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Showdown between the West and the Rest

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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:08:45

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bobbotov', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', ' ')Just because your from Lebanon doesnt mean you know what your talking about.


By the same token just because you're an American doesn't mean you know what you're talking about in regards to Lebanon either.


*I'M* not the one pretending to be an expert on the subject am I?
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Bobbotov » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:15:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bobbotov', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', ' ')Just because your from Lebanon doesnt mean you know what your talking about.


By the same token just because you're an American doesn't mean you know what you're talking about in regards to Lebanon either.


*I'M* not the one pretending to be an expert on the subject am I?


I have no idea what you are pretending to be other than actually being opinionated without facts.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Miki » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:22:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Qur’an:9:112
Those that turn (to Allah) in repentance; that serve Him, and praise Him; that wander in devotion to the cause of Allah,: that bow down and prostrate themselves in prayer; that enjoin good and forbid evil; and observe the limit set by Allah;- (These do rejoice). So proclaim the glad tidings to the Believers.

Common translation: “The Believers fight in Allah’s Cause, they slay and are slain, kill and are killed.”


You're picking and choosing verses and interpreting them like you want, and completely out of context. If Muslim scholars disagree on how to interpret the Koran, and they have read and studied *the whole* Koran for years, what makes you think that you can interpret it better? Have you read it all?

You don't even have enough knowledge about Islamic culture to even attempt to try to interpret the Koran. Look at your interpretation of the quote above. The quote was reffering to the common concept of submission in Islam, and you interpreted it as a permission to kill and slain.

I could find you as many verses in the Koran that talk about tolerance in religion, compassion, and peace, and as many verses in the Bible that promt the hate of women, racism, war, and violence. Does that mean that Christianism is a religion of war and that women are viewed as inferior by Christians?
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:25:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Miki', '
')You're picking and choosing verses and interpreting them like you want, and completely out of context. If Muslim scholars disagree on how to interpret the Koran, and they have read and studied *the whole* Koran for years, what makes you think that you can interpret it better? Have you read it all?

You don't even have enough knowledge about Islamic culture to even attempt to try to interpret the Koran. Look at your interpretation of the quote above. The quote was reffering to the common concept of submission in Islam, and you interpreted it as a permission to kill and slain.

I could find you as many verses in the Koran that talk about tolerance in religion, compassion, and peace, and as many verses in the Bible that promt the hate of women, racism, war, and violence. Does that mean that Christianism is a religion of war and that women are viewed as inferior by Christians?


You're picking and choosing as well.

And in doing so, ignored the most important part of my post.
Lets try it again.

ADDRESS THIS AND ONLY THIS

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut thats all in context. The only context worth worrying about is "are the adherents of that religion currently carrying out those commands"? If the answer is 'yes', then it moves from the realm of 'isn't that religion silly' to 'arm yourself, this is going to be a long one'.

Let me ask you, which religion makes you feel like theres a chance of peace?
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:25:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bobbotov', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bobbotov', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', ' ')Just because your from Lebanon doesnt mean you know what your talking about.


By the same token just because you're an American doesn't mean you know what you're talking about in regards to Lebanon either.


*I'M* not the one pretending to be an expert on the subject am I?


I have no idea what you are pretending to be other than actually being opinionated without facts.


This board if chock full of that.
But "without facts"
You're obviously lacking in facts yourself. Better slow down and think before you type cactus.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Bobbotov » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:30:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')
This board if chock full of that.
But "without facts"
You're obviously lacking in facts yourself. Better slow down and think before you type cactus.


You're as factual as Google allows you to be.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby smiley » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:31:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')o. Christianity says if someone leads me astray I should strike them down.


Revelation on non-believers.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1')24. “5. And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months; and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.”

- Revelation, 9/5


Doesn't sound too tempting to me.

Come on Spec, you know that this game can go on forever. Christianity, Judaism, Islam, the interpretation might differ, but the reading material is the same.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:31:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bobbotov', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')
This board if chock full of that.
But "without facts"
You're obviously lacking in facts yourself. Better slow down and think before you type cactus.


You're as factual as Google allows you to be.


Amazing, you've gone from claiming me to be a fool to claiming the entirety of the internet being a fool.

Again...

SLOW DOWN AND THINK BEFORE YOU TYPE CACTUS
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:33:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smiley', '
')
Come on Spec, you know that this game can go on forever. Christianity, Judaism, Islam, the interpretation might differ, but the reading material is the same.


Again....

