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PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

The One Party System . . .

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Unread postby Jack » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 00:29:23

[quote="maverickdoc"]Republican like democrats tend to be a “loose coalition of special interestsâ€
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Unread postby Jack » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 00:34:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', '
')People are adapted to recognizing short term problems - longer term changes are often invisible to us.

an absolute faith in the market
Its beginning to look like a short-term problem wouldn't you say? Means we'll soon get to test that faith in the market. Americans are very resourceful. I'm not ready to say we're done for - not yet.


As you say, this is starting to get peoples' attention. Some are even speaking, with some fear, of $3 per gallon gasoline. By and large, people haven't even imagined the dimensions of the Peak Oil problem.

I agree that we aren't done for. History has many examples of cultures that endured a lot and survived - it may be that we will come through this. Perhaps we'll achieve some of the unity we experienced during WWII.
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Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 00:50:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', '
') Some are even speaking, with some fear, of $3 per gallon gasoline.

Perhaps we'll achieve some of the unity we experienced during WWII.
$3 gas!!!! My God, the sky is falling! :lol: We'll need to pull together alright. This country could use some unity. And something to slap some reality into us all.
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Unread postby Yossarian » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 11:02:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut reality trumps ideology, and I have concluded that Peak Oil is reality.

Sadly you seem to be the exception to the rule, how to convince other Repub., especially Fundementalists :cry: to take the 'long view'
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Unread postby MonteQuest » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 11:18:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', '
')
In general, and recognizing a certain amount of cognitive dissonance in what I'm about to say, Republicans have preferred less government control and more use of the free market. The belief the free market will automatically solve shortages and problems is deeply ingrained - perhaps because it has, historically, worked well.


Good post, Jack. However, I tend to disagree with your premise here. From my perspective, the free market and capitalism has worked very poorly, and in fact, has lead us to this point in time. Up shit creek with no paddle. To stress my point, I offer the following quote by you:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')y now, you see the problem. The proponents of limits to growth favor the things Republicans oppose, and criticize those positions Republicans admire and value. Keep in mind that a large house in the 'burbs with a pair of SUV's can represent waste - or, from a different perspective, the just reward for a lifetime of hard work and striving.



It shall always be hard to find a consensus as long as there are such divergent world views. This peak oil debate will become the grand daddy of them all.
A Saudi saying, "My father rode a camel. I drive a car. My son flies a jet-plane. His son will ride a camel."
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perhaps less about politics and more about location

Unread postby JoeW » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 11:56:36

I think that the willingness to accept peak oil comes from having the ambition to find the answers, and the intelligence to understand the material. In the US, the perception is that the "blue states" are the more-educated states, and the "red states" are where the actual work gets done. I'm not making the stereotype, but just reporting the observation that this perception exists. As such, folks in the US may be inclined to think that the stereotypical New York liberal with a bachelor's degree probably has a lot more time and interest in geopolitics than the guy sitting on his tractor all day long out in Kansas.

Needless to say, there are plenty of highly intelligent, well-educated Republicans, and also plenty of blue-collar Democrats busting their humps to make America great.
But the reality doesn't change the perception.
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Unread postby DomusAlbion » Fri 18 Mar 2005, 12:06:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', ' ')Many people simply can't imagine something this dire. In their imaginative framework, peak oil is a chicken little thing -just goofy like the bearded crank with the sandwich sign saying 'The End Is Near!'


I would like to add one other dimension to what Jack wrote in reply to you.

That is the non-rational emotional and even psychological framework that many people, Republican or Democrat, get themselves into. That is, simply, that Peak Oil just does not fit in with their dreams and plans for their lives.

It was easy for my wife and me to initially accept the idea of Peak Oil because our life plans paralleled a strategy of seeking self sufficiency and a sense that the world could not continue as it is. So, we believed in the possibility enough that we (I really) took the time to investigate and read at least a half dozen books on the subject. It became in our psyches a real possibility.

On a personal note about politics and philosophy, I’ll tell you that we both came from blue collar, union-member, and Democrat families. We’re both Catholic but we’ve both tended to vote, for the most part, for Republican candidates over the last 20 years.

So, here is what I’m trying to get at. I believe that most people cannot accept psychically the set of ideas that surround Peak Oil because it shatters their construct of reality. Often they’re ambitious and have their lives planned out. Their dreams are set and they are set on a course to achieve those dreams and PO absolutely quashes those dreams. This is why they often react with such great emotion and open hostility to the idea and won’t even take to time to do some independent investigation.

PO kills their dreams, their hopes. Most people can’t accept that, not without a fight.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Carlhole » Tue 02 Jan 2007, 12:48:58

If George Bush is good enough for Jesus Christ, he's good enough for 'Merka. I say let's appoint him Preznet For Life and make it the One and Only Party of Gawwwwd!

http://weeklyradioaddress.com/DforD_Video_medium.htm
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby NEOPO » Tue 02 Jan 2007, 13:21:17

Its a one party NEO-na-zi-on-CON system indeed.
Image

My cards were already 99% in the bonfire but I voted anyways. Maybe we were just curious to see the machines. Maybe we just wanted something like the minimum wage hike to occur yet ultimately I am sure they will get that back at walmart, the pump or both.

