[MonteQuest]

U.S. is slashing world food aid contributions
Dec 19, 2004 By John Murphy / Sun Foreign Staff:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'J')OHANNESBURG, South Africa - Crop failures in Afghanistan, conflict in Sudan and a half-dozen other humanitarian disasters have sharply increased demands on the United States' food aid program, forcing the American government to cancel food shipments.

[Tyler_JC]

This is the season of giving and all, but shouldn't we reduce suffering here before we help others?
We have to pay our bills, let them figure out a way to pay theirs.

Also, a smaller population is better than a larger one in terms of PO. I see no problem with cutting food aid to foreign countries.
It's harsh, but that's life.

[Gux]

Good Point, Tyler_JC. Maybe this is the 'civilized' beginnings of the great die-off as suggested in other topics? Countries like the U.S. will eventually need to contract somewhat in order to survive themselves.

[Jack]

Hmm...sounds like the end of (ahem) cornucopian idealism.

I'm glad our leadership is finally acting a bit more responsibly!

[smiley]

I have mixed feelings on Africa. On the one hand we should help these people. On the other hand it is just so pointless. We've been helping Africa for many years now and what has changed? I know a few people who worked there for charity and they came back disillusioned.

At the risk of generalizing, it almost seems that Africa doesn't want to prosper. If you look at it all its current problems are avoidable. Africa is a very rich country in terms of resources. They could be self sufficient in food. Especially countries like Nigeria have a large amount of mineable resources. Africa has so much potential. Yet they seem to be too occupied in tribal quarrels, corruption etc. to use these resources.

You could blame that on the governments, but I find it hard to believe that not a single African nation has been capable of developing long term stability and a thriving economy. Widespread corruption for instance exists only because people allow it to exist.

Since a few years I have a Ghanese neighbor. What he is saying is that if you want to develop yourself you have to leave Africa because the people don't allow you to develop yourself. Isn't personal initiative the key to long term prosperity?

I believe that what you need is a change of mentality. Until that happens aid is useless.

[cmlek]

To quote a famous comedian:

"We spend all this money sending truckloads of food to starving people in Africa. But have you looked at the land? A million years ago it was sand! A million years from now it'll be sand! Stop sending food in trucks, send the trucks, fill them with people and take them to where the food is!"

I have mixed emotions on this one. I don't think we should be the world's food pantry any more than we should be the world's police force. But there are 2 reasons that I think Africa could use our help:

A) Long-standing ethnic wars are the hardest things to get rid of. It usually takes someone who comes in and takes all the children away/forcibly re-educates all the children to get it to die. Just look at Israel and Palestine. That's been going on how many hundred years now? And if nothing else, while we're pissing off the rest of the world, why not stop a war while we're at it?

B) I'm not trying to start a slavery debate here, but the period where Europe and the US were importing slaves really demolished the established cultures of Africa. Bear in mind, Africa had her own large cities and grand cultures, many of which we've either never learned about or have forgotten. Egypt is in Africa. Timbuktu was a great trade city, not just a far away place. (Current American English usage) There is WAY more to it than just jungles, elephants, natives and the pith-helmeted English hunters.

"The Atlantic Slave Trade had enormous negative effects on the continent of Africa. As was mentioned above in regards to the Kongo Kingdom, many parts of Africa suffered from an increase in violence, drain of people, and an economy increasingly reliant on slavery. Over four hundred years of slave trade had transformed the African Continent from coastal regions (where most of the trading with Europeans took place) all the way to the interior of Africa (where many slaves were captured to be sold.) Despite the tremendous consequences of the Atlantic Slave Trade on Africa, Africans still continued to make important progress during this time in areas such as literacy, metal working, and textile production. However, there is no doubt that the Atlantic Slave Trade changed the face of the earth in many ways and presented a huge challenge to Africa in trying to recover from this brutal period of her history."

http://exploringafrica.matrix.msu.edu/c ... tyone.html is a really good place for starters to go explore the history of it.

*shrug* As far as I know, all my ancestors were too far north in Europe to have anything to do with the slave trade, and are fairly recent to America, so we weren't around for slavery's heyday. But I feel .... I guess somewhat guilty having grown up in America and slowly becoming aware that much of the history and infrastructure I take for granted was created by hurting these other people. (And no one'll teach you that part in school!)

