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Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 19:57:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gridlock', 'M')aybe it's better to clear this one up, as a few million quid for another investigation is small change (not loose change).


It won't clear it up; it'll make it worse.

Show me one that will clear it up, and I might be inclined otherwise. I gave a suggestion, a real, bipartisan suggestion, and it got stomped for the guys having something to do with "politics".

Your turn. Find me one that won't make it worse.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I')f there had been a decent investigation that addressed all the public's questions in the first place, we wouldn't be having the argument.


And so, after this all encompassing report is released, blasting Bush, and 5,624 conservative questioners then come forth with their lame-axe conspiracy questions blaming Clinton or Harry Reed or Monaca Lewinski, are we supposed to convene yet another commission, to create yet another all encompassing report????

It is NOT POSSIBLE to address all the public's questions, if only because the questions will keep coming until the end of time.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Gridlock » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:05:24

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')our turn. Find me one that won't make it worse.


Not sure what worse is. Worse for the repubs? They're doing a damn good job on their own wouldn't you say. OK, but surely it's relatively simple to put the CTs to rest. After all, they believe in moon mice. As this is having international repurcussions, let's turn it over to an international court maybe.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:16:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gridlock', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')our turn. Find me one that won't make it worse.


Not sure what worse is. Worse for the repubs? They're doing a damn good job on their own wouldn't you say. OK, but surely it's relatively simple to put the CTs to rest. After all, they believe in moon mice. As this is having international repurcussions, let's turn it over to an international court maybe.


By worse, I mean increasing the size of the pool of people thinking the New Official Report is a conspiracy/cover-up/whatever.

Hardest suckers in the world to put to bed are the CT's; and as far as I can tell, they are immortal. We still got LINCOLN conspriracies for c*** sake.

ICC. No way in h***. Even if there was nothing for any of it, they'd still convict Bush of talking funny and execute him. Lets be realistic; the world despises Bush with ravenous intensity.

So now that I've defined worse... can you find me one?
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Gridlock » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:23:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'E')ven if there was nothing for any of it, they'd still convict Bush of talking funny and execute him. Lets be realistic; the world despises Bush with ravenous intensity.


The world has despised many people, but should we not have prosecuted them if we'd had the chance? OBL fits the bill, should we not prosecute him?

But you're quite right, a fair hearing is what the civilised world is all about. Why then are we denying it to countless individuals in Guantanamo, or CIA prisons? Do they get a fair trial?
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Carlhole » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:25:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gridlock', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')our turn. Find me one that won't make it worse.


Not sure what worse is. Worse for the repubs? They're doing a damn good job on their own wouldn't you say. OK, but surely it's relatively simple to put the CTs to rest. After all, they believe in moon mice. As this is having international repurcussions, let's turn it over to an international court maybe.


Yeah, I'd be in favor with an international investigation as long as there were plenty of scientists and engineers, as long as the original 400 some-odd questions that the 911 families originally listed for the Commission were included along with those that the 911 Truth Movement could add.

Certainly, it's within the realm of human capability to answer a question like the identities of those traders/organizations who failed to collect the millions in profits from the put options and the reason why they faild to collect those profits. Where is the politics in a question like that?

When cops investigate a homocide, they don't take into consideration whether the Chief of Police is a Democrat or a Republican or how the victim's family voted. They just investigate the fucking crime.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Carlhole » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:32:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', ' ')Lets be realistic; the world despises Bush with ravenous intensity.


That asshole is going down without any help from the 911 Truth Movement. And if Democrats get in and they continue to ignore and evade these questions, they are going to be every bit as reviled.

There's no fucking difference between the two parties anyway. They are both bought and paid for by corporations. It's just a fucking shell game.

I wonder who it was that met with Cheney on his Energy Task Force and what plans were made that remain so top secret? Could it have been corporations?
Last edited by Carlhole on Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:33:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:33:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'C')ertainly, it's within the realm of human capability to answer a question like the identities of those traders/organizations who failed to collect the millions in profits from the put options and the reason why they faild to collect those profits. Where is the politics in a question like that?


