Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Hello Pt 3

Say hello, learn how to register, read the rules, get staff announcements.

Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 00:41:27

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('steam_cannon', 'W')ell guys, I think it's time me and my wife to ahh, call it a night...


Sneaking off to the love nest for a little doom-amour? [smilie=love3.gif]

I feel like the violin player in a peak oil cafe. [smilie=eusa_boohoo.gif]
:)
User avatar
BigTex
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3858
Joined: Thu 03 Aug 2006, 03:00:00
Location: Graceland

Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 00:53:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'T')he Antelope Valley, the High Desert, Palm Springs, everything is part of the Sprawl Zone. Mile after mile of Starbucks, AG Edwards, Target, etc.

What a relief to finally arrive in Slab City and a quiet cigarette :)

Image


When THAT is the oasis, you truly are in a wasteland.

That looks like a VFW lodge that lost its franchise because it was too depressing to even sit in and get drunk.
:)
User avatar
BigTex
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3858
Joined: Thu 03 Aug 2006, 03:00:00
Location: Graceland

Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Olaf » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 09:53:45

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('steam_cannon', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'G')ASMON you to will awaken but will it be too late?
Heh heh, well it doesn't matter to me if GASMON learns anything or
not. People often have to see gas lines with their own eyes to believe
that there is a problem with no present solution. I'm not trying to save people,
I'm just here for the popcorn.

[smilie=new_popcornsmiley.gif]


Most people don't realize it until it has been breached, but we all have a doom hymen. There is a lot of doomer foreplay before the consummation, and I believe that this is where people spend a lot of their time, fiddling around with cornie porno, bio-fuels and backyard windmills. But when you finally feel that POP, and it may be while you are reading "Overshoot" (for Pstarr I think it was reading Kunstler), a sense of certainty and clarity just washes over you, and it is really a very special moment of doomer sensuality. When it's over, the best thing you can do is just step outside, have a cigarette, and quietly look to the heavens as you think to yourself "this is SO fucked up." [smilie=XXsmoker.gif]

(Those who don't know what I'm talking about just haven't experienced it yet.)


...and in that moment, you really fucking do become a whole different person, because your old reality just went buh-bye.

Twas Heinberg that popped my cherry.

Olaf
Olaf
 
Top

Hello!

Postby welshgreen » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 14:58:29

Hello all! My name is Scott and I live in wales. I am currently on an mechanical engineer apprenticeship for an engineering company, based at a Chevron refinery! Im surprised at the lack of knowledge of PO amongst my fellow employees. anyways ill look forward to posting here.
User avatar
welshgreen
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue 01 Apr 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Hello!

Postby Bas » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 15:55:40

welcome, Welshgreen :) looking forward to your contributions.
Bas
 

Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 16:02:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', 'T')echnology WILL sort out our energy problems, this is where the skills etc I mentioned previously America has will come into play, but as to the associated social costs, changes, and incessant population rise, I think only “him up there” has the picture at the moment.


GASMON, think about this: on what is your belief based that technology WILL sort out our energy problems? I'm not saying that belief is invalid, but please think about the assumptions on which that statement is based.

Think about it like this: assume you have a fast car and you say "This car WILL haul ass." A key assumption built into that statement is that the car has gas in it. Without gas, the car won't haul ass.

When it comes to technology, the problem is not that we can't conceive of technology that will solve our problems; rather, we just don't appreciate the amount of cheap energy it would take to make that technology actually work. When the problem you are attempting to solve with technology is resource depletion, and the technology you come up with is very resource-intensive, try to see how this can be a problem.

And it's a VERY frustrating problem, because it neutralizes much of what we are good at (i.e., building and innovating our way out of problems).
:)
User avatar
BigTex
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3858
Joined: Thu 03 Aug 2006, 03:00:00
Location: Graceland
Top

Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Iaato » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 16:48:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', 'A')nd it's a VERY frustrating problem, because it neutralizes much of what we are good at (i.e., building and innovating our way out of problems).


We just spent 150 years selecting for competitive growth in our civilization. Examine any technology and the development over time reflects this style of reacting to energy inputs. As a civilization we are optimized for rapid, exclusive overgrowth to use the vast amounts of excess energy inputs in our society. The maximum power principle explains why technology is so sexy, yet so deadly during an era of declining resources:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '4').Societies compete for economic survival by Lotka's principle (see Ref. 3), which says that systems win and dominate that maximize their useful total power from all sources and flexibly distribute this power toward needs affecting survival.