To sum up: I think the situation in Africa has grown beyond the ability of the US to fix or even allieviate. However, I feel we still share some responsibility for it, and have a duty to keep trying to help, even if we can't help on as grand a scale as we used to. (I admit, I'm 24, young and naive. Any voices of experience who want to add new info to change my mind?)

[The_Virginian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')We've been helping Africa for many years now and what has changed?

[SD_Scott]

Well, it's been a 100 mile long gravy train for a LOT of welfare countries. Sad to say, but I believe some of them have missed their chance. Jeffersonian democracy really is a very rare thing in this world.

[MonteQuest]

This post by rowante is from another thread: America's Gruesome Jewelry by Aaron: http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic2439.html


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')ost recent famines in Africa have been caused by war, and the responsibility for those famines belongs squarely within Africa itself.

[0mar]

I think you guys should read about the raping of Africa from the mid 1800s to the present. The Europeans literally carved Africa like a turkey in a quest for gold and slaves.

[The_Virginian]

The Arabains did pretty good in the North and East of Afrika themselves.

[smiley]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') think you guys should read about the raping of Africa from the mid 1800s to the present. The Europeans literally carved Africa like a turkey in a quest for gold and slaves.

[drew]

Some compassion this time of year might be in order people. We have been instrumental in creating many of Africa's problems through systemic racism and exploitation. Our attempts at fostering democracy have meant any dictatorship that wasn't marxist. The west allowed South Africa to exist as a slave state for almost the entire last century. Yes, the dark continent has to shoulder some blame too, and yes these things are cultural; like not beleiving in aids, or birth control, or monogamous sexual behaviour. We in the west have done little to change this for the better and much to hinder it. For the record, Dubya and his christian zealot backers actually cut off aid to NGOs and countries that mention the words 'birth control' in discussions of family planning. The Roman Catholic Church does the exact same thing! Aids is a pandemic that will likely wipe out half the populations of some of these countries. As for American largesse, when it comes to food aid the US of A has the lowest level of contribution in the world as measured as a percent of GDP. The yanks are far too busy building weapons in order to kill people and thus have no money for anything else. As for you yanks, wait and see how little is left for the poor in your own country too before happily cheering about 'cutting off welfare' to other nations. Poor is poor, it doesn't matter where you are from.
Smile and give money to bums all year, it makes you feel good!
Drew

[0mar]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smiley', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') think you guys should read about the raping of Africa from the mid 1800s to the present. The Europeans literally carved Africa like a turkey in a quest for gold and slaves.

[smiley]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')o people on Earth, NO WHERE, has suffered as much as the Africans. Ever since the 1400s, the West has been continaully subjugating and enslaving Africans. The only group I'd put up there with the Africans is the Native North Americans.

[0mar]

We give them support with the left hand while stabbing them in the back with the right hand.

[smallpoxgirl]

Very well said Omar!

Could you perhaps recommend a good starter book on African History?

[0mar]

You could probably just google it or amazon.com it.

I took a class on African History and spent a year in Algeria where I learned most of this

[smiley]

Well you can blame a lot of people for the African suffering. You can certainly blame the Europeans for the slave trading and their efforts to convert Africa to Christianity. You can also blame the Ottomans for destroying the great African civilisations in Northern Africa like in Mali and Ethiopia.

That invasion was perhaps even more disastrous for Africa than the slave trading because it basically threw the Africans back to the stone age. During that period the africans even lost their written languages.

However looking at it from a historical perspective and finding someone to blame doesn't solve very much for the Africans. What we need are constructive ideas to solve Africa's perils.

On my travels through Northern Africa I've seen a number of aid projects, and so far I haven't really been impressed by their effectiveness. From what I see and hear, Southern and Central Africa are basically in the same state as they were despite of many years and billions worth of ''aid''. I personally think we should use a new approach.

What are your ideas on how we can help Africa?

[Jack]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cmlek', 'T')o sum up: I think the situation in Africa has grown beyond the ability of the US to fix or even allieviate. However, I feel we still share some responsibility for it, and have a duty to keep trying to help, even if we can't help on as grand a scale as we used to. (I admit, I'm 24, young and naive. Any voices of experience who want to add new info to change my mind?)