[usncom]

Whether you belive in a hard crash or a soft landing there is no doubt that whatever the outcome it will leave severe economic scars among the lower working classes and lower classes of society which just happens to dispriportionately consist of blacks and hispanics.

All one needs to do is to look at the devestating effects that the loss of high paying manufacturing industry had throughout the rust belt in the USA, particularly Detroit. Unemployment skyrocketed, families became unstable as more and more men abandoned them and or turned to a life of crime to make ends meet, and whole tracts of neighborhoods surrendered to decay, abandonment, and the drug trade.

If the service sector of North America is going to take as bad of a beating as peak oil doomers such as Kunstler predicts, then ALL of us are in a world of hurt no matter what your class status or race is. The only difference is the effects on the poor, those without higher education, and minorities will be 3 to 4 times worse.

I can't help but wonder how we will be able to let go of the superficial prejudices and pull together as a country or even as a global community for that matter if we are all fighting over the last few scraps of resources on the planet.

Kunstler touched upon this subject rather humorously in "The Long Emergency". His witty New York sarcasm left no social group spared from criticism whether it was NASCAR fans, clannish Southerners, Country Music fans, or the Hip Hop community. While I disagreed with his conclusions and perceived a cunning and seething hattred of the American Way of life underlying his writing I give him many browny points for brilliantly touching this sensitive subject of race and PO future.

No doubt, in a hard PO crash there are going to be alot of angry, vocal, and unfortunately some violent protests that the American Dream of a suburban house, two car garage, and a Chevy Suburban parked out in front. Trust me, blacks aren't going to be the only one violently protesting in the streets in this scenario. The blame game will fire up public vocal emnity with conservatives blaming liberals, liberals blaming conservatives, whites blaming blacks, blacks blaming "the man", and whites, blacks, and everybody in between blaming hispanics(for taking jobs) and Muslim countries(for hoarding oil). Hopefully a long protracted soft crash will mitigate these ill social aftershocks.

I want to hope for a bright future and that we will all just hold hands into the post peak oil sunset singing Kumbaya but some of the doomer posts I've seen on the "other PO site" give me grave doubts.

Just my perspective.

[Ayoob]

God forbid you should just help out instead of bitching and crying and rioting.

[Windmills]

Bitching and rioting are the price of ignorance and a lack of education. Students often ask, "when are we ever going to use this science and math?" I usually have a thee-part speech prepared in response. "Right now," would suffice as a short answer these days. If people had a better understanding of some basic math and science, such as exponential curves and the laws of thermodynamics, we might not have so many ridiculous responses to peak oil. However, since the majority of the world is lacking in a grounded education, we'll continue to see people swallow the MSM conspiracy theories about the causes of depletion and therefore react angrily and in a variety of unproductive ways. More in line with this thread, there's an increased chance for our superficial differences and divisions to become deeper as a result of our ignorance and fear.

[usncom]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ayoob', 'G')od forbid you should just help out instead of bitching and crying and rioting.

[Cashmere]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')is witty New York sarcasm left no social group spared from criticism whether it was NASCAR fans, clannish Southerners, Country Music fans, or the Hip Hop community.

[KingM]

Cashmere,

Maybe you should debate usncom's ideas instead of looking over his shoulder to attack his entire race.

[dsula]

Cashmere:
Couldn't agree more. Thanks for the post.

[vision-master]

One things for sure. They will riot. History has proven this. After they riot, they will be shipped out to the "work camps". Yes work camps, they are already in place, just a waiting.

[RedStateGreen]

Welcome, usncom. Your analysis seems fairly accurate.

This is going to be a class issue more than a race issue, IMO, as people are priced out of buying what were once seen as 'necessities'.

[usncom]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cashmere', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')is witty New York sarcasm left no social group spared from criticism whether it was NASCAR fans, clannish Southerners, Country Music fans, or the Hip Hop community.

[Darkwinism]

USNCOM,

an Afro-American perspective on Peak Oil...hmmm

1.There are 100 majority African-American counties and about 20 major cities with majority black populations. So, black voters can organize and force their 120+ black mayors and county officials to form a consortium and go to the French, Russians, Japanese, Koreans, Indians, Israelis, Germans, South Africans, etc. and see how much it costs to build 150-200 nuclear power plants. Go into debt, use city/county infrastructure as collateral, the biggest lender wins the bid to build. Gather retired black navy vets that have worked on nuclear powered ships and every laid off black auto worker and have them build it under foreign management (until they are able to run plants independantly). Once we have reliable electricity we have a good shot at avoiding the worst.

