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THE 55 MPH Thread (merged)

How to save energy through both societal and individual actions.

do you support lowering the maximum speed limit to 55 mph?

yes
43
No votes
no
27
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Total votes : 70

Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby Doly » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 03:50:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', '
')Right now, time is more valuable than oil. Sorry.


Yes, that's what everybody thinks now. We're all out of time because companies are trying to squeeze as much time as they possibly can out of us, plus save money by having their offices in some out-of-the way place. And this happens because they have to do it to grow.

Unfortunately, economic growth was the wrong goal to pursue all along, and it may even become completely impossible very soon.

The only people that will manage OK in the coming times aren't the ones that aren't trying to play the game according to the current rules, but the ones that see that the game will soon be over, and get out of it before the whole economy comes crashing down. In other words, those who quit their job and find an occupation that will keep them going post PO.

The time that you save or don't save now is irrelevant. The question is: will your time be worth anything at all post PO?
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby fireplaceguy » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 03:50:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', '
')You're thinking that if we start conserving, 100 million Indians are not going to want to add air conditioning to their uninsulated homes?

Ok.......

I'm flabbergasted at how many people don't get this. Not only do they want A/C, they all yearn for a gruesome little Indian version of the Trabant as well!

Environmentalists claim to stand for resposnible energy use, yet they show no qualms about inflicting hardship on Americans to save a little extra oil for the countries who are the world's worst polluters.

Methinks that if the left was really that stupid they'd make a mistake in America's favor now and then...
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby fireplaceguy » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 04:34:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', '
')Right now, time is more valuable than oil. Sorry.


Yes, that's what everybody thinks now....
...The time that you save or don't save now is irrelevant. The question is: will your time be worth anything at all post PO?


Note to Doly and all like thinkers: If PO is upon us, the time we save now is highly relevant. Whether we have weeks, months or even a few years, the spare hours we can create between now and then are VERY precious.

Like many, I presently work in a large metropolitan area. There is no feasible way for me to operate without covering hundreds of miles a week. A 10 MPH reduction in my travel speed would be crippling at best. That's an entire evening stolen from me every week for a few dollars worth of gas.

Do you have NO loved ones? NO interests? NO friends? NO pets or even a houseplant?

Is your time GENUINELY worthless?

If you were going to die tomorrow morning, what would you give for another evening? DO THE MATH. The hours left in this day are available to you exactly ONCE.

If your time is irrelevant then it follows that you are irrelevant as well. Not pretty, but there you go...

As to me, my time is worth a great deal now and it will be worth just as much (maybe more) post peak. Why? Because I'm smart enough to recognise the value of things like, well, time!
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby sventvkg » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 06:52:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Dreamtwister', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'Y')ou dont travel much do you. 55 MPH is horrific.


No, in fact I don't any more. But if I do need to travel, 55 MPH is around 90 km/h and I find that speed perfectly reasonable.

And please don't go on about how "spread out" everything in the states is, it's just as "spread out" in Canada, if not more so.


Well, I do travel and I dont want to piss my life away at 55.

More to the point, I dont want to be punished with all the other midless fucktards. I bought a car that gets exceptional milage. I can literally do 85 with the AC on and get better milage then 99% of the cars on the road.
Why the hell should I be constrained because of anothers desire to drive a car that gets 14 MPG?


I agree...55mph is just too friggin slow..I do not need the government telling me what to do...I drive 70 and I'm perfectly safe.
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby azreal60 » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 08:30:34

As I would hardly be one to support 55 mph when I never obey it myself, (shhhh) I'm just going to ask a question of rwwff. So, I'm a Dem. Not your usual dem though. I really don't see guns as much as a cause of crime as a tool that makes crime worse. I think however there are alot of things that you could do to bring crime down that don't involve guns.

So here's my proposal. I'll require everything legal currently to register guns. I don't think anyone would argue with not wanting guns in the hands of felons and the like, so ya gotta do some paperwork when buying a gun. I won't say I'm going to support CCR or what ever you called the concealed carrying thing, because I would say that's exactly the wrong route. Basically the only time's I've seen a gun become a really bad thing is when it's suddenly produced. It turned a situation undercontrol into a situation that very rapidly esculated out of control.
Instead, I'll say nationwide right to carry in the open. If I know a person has a gun, I can treat them accordingly from the get go. If you don't want to deal with the social consquences of carrying a gun, well, tough. If you don't like how people treat you, then don't carry one. =)

I personally plan to own many firearms, and I'm not going to buy this bullshit of dems going after your guns. That's a bunch of crap. They only did even the small things they did do because the cops who advised them where telling them this is a good idea. Mostly because those same cops where getting their asses shot off by better equiped criminals.

