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'W')e must have a paradigm shift in our thinking about the world.

[yesplease]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'I') don't care how you spin it.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', ' ')Except[/url] in Japan for a decade. GDP doubled while energy consumption remained flat.

[yesplease]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', '[')url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Japan_energy_%26_GDP.png]Except[/url] in Japan for a decade. GDP doubled while energy consumption remained flat.

[allenwrench]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')hat's a recipe for a violent revolution.

[burtonridr]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('allenwrench', '
')Everyone wants a piece of our real estate.

[hope_full]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hat is it with poor people?
All around me I see "poor" people.
I'm in the gas station in my 34mpg vehicle that cost 10 grand 5 years ago.
They're driving Ford 250 somethings, and Tahoes, and they live in trailers and shit boxes.
What is the deal with that?
And every time I see them inside buying cigarettes for 5 bucks a pack and losery tickets to to the tune of 30 bucks and some pure sugar confection in a pre wrapped container and a 1 liter bottle of tooth rot for 2.10 and then I hear them grumble, "I can't believe the price of gas", I want to say, "I can't believe that someone as poor as you is as stupid as you."
And eventually all of these idiots who have been dumping 25% of their paychecks into car payments and gas will eventually figure it out or be walking.
And, personally, 10$ gas can't get here soon enough for me.
Why? Because unlike many of the other socialists above me in this thread, I'd much prefer to have 5 hillbillies crammed into an AMC Gremlin, each killing themselves with a Marlboro red in a fog of smoke, then have each of them driving a 4,000 pound truck that's getting 8mpg for no other reason than they equate the size of their vehicle with the desired size of their phalus.
350 Gas? Good riddance.
The sooner we get to 10 the better.
And so as not to be unfairly harsh with the stupid rednecks who choose to be poor in this country, I also look forward to the day when Suzie Homemaker and Joe Sixpack have to drive Geo Metros rather than Chevy Gargantuans and Ford Jupiters.

[burtonridr]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'W')e are not wealthy because of our freedom.
We are not wealthy because of our initiative.
We are not wealthy because our capitalist system.
We are wealthy because we discovered the new world and its almost unlimited resource-base (including the the greatest oil bonanza ever)----first. And we parlayed all that into one big kickass army. Now we own the world's wealth. Or did.

[johhnytrash]

My favorite line about America is:
'Praising the USA for it's wealth and success is like praising someone for a home run when they started on third base.'

That is to say the US is a huge landmass sitting on some of the best resources in the world. It almost couldn't help becoming a wealthy nation.
--
One of the reasons why demand is diminishing in the USA and still growing in China and other countries is that those other governments are subsidizing the price of gas. When gas gets REALLY expensive you will see those other governments unable to afford their subsidies and global demand will diminish, but it will be too late and not enough.

When gas gets REALLY expensive you will see the environmentalist's resistance to drilling in ANWR and other places disappear and we'll start drilling, but as y'all know there isn't nearly enough oil in those places. So you'll have brief dips in speculation driving up the price of oil, but nothing long term will happen.

Most folks you talk to who are pissed about gas, have NO IDEA that the world consumes about 80 million barrels a day. They blame OPEC or Exxon for price gouging or the war or something, but never once on how we've build a society that requires the biggest straw sucking on your milkshake. So yeah, the people, (congress) will demand rationing and 'driving holidays' the second there's shortages. And it won't work.

We might manage to get some percentage of renewable energy up and running but it won't be enough. (But I'm preaching to the choir here...)

No one in power is truly considering the common good for the whole nation. Politicians and energy executives can afford their own islands of electricity so their's no reason to give a rat's ass about anyone else. Noone seems to understand that with finite resources you can accumulate so much there's no opportunity for others to accumulate. People blame the poor for being poor and blame the sick for being sick, and by the time that hungry, angry hordes are tearing off your roof to get to your okra it will be too late.

Everyone seems to think that it's not going to happen to them. Obviously someone who doesn't have insurance and thinks the US health care system is great is uninformed or deluded into thinking they are somehow going to stay healthy.

People blame a lack of leadership. Our system has leaders, but they are not our politicians. Our leaders are CEOs and bankers. The thing that gets me angry is they are not fighting to help out humanity or their country, they are fighting to help out themselves and their companies. Greed is sucking this planet dry and instead of throwing a wrench in the gears people are trying to get their piece of the pie before there's no pie left.

So yeah, gas rationing during shortages as the signal flare to an crash back to an 18th century lifestyle. Hope you enjoy your Ayn Rand by candlelight.

[Daphne64]

I just read the whole thread am very surprised there is nothing resembling an economic analysis. So here goes, based on Econ 101 level economics:

The US uses about 25% of the world's oil. I'm afraid I don't know how much of that goes into passenger car gas tanks, but lets say it's 33%, to be likely on the low side. So 1/12 of the worlds oil is going into US passenger car, SUV or truck gas tanks.

A recently reported stat is that consumption of oil drops by 1% for each 20% increase in price. That's wildly inelastic demand, folks.

If we were to give out ration cards to everyone at a level that would decrease passenger vehicle use by 10%, that would drop world oil use by 0.83%, and decrease price by 16.7%.

(That's 16.7% less wahhabi mosques and 16.7% less money for bombs and weaponry in the hands of extremist muslims, btw)

So the price of oil drops to $116/barrel. What would happen to the price of gasoline in reality is that gas would stay at $4 a gallon instead of going to the $5 a gallon that matches $140 a barrel.

Since our PTB favor cap and trade for things like carbon emissions, it stands to reason that they would be allowed for the vouchers (electronic vouchers could be possibility). So people that carpool or bike or whatever could sell their vouchers for maybe $3/gallon (the difference between the price for excess demand and the price at the pump).

That's a total of $7 a gallon incentive for people to conserve gas, but only $4 a gallon goes to our wahhabi "friends".

I may be missing something, but I don't see much that's going to cause civilization to go up in flames from reasonable rationing.

[Daphne64]

One more benefit to rationing: if the US government follows the precedent set with the stimulus checks and excludes illegal aliens from ration cards, that might encourage more of them to leave.

[Daphne64]

I forgot one factor in the analysis. You multiply the new price of 83.3% of the old price by the new demand of 99.17% of the old demand to get 82.6% revenue. So there is 17.4% less money going to corrupt and hostile governments. Not much of a difference in this example, but it's important to get stuff right.

[GeneralGreen]

Rations are actually not fair, but will be initiated in the early days of the energy crisis...As the crisis worsen it will lead to all out shortage..then to a sort of black market.
I expect rations to happen in the US around 2010-2011 time...and shortages starting around 2012. If the US-Israel coalition of the willing really does strike Iran..We can see shortages not long after the attack.
I think shortages is the key..Long gas lines ect...Rations are only a bandaid to the problem and wont last.