Or

2. Learn Spanish. Talk to your Latino neighbors about gardening. Visit Cuba - when it becomes legal. Talk to some of those millions of black Cubans that have experienced "peak oil" via our trade embargo. Study Cuba and their solutions. Talk to your Central American, Vietnamese, Korean, and Russian neighbors about economic colllapse and political chaos. Learn why so many people that have posted on this board sound like crazed animals and how that will affect you.

And

fight to preserve your little portion of civilization. Good luck.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') understand things are dire in these communities. However, on the bright side, the black middle class is bigger and more educated than its ever been and we have a African American with a good shot at being president so I can't say "America handed opportunity after opportunity only to internally sabotage themselves."

[killJOY]

usncom, you are about to find out the hard way that PO.com is populated with a veritable WASP nest of afro-haters.

Don't let them drive you away.

[sharewill]

So clearly written, and it is clear that the days of what you describe are near. A few years ago, I wrote three stories (fiction) of the times you describe -- I was aware of something happening, but I didn't know exactly what. Although I was aware that while the stories were 'fiction' they were in fact a bell ringing in a tower, calling all those who hear to 'be prepared'.

I wondered why the USA was not found in the listing of the nations in the book of Revelations - and now it is clearer as to the reasons and the way it happens. Thanks for your insight, and you are right, the point and blame game that poured into the USA when the Soviet Union fell (at least the old structured gov't) the society of 'tellers' has taken root and bloomed using the very liberties that were established to protect us from them and any other destructive intent. Amazing, we the people become the target and the weapon of destruction.

Thanks for your info. I'm almost overwhelmed, but I will breathe deep and step on.
Sharewill

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('usncom', 'W')hether you belive in a hard crash or a soft landing there is no doubt that whatever the outcome it will leave severe economic scars among the lower working classes and lower classes of society which just happens to dispriportionately consist of blacks and hispanics.

All one needs to do is to look at the devestating effects that the loss of high paying manufacturing industry had throughout the rust belt in the USA, particularly Detroit. Unemployment skyrocketed, families became unstable as more and more men abandoned them and or turned to a life of crime to make ends meet, and whole tracts of neighborhoods surrendered to decay, abandonment, and the drug trade.

If the service sector of North America is going to take as bad of a beating as peak oil doomers such as Kunstler predicts, then ALL of us are in a world of hurt no matter what your class status or race is. The only difference is the effects on the poor, those without higher education, and minorities will be 3 to 4 times worse.

I can't help but wonder how we will be able to let go of the superficial prejudices and pull together as a country or even as a global community for that matter if we are all fighting over the last few scraps of resources on the planet.

Kunstler touched upon this subject rather humorously in "The Long Emergency". His witty New York sarcasm left no social group spared from criticism whether it was NASCAR fans, clannish Southerners, Country Music fans, or the Hip Hop community. While I disagreed with his conclusions and perceived a cunning and seething hattred of the American Way of life underlying his writing I give him many browny points for brilliantly touching this sensitive subject of race and PO future.

No doubt, in a hard PO crash there are going to be alot of angry, vocal, and unfortunately some violent protests that the American Dream of a suburban house, two car garage, and a Chevy Suburban parked out in front. Trust me, blacks aren't going to be the only one violently protesting in the streets in this scenario. The blame game will fire up public vocal emnity with conservatives blaming liberals, liberals blaming conservatives, whites blaming blacks, blacks blaming "the man", and whites, blacks, and everybody in between blaming hispanics(for taking jobs) and Muslim countries(for hoarding oil). Hopefully a long protracted soft crash will mitigate these ill social aftershocks.

I want to hope for a bright future and that we will all just hold hands into the post peak oil sunset singing Kumbaya but some of the doomer posts I've seen on the "other PO site" give me grave doubts.

Just my perspective.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('killJOY', 'u')sncom, you are about to find out the hard way that PO.com is populated with a veritable WASP nest of afro-haters.
Don't let them drive you away.

[Cashmere]

I'm sorry, did something I wrote come across as racist?

I apply my reasoning to race just as I do Peak Oil.