So, would you then stop basing your voting on a silly knee jerk reaction to firearms? Dear god, if we reach the point where you have to resist your government with firearms, then I really don't think it's much going to matter which party is in power. I never understood the whole I'm going to hole up here and if the government comes calling they'll get a peice of my gun collection thought. I mean, you really think they wouldn't dig your butt out if you where an isolated case? And if your not (an isolated case), you really think they would even try? There are alot of things you could be resisting. Heck, join the ACLU and rescue it from the current crop of wayy too far left liberals holding it. As they said in the American president, here is an organization dedicated to defending the constitution. How can you argue with that? Get it to defend you for a change. =)
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby rwwff » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 11:12:22

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('azreal60', '
')So here's my proposal. I'll require everything legal currently to register guns. I don't think anyone would argue with not wanting guns in the hands of felons


This is already done.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Instead, I'll say nationwide right to carry in the open. If I know a person has a gun, I can treat them accordingly from the get go. If you don't want to deal with the social consquences of carrying a gun, well, tough. If you don't like how people treat you, then don't carry one. =)


Unfortunately, as this completely violates the 10th amendment, it'd have to be in the form of a constitutional amendment.

I don't have anything against the idea of open carry, but it'll need to be advertised with paid-for PSA's during prime time to inform everyone that it is in fact legal to open carry anywhere, any time; no public acomodation, no business with 10 or more employees, and no retail establishment that collects sales tax may hinder in any way a persons right to carry openly. It'd have to be granted the same job protections as religious affiliation. Specific mentions of liability release for those same companies have to be made. Descrimination based upon carrying a weapon openly would have to be considered legitimate grounds for legal compensation.

And see, there's the rub, to make open carry work in the real world, it has to get quite complicated legally. All those hoops go away by simply making the gun conceealed, and you lose nothing safety wise, the number of unlawful uses by ccw holders compared to the number unlawful uses by non-ccw holders is vanishingly small.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')I personally plan to own many firearms, and I'm not going to buy this bullshit of dems going after your guns. That's a bunch of crap.


Doesn't really matter whether you buy it or not. They *did* it. They haven't apologized, nor made even a symbolic repeal vote. We took it back by political force. I have no reason to believe the Dems would act any differently if they regained power.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')They only did even the small things they did do because the cops who advised them where telling them this is a good idea. Mostly because those same cops where getting their asses shot off by better equiped criminals.


EXCUSES.

Thats because most cops walk around with just a handgun. That makes them the worst equipped people on the planet to go into battle. Battle requires a rifle. Single shot, bolt action, semi-auto, or auto, whatever. Just about any centerfire rifle outclasses by a mile, all police carried sidearms.

As long as rifles are in the civilian population, cops will continue to get their asses shot off when they engage riflemen with their service sidearms.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')So, would you then stop basing your voting on a silly knee jerk reaction to firearms? Dear god, if we reach the point where you have to resist your government with firearms,


I don't intend to ever have to resist my government with firearms. The ballot box is much better, as has been proven over the last decade.

Besides, its not knee jerk, its deeply considered, I thought about it for quite a while, and I always reconsider it before major elections. So far, each time I consider it, I've come to the same conclusion. The democrats, most particularly, New Englanders and Californians, absolutely do not want an armed civilian population. Which to me implies, that they want everyone exclusively dependent upon the state for their personal security. They can make excuses and dress it up as much as they wish, but I'm only interested in their actions, not their words. Their actions tell me everything I need to know about them. Let me know when they *do* something relevant.
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby azreal60 » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 11:59:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'a')zreal60 wrote:

So here's my proposal. I'll require everything legal currently to register guns. I don't think anyone would argue with not wanting guns in the hands of felons


This is already done.


That was my point. As in, not going any farther.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Unfortunately, as this completely violates the 10th amendment, it'd have to be in the form of a constitutional amendment.


How and why? Perhaps I'm not as up on my constitution as I would like, but how does this violate the 10th amendment?



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')don't have anything against the idea of open carry, but it'll need to be advertised with paid-for PSA's during prime time to inform everyone that it is in fact legal to open carry anywhere


First off, why? I don't see any need to advertise this. If it's law it's law. If someone objects you have the law on your side. That's kinda the point. I do however have one thing to say about the last word, and that's anywhere. I don't see any reason this protection can't be taken away on private or federal property. If your visiting that property, there is no reason you can't surrender your firearm for the duration of your stay. I'm sorry, but guns in a courtroom? In a classroom? That's like saying, please, shoot me. If your advocating guns for self defense, those buildings should be secure. If they aren't, guns aren't going to solve the problem. If your advocating guns for defense against your government, if your bringing guns to a courthouse or other public building, I think you have bigger problems to contend with than if it was legal to carry the weapon.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hey *did* it. They haven't apologized, nor made even a symbolic repeal vote. We took it back by political force. I have no reason to believe the Dems would act any differently if they regained power