The programs of forests, seas, cities, and-countries survive that maximize their system's power for useful purposes. The first requirement is that opportunities to gain inflowing power be maximized, and the second requirement is that energy utilization be effective and not wasteful as compared to competitors or alternatives. For further discussion see Lotka (Ref. 3) and Odum (Ref. 1).

5. During times when there are opportunities to expand one's power inflows, the survival premium by Lotka's principle is on rapid growth even though there may be waste.

We observe dog-eat-dog growth competition every time a new vegetation colonizes a bare field where the immediate survival premium is first placed on rapid expansion to cover the available energy receiving surfaces. The early growth ecosystems put out weeds of poor structure and quality, which are wasteful in their energy-capturing efficiencies, but effective in getting growth even though the structures are not long lasting. Most recently, modern communities of man have experienced two hundred years of colonizing growth, expanding to new energy sources such as fossil fuels, new agricultural lands, and other special energy sources. Western culture, and more recently, Eastern and Third World cultures, are locked into a mode of belief in growth as necessary to survival. "Grow or perish" is what Lotka's principle requires, but only during periods when there are energy sources that are not yet tapped. Figure 3 shows the structure that must be built in order to be competitive in processing energy.

6. During times when energy flows have been tapped and there are no new sources, Lotka's principle requires that those systems win that do not attempt fruitless growth but instead use all available energies in long-staying, high-diversity, steady-state works.

Whenever an ecosystem reaches its steady state after periods of succession, the rapid-net-growth specialists are replaced by a new team of higher-diversity, higher-quality, longer-living, better-controlled, and stable components. Collectively, through division of labor and specialization, the climax team gets more energy out of the steady flow of available source energy than those specialized in fast growth could.

Our system of man and nature will soon be shifting from rapid growth as the criterion of economic survival to steady-state non-growth as the criterion of maximizing one's work for economic survival (Figure 1). The timing depends only on the reality of one or two possibly high-yielding nuclear energy processes (fusion and breeder reactions) which may or may not be very yielding,

Ecologists are familiar with both growth states and steady state, and observe both in natural systems in their work routinely, but economists were all trained in their subject during rapid growth and most don't even know there is such a thing as steady state. Most economic advisors have never seen a steady state even though most of man's million year history was close to steady state. Only the last two centuries have seen a burst of temporary growth because of temporary use of special energy supplies that accumulated over long periods of geologic time.


http://www.mnforsustain.org/energy_ecol ... t_1973.htm
“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value ---- zero.” --Voltaire
User avatar
Iaato
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1008
Joined: Mon 12 Mar 2007, 03:00:00
Location: As close as I can get to the beginning of the pipe.
Top

Re: Hello!

Postby steam_cannon » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 20:09:33

Welcome, you've come across an important subject that will affect all
too many in this world...

Let us know if you have any questions and enjoy the ride! :-D

Image
User avatar
steam_cannon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 2859
Joined: Thu 28 Dec 2006, 04:00:00
Location: MA

Re: Hello!

Postby welshgreen » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 20:30:35

Thanks for the welcome!!
User avatar
welshgreen
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue 01 Apr 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Hello!

Postby Ferretlover » Tue 01 Apr 2008, 20:45:28

Welcome.
Find a seat in the stands and prepare to watch the Greatest Human Show on Earth as it unfolds before our very eyes!

BTW, my husband's family came from Wales (Llangadwaladr Parish, Isle of Anglesey, and Abberffraw, North Wales, etc) to the US in the mid 19th century.
"Open the gates of hell!" ~Morgan Freeman's character in the movie, Olympus Has Fallen.
Ferretlover
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 5852
Joined: Wed 13 Jun 2007, 03:00:00
Location: Hundreds of miles further inland

Finally became a member.

Postby Mquinon3 » Thu 03 Apr 2008, 21:47:01

I have been a faithful guest on this site for about a year now and will be starting my graduate sociology work in the fall which will be heavily focused on oil and conflict. I'm very excited to a part of this community.
User avatar
Mquinon3
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu 03 Apr 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Cashmere » Thu 03 Apr 2008, 22:43:12

Welcome. :razz:
User avatar
Cashmere
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1882
Joined: Thu 27 Mar 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby steam_cannon » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 01:39:20

Welcome, you're in a good place to get well thought out and diverse
perspectives relating to social issues and whatever floats your boat.
You can browse, make poles, ask questions and the more questions
you ask, the more answers you'll receive. And who knows, once in a
while they might even be what you're looking for! :-D
User avatar
steam_cannon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 2859
Joined: Thu 28 Dec 2006, 04:00:00
Location: MA

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby kpeavey » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 02:31:43

Its about time.