Names would be easy.
Reason... not so easy. They'd say stuff like, "we felt it would be too unseemly..." etc. If they said that, would you believe them?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hen cops investigate a homocide, they don't take into consideration whether the Chief of Police is a Democrat or a Republican or how the victim's family voted. They just investigate the fucking crime.


Fine, then what would be the problem with my suggestion of 3 hard core conservative prosecutors, and three hard core liberal prosecutors?

International folks would never be trusted as independent; they are perceived to uniformly have a prejudged position of wanting to convict Bush of something, anything.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:39:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I') wonder who it was that met with Cheney on his Energy Task Force and what plans were made that remain so top secret? Could it have been corporations?


Of course it was the various board members and CEO's of oil, coal, and nuclear related corporations, who else would even have the information they were looking for?. As much as that raises your hackles, the reason the task force members would want to be secret likely has nothing to do with looking bad, and everything to do with protecting proprietary information shared with Cheney.

Top secret plans like, "what do you need to happen in order to start building nukes again?"; or do you mean top secret as in, "If we shut down oil from Iran and Iraq, how long can we keep the US energy requirements filled?"
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Carlhole » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:42:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I') wonder who it was that met with Cheney on his Energy Task Force and what plans were made that remain so top secret? Could it have been corporations?


Of course it was the various board members and CEO's of oil, coal, and nuclear related corporations, who else would even have the information they were looking for?. As much as that raises your hackles, the reason the task force members would want to be secret likely has nothing to do with looking bad, and everything to do with protecting proprietary information shared with Cheney.

Top secret plans like, "what do you need to happen in order to start building nukes again?"; or do you mean top secret as in, "If we shut down oil from Iran and Iraq, how long can we keep the US energy requirements filled?"


It sounds like you want an renewed investigation too.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:46:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Carlhole', 'I')t sounds like you want an renewed investigation too.


Design me one thats not a waste of time, and won't make the CT situation worse, and I won't object.

All I've seen are plans on how to take the CT population from 5 million to 30 million. Changing the members of course....
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Gridlock » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:48:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')ine, then what would be the problem with my suggestion of 3 hard core conservative prosecutors, and three hard core liberal prosecutors?


Personally, I think it would be too narrow. But the idea isn't so much who is on the panel, but what information is provided to the public.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')nternational folks would never be trusted as independent; they are perceived to uniformly have a prejudged position of wanting to convict Bush of something, anything.


That would really set my mind racing as to why.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')op secret plans like, "what do you need to happen in order to start building nukes again?"; or do you mean top secret as in, "If we shut down oil from Iran and Iraq, how long can we keep the US energy requirements filled?"


Exactly.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 20:58:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gridlock', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')ine, then what would be the problem with my suggestion of 3 hard core conservative prosecutors, and three hard core liberal prosecutors?


Personally, I think it would be too narrow. But the idea isn't so much who is on the panel, but what information is provided to the public.


It has everything to do with who is on the panel, and the media format of the information. The quantity of information is not particularly important; I tend to think an initial report with unanimous support, followed by a later historical archive transcript would be best able to arrive at FACT. But I'd entertain other ideas. But if you want to keep 30 million people off the CT rolls you're going to need three hard core partisans from both sides of that spectrum; all signing off on the report. Add some so-called unaligned folks if you wish.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')nternational folks would never be trusted as independent; they are perceived to uniformly have a prejudged position of wanting to convict Bush of something, anything.

That would really set my mind racing as to why.


Racing is not necessary. Answer is simple. He told them to go *** themselves. Tends to make people a bit testy. Do it often enough and they'll want your head. And he's about to do it again.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')op secret plans like, "what do you need to happen in order to start building nukes again?"; or do you mean top secret as in, "If we shut down oil from Iran and Iraq, how long can we keep the US energy requirements filled?"

Exactly.

But SHOULDN'T the President know the answers to those questions?
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Gridlock » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 21:11:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')t has everything to do with who is on the panel, and the media format of the information.