Why should they apologize for doing what the majority of their constituants Told them to do? What they where begging them with tears in their eyes to do? That's kinda their job. Even if they where an avid gun collector, if your constituants tell you to do something, you damn well do it. At least if it's not a really stupid idea. The reason any gun control at all happened is because while in the countryside you might not have had a gun problem, in the city it was increasingly easy for children to get their hands on them. And they where using them. Not to mention criminals. Now adays that problem is largely undercontrol due to gun control measures. We will always have gun crime. But in the 80's and 90's it was reaching ridiculous proportions. Something had to be done, and it was done. Guess what, it worked. Crime is way down. And low and behold, not one hunter or self defense nut who wasn't hording military hardware was disarmed. No one "took away your guns" as I've heard enough to make me puke. They might have Bought them, but they didn't take them away.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s long as rifles are in the civilian population, cops will continue to get their asses shot off when they engage riflemen with their service sidearms

Bull. The problem is not centerfire rifles. Hunting weapons are large weapons, easier to spot, and hence easier to defend against. It's the concealable and small fully auto weapons that should stay banned. If you want to defend yourself, a pistol works just fine. The problems with cops where not them engaging rifles with pistols, as most criminals are horrible shots anyway. It was them enganging criminals with fully auto weapons. Fully auto means someone is going to get hit, even if it's not the intended target. I'm sorry, but I haven't heard one reason why people who are hunting and defending themselves need fully automatic weapons. That's all the dems ever went after. And frankly, they should continue to go after it. If your skilled enough with a weapon it's an effective deterent for crime, your skilled enough to use a semi auto anyway. Semi auto means you have to mean it when you pull that trigger. Not just pull and spray, your aiming at something. It's not just a philisophical difference. It makes a huge difference in terms of lives lost, and in terms of what the gun is used for.


I could debate you all day with this, but I have a feeling you convinced yourself how you where going to believe this long before I met you. In the interests of assuming you have an open mind, again, I'm totally for the right to bear arms. I just don't think there is a reason we can't say fully automatic weapons aren't the arms our founding fathers had in mind when they wrote that passage. They wanted people to be able to resist governmental agression, not slaughter dozens of innocents because they happened to be in range. If your willing to aim and kill, fine. It takes alot less work to spray away. I want to make it something to work for.
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby rwwff » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 14:05:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('azreal60', '
')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hey *did* it. They haven't apologized, nor made even a symbolic repeal vote. We took it back by political force. I have no reason to believe the Dems would act any differently if they regained power


Why should they apologize for doing what the majority of their constituants Told them to do?


If they want my vote, or those like me, union members, generic middle class folks, then they will apologize. If they don't want our vote, thats fine with me, they don't have to apologize then.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')military hardware was disarmed. No one "took away your guns" as I've heard enough to make me puke. They might have Bought them, but they didn't take them away.


No, but they made me sell one that I couldn't quite figure out how to make sure it was in full compliance with the law. But thats neither here, nor there.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s long as rifles are in the civilian population, cops will continue to get their asses shot off when they engage riflemen with their service sidearms


Bull. The problem is not centerfire rifles. Hunting weapons are large weapons, easier to spot, and hence easier to defend against. It's the concealable and small fully auto weapons that should stay banned.


Bull right back.

No one suggested making those weapons unregulated. But the '93 bill didn't have anything to do with full auto weapons. It banned semi-automatic, medium velocity, hunting rifles that had certain cosmetic features that made them look "cool" to certain folks.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')I could debate you all day with this, but I have a feeling you convinced yourself how you where going to believe this long before I met you.


At least I had the honesty to read and understand the law that was passed in '93. Did you actually read the text of the "Assault Weapon Ban"??? You act like you know what a semi automatic weapon is, but apparently you don't realize that semi auto weapons were the only weapons addressed by the "Assault Weapon Ban".

Fortunately, that law sunsetted itself a couple years ago. So its gone. Haven't noticed much of an uptick in machine gun deaths. Not surprising, since the law didn't have anything to do with machine guns!!!


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') just don't think there is a reason we can't say fully automatic weapons aren't the arms our founding fathers


I don't have a problem with the ban on full auto weapons. But again, full automatic weapons are not mentioned in the Assualt Weapons Ban of 1993.
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Re: Hildebeast pushes for 55 MPH speed limit

Postby Geko45 » Fri 02 Jun 2006, 14:33:13

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', 'I') don't have a problem with the ban on full auto weapons. But again, full automatic weapons are not mentioned in the Assault Weapons Ban of 1993.