Mquinon3 wrote$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'g')raduate sociology work in the fall which will be heavily focused on oil and conflict

What an a propos field of specialization that is. What sort of future employment prospects does that lead to?
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--for ever."
-George Orwell, 1984
_____

twenty centuries of stony sleep were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle, and what rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
-George Yeats
User avatar
kpeavey
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 1670
Joined: Mon 04 Oct 2004, 03:00:00
Top

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Schadenfreude » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 02:43:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Mquinon3', 'I') have been a faithful guest on this site for about a year now and will be starting my graduate sociology work in the fall which will be heavily focused on oil and conflict. I'm very excited to a part of this community.


So tell us about what exactly you find interesting enough to want to warrant a graduate degree. Are you a devotee of Michael Klare or more interested in how people will react to the loss of lifestyle - like Kathy McMahon over at www.peakoilblues.com or something else?
Schadenfreude
 
Top

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Nano » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 04:16:41

If I were you, I wouldn't study such a field of sociology. I would study a field including how to deal with post-traumatic stress disorder in the (US)military. That seems to offer much better job prospects. Although some people would say that is a psychology topic, I believe it is more of a sociology topic.

Try to get involved with the military. In the field of sociology as well as psychology, I think there's going to be good job prospects for professionals who also have an interest in geopolitical developments, like yourself.
User avatar
Nano
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 333
Joined: Sun 16 Jan 2005, 04:00:00
Location: Delft, Netherlands

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Iaato » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 04:24:31

Welcome, Mquinon3. We need more sociologists around here. I look forward to hearing about your thesis as you go forward. And take the negativity here with a grain of salt; though if you've been lurking for a year you probably don't need a warning. By definition, everybody here is grieving in one way or another.
“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value ---- zero.” --Voltaire
User avatar
Iaato
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1008
Joined: Mon 12 Mar 2007, 03:00:00
Location: As close as I can get to the beginning of the pipe.

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Mquinon3 » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 09:03:53

Thnx for the interest, I plan on becoming very active here as I progress with my thesis work. I also majored in psychology, but as I become more informed about our current global resource issues I felt sociology would be more important for my own sake of knowledge. I'm not extremely concerned about doing this for the sake of employment oppurutnities, it just comes down to seeing how important it is and trying to develop theory work that will hopefully shed some much needed light in the academic field. I'd prefer to be employed in research with a university or some appropriate entity and becoming heavily involved in the community processes as we adapt to the scenarios we are facing.

My thesis work is going to focus on increasing global declines in oil and the conflict between nation-states as a result of it. There will also be focus on global and local processes that will be effected such as intra-state conflict and the change amongst industrial societies on both the local and national level as resource competition becomes a part of mainstream reality.

Yea, I've been reading the forums and part of the IRC chat for alittle bit and this seems like one of the best places to have discussions related to resource decline and global to local processes. I'm also familiar with the negativity here and hey its a part of the process. I consider myself a semi-doomer (will become a full fledged one when i gain more knowledge probably). Appreciate the warm welcome from everyone!!
User avatar
Mquinon3
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu 03 Apr 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Finally became a member.

Postby Nano » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 10:56:31

Mquinon, what are your thought on the apparent feeling among younger generation in the developed world that they are somehow 'entitled' to different forms of opulence and safety as have been the norm the last few decades? What are the consequences for developed societies of having this large (IMO) group of people who's expectations of permanent progress will turn out to be increasingly misguided?

On being a semi-doomer: I think there is no reason to become a fullfledged doomer at all concerning peak oil. Peak oil is just one of those things. Only misers become doomers due to things like peak oil. There are greater and older problems that have caused genuine feelings of doom in the past and will continue do so in the future, namely the permanent distress associated with the human condition in general. Someone who is fixed in knowledge is not perturbed by trifles such as peak oil.
User avatar
Nano
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 333
Joined: Sun 16 Jan 2005, 04:00:00
Location: Delft, Netherlands

New Member

Postby JBoulder » Fri 04 Apr 2008, 11:37:37

Hello All,

New member to the site and its nice to see an open discussion on PO. When I discuss PO with many of my family and friends, they consider me to be negative and fatalistic. It seems they ( and many people in the US) have a this belief of entitlement to a fossil fuel life and the possibility of being removed from this type of life is immediately dismissed in leu of technology or flat out denial.

In my opinion PO is a far-reaching topic where the lack of coverage in the mainstream is baffling.

Looking forward to chattin' with you all.

JBoulder
User avatar
JBoulder
Wood
Wood
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri 04 Apr 2008, 03:00:00

PreviousNext

Return to Welcome

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

cron