Absolutely, he tried to put Kissinger on the first panel. Then did with that guy Zelikow. If I’m on trial, I hope I can pick my friends too. But you won't even get a trial way things are headed!

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'R')acing is not necessary. Answer is simple. He told them to go *** themselves. Tends to make people a bit testy. Do it often enough and they'll want your head. And he's about to do it again.


See this is what I don’t get. Your countrymen are being killed, and about to be killed more (Iran will fuck about with Iraq) cos this guy likes bravado.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut SHOULDN'T the President know the answers to those questions?


Course, shouldn’t the people too? Helps plan your doomer lifestyle.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 21:51:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gridlock', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'R')acing is not necessary. Answer is simple. He told them to go *** themselves. Tends to make people a bit testy. Do it often enough and they'll want your head. And he's about to do it again.


See this is what I don’t get. Your countrymen are being killed, and about to be killed more (Iran will fuck about with Iraq) cos this guy likes bravado.


No. We're about to do it in order to drive up oil prices and to prevent Iran from becoming a major power. The bravado is a distraction, its what will tick off the rest of the world; it'll be what they'll go on and on about, Bush the Cowboy, Bush the Moron, etc. etc. Will they follow the connection that high oil prices may be hard on the economy, but are absolutely golden to everyone that Bush is friends with? Will they notice when China doesn't do anything but complain, and then has "peacekeepers" available to be deployed in Iran? Without Iranian backup, do you think Syria is going to be terribly excited about shipping arms into Iraq or Lebanon?

Look at these questions:
Can the US obliterate Iran's modernity. Yes.
Can the US successfully occupy Iran: No.
Could China successfully occupy Iran: Yes.

Han majority in Persia anyone? [smilie=5yinyang.gif]
Hmmmmmmmm. That'd just about take care of China's oil needs for a while.

[smilie=icon_santa.gif]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut SHOULDN'T the President know the answers to those questions?
Course, shouldn’t the people too? Helps plan your doomer lifestyle.


I don't disagree to getting the answers, with proprietary information stripped out. Those companies were told they could speak in confidence; and given the intensity of resistance over disclosure, I think they were entirely frank.

Structurally, I worry that we are removing ways that people can tell officeholders what they think without then having it broadcast in the press. I think that is a bad thing.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby Hiderow » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 21:52:01

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', '
')ICC. No way in h***. Even if there was nothing for any of it, they'd still convict Bush of talking funny and execute him. Lets be realistic; the world despises Bush with ravenous intensity.


Fer fuck sake, will you stfu talking about bush, repubs, dems, left right clinton blah de fucking blah.
did ya ever think rwwff that alot of people couldn't give a fuck about your left, right bullshit, it's about right or wrong, the repurcussions of this 911 crap is GLOBAL, so fuck you & your narrow-minded shite :roll:
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 21:57:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hiderow', 'w')ill you stfu talking about .....


No.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby NEOPO » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 22:01:11

i think gridlock is rwwff's mule.
someone trace that ip please....

rwwff seems quite obsessed with steering the conversation does he not?

yes odd indeed.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby rwwff » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 22:13:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 'i') think gridlock is rwwff's mule.
someone trace that ip please....
rwwff seems quite obsessed with steering the conversation does he not?
yes odd indeed.


I thought I was staying pretty well on topic. 9/11, CT, new investigations..

I don't do "mule" or other amateur things.
I need no gimmicks to write what I think.

Like the Avatar?
I was wondering if folks would consider it subversive if I created a new ID, like... AgentR.
Self flattery, I know. Kinda sad, but funny too.
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby AgentR » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 22:27:35

Just me... better nick, I think.

As to "right and wrong"; who decides if it was right, or was wrong? That is the question. That is always the question. And who chooses these decision makers?
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Re: Documentary: "Oil, Smoke and Mirrors"

Postby zberry » Fri 06 Oct 2006, 22:37:32

Honestly. Left-right. Liberal-conservative. Democrat-Republican. How pathetic and clueless.
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