I didn't make the illegitimacy rate in the black community "70%".

I didn't encourage urban blacks to speak some language that is only tangentially related to English.


Don't call me a racist.

I hold blacks to the same standard I hold everybody - if you fuck it up, I'll point at you too.

Blacks have fucked it up.

As for the OP's position that the MSM is responsible for propagating black ghetto culture, I completely disagree.

Blacks, in large part, DO NOT WANT to be like white people.

Hey, I don't blame them for that - with the amount of shit they've put up with for 300 years.

But the thing that drives me nuts about this issue, and with every other human issue, is that blacks, as they continue to shoot themselves in the foot, refuse to see their own blame.

It's not a black thing, it's a human thing.

So if calling out people for screwing up is racist, then I'm a racist.

Just like . . .

If calling out a country for being racist and warmongering is anti-Jew, then I am anti-Jew.

Hey, this is the old - give em enough rope . . . thing.

[usncom]

Do you have any close black friends Cashmere? Balance can be a good thing ya know?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')As for the OP's position that the MSM is responsible for propagating black ghetto culture, I completely disagree.
Blacks, in large part, DO NOT WANT to be like white people."

[Ayoob]

Any particular reason you're not pointing to the obvious benefits that black people bring to any community? Why is it a foregone conclusion that blacks will be excluded, or will be less successful as time goes by?

The "Muslim Perspective" thread showed how Muslim philosophy has something to add to the world.

Why don't you sell us all on the benefits that black people bring to a community of non-blacks?

[mgibbons19]

Hey unscom, welcome.

I have to say I'm glad someone is willing to try and argue the "black" perspective. There is enough "anti-black" here that I think it detracts from the credibility of the site honestly.

I also agree that this is going to be more about class than race - which of course correlates with race in many ways.

I think also, from my own studies, that the 'mainstream' perspective on black americans is pretty foolish, treating them as if they are one big consistent demographic group. However as a white american, I can't imagine someone amalgamating everything from the worst stereotype of the white working class to paris hilton, and throwing me somewhere in there. I'm sure black americans feel similarly.

In short, thinking about this in terms of race brings in some interesting complications to an already complicated issue. I would agree that since this is going to harm minorities in sum more because of the class correlations. At the same time however, because the truly poor are so poor, they are already living with spotty transportation abilities, economic isolation, and debilitating chronic health issues.

Interesting times.

[swingbolder]

Welcome unscom, I've been on PO for a coupla years although I rarely post anymore. Yeah there are a lot of people around here who hate on us black folks and that gets tedious but there's a lot of good info to be had so that's why I stick around. I basically don't bother with the racists. There are also lots of cool people here too who are more open-minded and that tends to balance things out. Also, sometimes the racists have good information to share as well. . .

Regarding the thread topic, I think the impact that PO will have on race relations will vary based on region. In parts of the country that are already segregated you'll just see more of that. In more diverse places where folks are used to being around different races/ethnicities besides their own you'll see more cooperation/interaction across ethnic lines. Other variables too will come into play affecting how communities cope, in terms of whether people turn on each other or whether they pull together for the common good.

I live on the outskirts of a very small city in upstate NY. We relocated here from NYC a few years back with the thought in mind that this will be a good place to be if TSHTF. There're lots of farms nearby, we're near a train line and have an active waterfront. Plus it's a walkable community.

The only other black person I know who is aware of peak oil is my husband. We bought a small farmhouse on 3 acres of land and have been working to get more prepared these past few years. Planting tress, gardening, paying off debt, investing in firearms & ammo, learning new skills (carpentry, bee-keeping, sewing, bike repair), being frugal, etc.

When I first learned about peak oil I tried to tell other black folks about it, like at my church, and basically everybody thought I was nuts so I just shut up about it. I thought about organizing a church group to learn about basic preparedness and maybe buy food in bulk together but no one was interested. I didn't frame it within the subject of PO; I basically presented the idea as one that made sense in a rainy day way, like, if someone gets laid off in your house wouldn't it be great to have stores on hand and not have to worry about the food bill for a few months. All I got was jokes and weird looks, so as I said before I just dropped it.

There is the general feeling out there that they will be taken care of somehow. This is a low-income community, with many people having grown up with the tradition of collecting gov't checks on and off so there does not exist the culture of self-reliance that will be increasingly necessary IMO as the economy tanks.