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Why did the stingray have to die?

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Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby billg » Thu 20 Mar 2008, 17:59:44

Woman dies after stingray strikes her

They should have put the spotted eagle ray back in the water and let it live. What a magnificent creature!
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby steam_cannon » Thu 20 Mar 2008, 22:38:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hy did the stingray have to die?

I sure wouldn't toss it back in the water for three reasons:

* I would be concentrating on my wife.

* I would be concerned about it injuring me.

* Police aren't going to listen to kids and they would lock me up if they
thought it was more probable that my wife got knocked upside the head
and shivved with a screw driver, VS a stingray attacked her sunbathing!
No one would believe that without a bloody stingray to examine.
Yeah and if the kids were below deck when it happened, with no
evidence, no witnesses, just a beaten dead body on my hand,
I'd be up the river for sure.

No way in hell would I toss that thing back!
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby billg » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 01:11:32

I can see all your points..well said.

I just read somewhere that some people actually fish for spotted eagle rays (and other stingrays) because they put up a really good fight. Now that is sick behavior...fishing for the pure entertainment of it.

I was strongly exposed to the whole sportfishing scene in FL when I was young kid and it didnt occur to me until later in life how lame it is be forcing hooks down the throats of barracudas, sailfish, tarpon and other gamefish that have no value as a food.
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby peaker_2005 » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 02:08:02

As it is, global fish stocks are dwindling, and demand has really picked up the last few years. A moratorium probably needs to be declared to allow stocks to recover.
"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." - Douglas Adams
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby jboogy » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 03:56:13

barracuda is delicious, you want to stay away from the big ones for eating as they have the accumulated mercury. Sportfishing is not the problem, most sportfishers release their catch if they're not going to eat it and there are limits on the number you can take of most species. Sportfishing is a drop in the bucket compared to the commercial catch. We used to call them ocean-rapers when we would pass one of the net boats, they would not even look at sport boats as they pass cause they know there's a good chance they'd get the finger.all kinds of stuff in their nets, half of it by-catch that would be dumped or ground-up for fertilizer.
Perhaps the population would be less swayed to socialism if we had fewer examples of socialism from our "Free Market Capitalists". -----fiddler dave
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby steam_cannon » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 11:25:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('billg', 'I') can see all your points..well said.
Just the first things that popped into my head.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('billg', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jboogy', 'S')portfishing is not the problem, most sportfishers release their catch if they're not going to eat it and there are limits on the number you can take of most species. Sportfishing is a drop in the bucket compared to the commercial catch.


It may be a drop in the bucket, but it is still sick to traumatize (and perhaps kill) another consciousness for the sake of entertainment. What is killing our planet is a mentality of separateness from all that exists around us... Yes, the commercial fishermen do a lot of damage, but it is the human psyche that underwrites all of it. The commercial fishers and sportfishers swim in the same pool of consciousness.
.
No, I'd say the sports fishermen care about the fish a lot more then the
purely profit driven fishing companies.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('peaker_2005', 'A')s it is, global fish stocks are dwindling, and demand has really
picked up the last few years. A moratorium probably needs to be
declared to allow stocks to recover.
Maybe, but at this point I have my doubts about how much good it will do.

No fishing in an acid ocean! 2030 all fishs are dead? CO2+
http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic34941.html
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby mekrob » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 12:15:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he message that reverberated around the world is that the ocean is not a playground for human indulgence and all indiscretions will be dealt with swift justice.


Swift justice? We've been raping the oceans for decades with commercial fishing with little or no hesitation and many stocks are near their end. And a stingray kills a single person and that's justice? It took decades for this to happen and it's swift?

We have radically different ideas of swiftness and justice.
I want to put out the fires of Hell, and burn down the rewards of Paradise. They block the way to God. I do not want to worship from fear of punishment or for the promise of reward, but simply for the love of God. - Rabia
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby billg » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 13:38:55

steamcannon wrote:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')o, I'd say the sports fishermen care about the fish a lot more then the
purely profit driven fishing companies.


If your sole purpose is to catch and then release fish for fun, then I think that is psychotic behavior. The fish has just swallowed a hook (happens often), fought for its life for half an hour, then the line is cut leaving it to die a slow painful death. "Caring" is hardly the right word.

If you are fisherman, you are quite aware of some of the awful sounds that fish can make when they are in pain (like the grunting of a catfish and the screech of a stingray).
Last edited by billg on Fri 21 Mar 2008, 17:20:29, edited 2 times in total.
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby billg » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 13:55:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mekrob', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he message that reverberated around the world is that the ocean is not a playground for human indulgence and all indiscretions will be dealt with swift justice.