This is correct, the 1993 Assault Weapons Ban did not address fully automatic weapons (machine guns) at all. These are and always have been regulated by the National Firearms Act of 1934. It is relevant to note that the NFA did not ban these weapons outright, but rather it taxed and regulated them heavily. It is still possible today to apply for and get a class 3 license to own a fully automatic weapon from the BATF, but the process is extremely long, costly and difficult.

Getting back to the Assault Weapons Ban, I think informed people on both sides of the debate agree that this law was completely useless. All the weapons that were available before the ban were still available after the ban. Manufacturers simply removed one or more trivial features to remain in compliance. These were features such as flash suppressors, collapsible stocks, pistol grips, and bayonet lugs, none of which alter the basic function of the weapon. In fact, the only provision of the bill that had any meaningful effect was limiting magazine capacity to 10 rounds. Even then, the only people that noticed were sport shooters who then had to reload more often when they went to the range.
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THE 55 MPG Thread (merged)

Postby phaster » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 23:14:00

Just wondering how other believers in a peak would react to a federal mandate to reduce max speed limits back to 55 mph?
I'd personally support changing the limit downward because it's a question of basic physics and efficency, the slower ya drive the less energy ya need, hence less CO2 is released into the atmosphere. This is one step I think can solve the problem of climate change and peak oil.

But as it stands I don't think 99.9% of politicians or political leaders have the balls or brains to take decisive action (esp after watching this news report on political hypocrisy in Texas)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eG6X-xtVask
Last edited by phaster on Fri 28 Sep 2007, 23:22:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby emailking » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 23:18:47

It would be good and would also mean less deaths, but I doubt we'll see it happen unless/until things get pretty bad.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby Revi » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 23:19:51

My little pickup doesn't go much more than 55 anyway. I think it's a great idea. People will freak out, but that's the way it goes. We all need to slow down anyway. It would save huge amounts of gas.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby kpeavey » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 00:09:17

to sell such an idea to the public, rather than explain how much fuel it would save and how it would reduce our dependence on foreign oil and all sorts of environmental stuff, we will need a short and simple slogan that also shows how much the government cares about the people it [s]subjugates[/s] serves...

55 SAVES LIVES
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--for ever."
-George Orwell, 1984
_____

twenty centuries of stony sleep were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle, and what rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
-George Yeats
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby SILENTTODD » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 00:20:56

I came of age shortly before the shortly before the "first" oil crisis of 1973. I had only been driving 2 years.
Ever since then I have made it an endeavor to try and nurse every last mile out of every tank of gas. Because even then I knew this was going to happen again.

I have never owned anything but fuel efficient compact cars or small trucks.
To this day I drive under 60 mph in the slow lanes. I try to find a large slow truck or someone towing a trailer or boat to follow.

As pointed out above, strict adherence to 55mph would reduce the number and severity of accidents. Greatly improve your fuel mileage, and reduce wear and tear on your vehicle. The small truck I'm driving now I bought new 20 years ago and it just went over 300,000 miles with the same engine.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby Jack » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 00:22:24

I suggest a search for Jevon's paradox.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby SchroedingersCat » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 01:01:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1')2/1/42 Gas rationing and a 35 mph speed limit on all roads that had been in effect along the East Coast for 7 months was extended nationally to conserve gasoline and rubber during World War II

Now we're talking.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby Tanada » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 07:29:36

55 is a pointless excercise of feelgoodism coupled with revenue enhancment for the local authorities.
It never accomplished a damn thing in terms of fuel or life savings because the VAST majority ignored it. Life is too short and driving faster saves time to do other things. In order to really enforce 55 you would have to have hundreds of additional patrol cars and police/enforcement officers.

Police/sherriff HATE 55 enforcement, the most dangerous thing they can do on the job is pull over random cars. More enforcement officers are killed doing that one aspect of their job than any other. This makes them both irritated and tense when approaching a motorist. Not a happy situation when the enforcement officer is armed and traffic is whizzing by, either of which can lead to death. A percentage of officers are hit by traffic every year, and a larger percentage end up in confrontations with stupid people or criminals who feel they have nothing to lose.

It is not fair to put officers in this position, it makes average citizens more likely to despise them on sight AND it puts them at increased risks for what is very low pay to start with. It also needs draconian levels of police presence to effectively enforce. We don't need a bigger police state, thank you very much. No on 55.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby Heineken » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 08:34:12

I think we should increase it to 75. Then our signs will match our current behavior. Then, as drivers adjust to 85, CO2 levels will be decreased by all the extra fatalities.
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby TheDude » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 08:41:00

I can't drive 55.

Image

How about just putting governors in cars?
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Re: how would ya feel bring back the 55 MPH speed limit?

Postby TheTurtle » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 08:45:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheDude', 'H')ow about just putting governors in cars?

OK, I claim this governor. :-D

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