I am firmly convinced that the 2000 election was stolen and that there was really no choice between either the bonesmen bush or kerry in 04'. Hmmm yeah everyone thought the Dem's were gonna get us the hell out of Iraq?~?

When they did not vote for Murtha I knew it was on 100%. Pelosi talking all nicey nicey. I was thinking "WhoTF is this bitch?!!?" Cant go back now - ashes to ashes. I am sure some people thought it would lead to a new 9/11 investigation etc etc.
It is easier to enslave a people that wish to remain free then it is to free a people who wish to remain enslaved.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby MD » Wed 10 Jan 2007, 18:52:55

The planners want to see an opposing voice coming into play.
There will be no reductions.
There are no elections.
The are only the players and the teams.
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Kingcoal » Thu 18 Jan 2007, 22:13:23

The easiest way for one party to win over another is to perpetuate the myth that "they are just as bad as us." Liberals are very susceptible to such a technique. Republicans have found that liberals are very easy to manipulate into disenfranchisement, which leads to them not voting...

I'm a democrat, but I'm not very liberal. I've come to the conclusion that most liberals are idiots who think they are superior. If they were so superior then they wouldn't be so easy to manipulate. The dems aren't perfect, but I like them better than the Republicans.
"That's the problem with mercy, kid... It just ain't professional" - Fast Eddie, The Color of Money
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Thu 18 Jan 2007, 22:55:56

Well, all of the stuff they are planning on doing is relatively popular and some of their ideas are actually fairly intelligent. We always need new ethics reforms because Congressmen are inherently corrupt. The Democrats will cut out some little loophole that the GOP currently enjoys using. After all, it was some piece of election reform that made the politicians have to approve their campaign messages.

Raising the minimum wage is supported by nearly 70% of the population. It's a political no-brainer. Stem Cell research offers the promise of longer and healthier lives for millions of Americans. Simply put, it's the right thing to do.

The cost of a college education is far too high for many American families to afford. We will need an educated population in order to deal with increased foreign competition and in order to deal with the consequences of Peak Oil.

So on the four issues that mentioned, the Democrats are doing the right thing in the eyes of the American people. We live in a Republic so the new Democratic Congress is merely doing its job. What happens after the first 100 hours is the kicker.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Thu 18 Jan 2007, 23:05:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', 'M')D, I like your posts. More evidence that there is only one party. Democrats will not block the troop increase - merely
sybolically complain. Republicrats

What do you expect them to do? Stop supporting our troops in the middle of a War? The War Powers Act gives the president the power to increase troop levels if he wants to.

In order to stop him, the Democrats would have to vote against funding US soldiers that are already in harms way. President Bush already made the decision to send in troops and these soldiers are already on their way to Iraq.

Cutting off funding now would be a disaster for the party's chances in 2008. Bush would call the Dem's bluff and tell the country that the army was in danger do to equipment shortages.

If the Democrats manage to capture the White House in 08, we can get the troops out of Iraq. Not everything in politics is short-sighted. People, people, people, they've been in charge for a week. Give them a break. 8)
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby gego » Thu 18 Jan 2007, 23:48:47

One party! You better be careful about such radical statements.

The majority of socialist aholes posting on this site might have shit fits over such a revealing statement.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Falconoffury » Fri 19 Jan 2007, 12:01:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')top supporting our troops in the middle of a War?

How about we support them as human beings, and not as troops.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby mmasters » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 16:04:32

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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby lateralus » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 19:27:23

America is a joke. They sell you peanuts at your own funeral and still you buy a bag, hey 50% less salt.....what a deal.
The Blue Bloods own your asses peasants. Wake up. The "largest democracy on Earth has only two parties". The left arm and the right arm...good luck with that....
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby gego » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 19:52:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lateralus', 'T')he Blue Bloods own your asses peasants. Wake up. The "largest democracy on Earth has only two parties". The left arm and the right arm...good luck with that....

You cannot confront people about their delusions; it only drives them deeper and creates the need to defend themselves. Most of those who believe in this system of voting for their masters are not going to give up the idea that voting is the evidence of freedom, or give up the even deeper delusion that government can command the world to change by passing laws.

For many in the USA government is the equivalent of religion, politicians are the equivalent of their priests and voting is the equivalent of attending their worship service. People who feel powerless are highly susectible to the promises of those offer to take care of them.

The magnitude of the problem can be measured by the percentage of the population who still vote. History shows that government is the antithesis of freedom, and in case you have not noticed, we have more government today than in any time in the history of the USA; soon, we will outdo Nazi Germany.
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Re: The One Party System . . .

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 20:13:49

I was trying to channel Nancy Pelosi...

I realize that neither party is addressing the big issues of illegal immigration, long term fiscal insolvency, energy depletion, and the rest.

The American people, on the other hand, don't seem to care about those issues. If they cared about those issues, public opinion polls would indicate that they cared and politicians would change their focus.

A republic often bows to the will of its people. Thus, we get what we voted for.

The Dems ran on a platform of stem cell research, ethics reform, minimum wage hikes, and education.

The American people mostly agree with the Democrats on those issues.

Both the Democratic Party and the American People will be pleased to see those new bills get passed.

The objective "good or bad for the country" argument is interesting but not important when discussing why a political party does what it does.
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