Swift justice? We've been raping the oceans for decades with commercial fishing with little or no hesitation and many stocks are near their end. And a stingray kills a single person and that's justice? It took decades for this to happen and it's swift?

We have radically different ideas of swiftness and justice.


Well, on a geological time scale, humans are about to be dealt a swift blow that they won't easily recover from. The oceans are about to rise up and pummel their plunderers. The heroic flying spotted eagle ray is simply a harbinger of dark times to come.
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby steam_cannon » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 20:27:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('billg', 'W')ell, on a geological time scale, humans are about to be dealt a
swift blow that they won't easily recover from. The oceans are
about to rise up and pummel their plunderers. The heroic flying
spotted eagle ray is simply a harbinger of dark times to come.
There is some truth to this, however the way you say it, it sounds
like you are happy people will be suffering (though do to their own folly).
You come off sounding like you simply don't care for people.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('billg', '[')b]steamcannon wrote:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')o, I'd say the sports fishermen care about the fish a lot more then the
purely profit driven fishing companies.

If your sole purpose is to catch and then release fish for fun, then I
think that is psychotic behavior. The fish has just swallowed a hook
(happens often), fought for its life for half an hour, then the line is
cut leaving it to die a slow painful death. "Caring" is hardly the right word.

If you are fisherman, you are quite aware of some of the awful
sounds that fish can make when they are in pain (like the grunting
of a catfish and the screech of a stingray).
That's a very dramatic view you have. Personally I really don't care
about the sounds fish make. And though I prefer to cook fish, I still
think fishermen who throw some of them back to die still are more
concerned about continuing their practice then corporate fisheries.

Speaking of drama, lets not forget the suffering of the worms too.
Impaled and slowly drowned while having pieces nibbled off.
And just imagine the suffering of worms in a compost toilet!
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')She felt that the worms were being unfairly treated, being
expected to deal with human faeces, and that it could affect them in
a psychological way," Bell told the newspaper.

"I said, 'Well, what do I do about that?' and she said, 'You have to
have someone with the necessary qualifications to say the worms are happy'."

http://outonawimb.blogspot.com/2007/12/ ... worms.html

Seriously, don't waste your time trying to save every fly, every
worm, and every fish. Thinking that way is a problem.
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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby billg » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 22:29:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('steam_cannon', 'T')here is some truth to this, however the way you say it, it sounds like you are happy people will be suffering (though do to their own folly). You come off sounding like you simply don't care for people.


I don't care for the plundering.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')And just imagine the suffering of worms in a compost toilet!
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')She felt that the worms were being unfairly treated, being
expected to deal with human faeces, and that it could affect them in
a psychological way," Bell told the newspaper. "I said, 'Well, what do I do about that?' and she said, 'You have to have someone with the necessary qualifications to say the worms are happy'."


Well, I'm a big composting toilet and vermicomposting advocate. I have spent many hours cleaning out humanure from large composting toilet chambers. I actually inoculated one of the chambers with red wigglers. I can testify that those worms looked pretty damn happy.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')eriously, don't waste your time trying to save every fly, every
worm, and every fish. Thinking that way is a problem.


I don't. We were talking about fish that are fished for amusement.
"It is no measure of health to be deemed sane in an insane society" J. Krishnamurti

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Re: Why did the stingray have to die?

Unread postby Magus » Fri 21 Mar 2008, 23:44:09

[quote=billg]If you are fisherman, you are quite aware of some of the awful sounds that fish can make when they are in pain (like the grunting of a catfish and the screech of a stingray).[/quote]

Fish make noises? 8O (Obviously, you can infer here that I am not a fisherman...still, I have fished once or twice and have never heard a fish make one sound. Pardon my ignorance.

[quote=billg]

Golem...think of the Stingray as a suicide bomber (and a willing one at that). It was willing to sacrifice its life in order to bring a little justice to its extended family within the sea. No doubt, it was able to discern that the intended target was sunbathing on a motorboat, rather than a sailboat.

This noble warrior of the sea carried out its task with such forethought and precision that it managed to take the global airwaves hostage for a full day. The message that reverberated around the world is that the ocean is not a playground for human indulgence and all indiscretions will be dealt with swift justice. If I had any patience, I would write a poem about this most heroic spotted eagle ray. [/quote]

Funny...I was thinking the same thing in my mind when I read the story! I guess great minds really do think alike.

Crocodile Hunter was only the beginning! :shock:

Now all we need is a picture of a stingray strapped in explosives...
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