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut thats all in context. The only context worth worrying about is "are the adherents of that religion currently carrying out those commands"? If the answer is 'yes', then it moves from the realm of 'isn't that religion silly' to 'arm yourself, this is going to be a long one'.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Miki » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:34:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'A')nd in doing so, ignored the most important part of my post.
Lets try it again.

ADDRESS THIS AND ONLY THIS

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut thats all in context. The only context worth worrying about is "are the adherents of that religion currently carrying out those commands"? If the answer is 'yes', then it moves from the realm of 'isn't that religion silly' to 'arm yourself, this is going to be a long one'.

Let me ask you, which religion makes you feel like theres a chance of peace?


The Jews and the Ultraconservative Christian Americans like you have turned my country to shreds and cowardly slaughtered my people----in the hands of which religion to you think I feel more safe?
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:38:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Miki', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'A')nd in doing so, ignored the most important part of my post.
Lets try it again.

ADDRESS THIS AND ONLY THIS

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut thats all in context. The only context worth worrying about is "are the adherents of that religion currently carrying out those commands"? If the answer is 'yes', then it moves from the realm of 'isn't that religion silly' to 'arm yourself, this is going to be a long one'.

Let me ask you, which religion makes you feel like theres a chance of peace?


The Jews and the Ultraconservative Christian Americans like you have turned my country to shreds and cowardly slaughtered my people----in the hands of which religion to you think I feel more safe?


Then your own ignorance shines forth. No wonder your culture is 300 years behind everyone else. If they all think like you, that will surely never change.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Grifter » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:45:32

So, you really think this is about religion? Spec or Miki?

You have some common ground.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:48:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Grifter', 'S')o, you really think this is about religion? Spec or Miki?

You have some common ground.


Only 1 side of the coin is.
The other is called "self preservation".
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby marko » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:50:21

I am going to make a rare comment on a Specop-initiated thread. These threads are a waste of time, and because Specop replies to every reply, they end up near the top of the list. In my opinion, the best response to Specop's rants is to ignore them and let them disappear.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby smiley » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 16:54:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut thats all in context. The only context worth worrying about is "are the adherents of that religion currently carrying out those commands"? If the answer is 'yes', then it moves from the realm of 'isn't that religion silly' to 'arm yourself, this is going to be a long one'.


For Al Qaida the answer is clearly yes, these are the ones which blow themselves up to kill a few non-believers.

But for Hizbullah the answer is no. The mission of Hizbullah is not to kill the non believers. (By the way Jews are 'children of the book' so the quotes of Attaubah don't apply to them.) Hizbullahs mission is also not to blow up towers in NY.

Their quarrel with Israel is plain and simple. Israel has occupied Lebanese land (by which it still is violating the UN resolution). Hizbullah want to get it back. Using the UN border (blue line) the kidnapped Israeli soldiers were trespassers. Although Israel doesn't see it that way Hizbullah does.

Now you can argue about whether a few miles of border justify this much bloodshed, I personally think it doesn't.

But you shouldn't try to extrapolate this to a war between the west and the rest. Because then you're doing exactly what people like OBL want.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Grifter » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 17:03:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Grifter', 'S')o, you really think this is about religion? Spec or Miki?

You have some common ground.


Only 1 side of the coin is.
The other is called "self preservation".


You have been quoting from the koran, Miki from the bible. I don't even read them (the biblical qutes and stuff), 'cause its not about religion.

You call it self preservation, I call it oppression. I thought you had purposely turned the discussion to religion, if I am wrong I am glad.

From what I can tell Miki didn't bring religion into this particular thread first. You did.

I don't think Miki should be concentrating on what one particular person thinks. Miki, you wont convince everyone. No one will.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Miki » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 17:23:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Grifter', 'S')o, you really think this is about religion? Spec or Miki?

You have some common ground.


Of course I don't. Read all my previous posts and you'll see that to me this is a matter of oppression and political agendas. Religion is just a spice in the dish.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Miki » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 19:23:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '[')Then your own ignorance shines forth. No wonder your culture is 300 years behind everyone else. If they all think like you, that will surely never change.


Wow. That's *exactly* what I think when I read each of your posts. You read my mind.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Miki » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 19:32:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Grifter', 'Y')ou have been quoting from the koran, Miki from the bible. I don't even read them (the biblical qutes and stuff), 'cause its not about religion.

You call it self preservation, I call it oppression. I thought you had purposely turned the discussion to religion, if I am wrong I am glad.

I don't think Miki should be concentrating on what one particular person thinks. Miki, you wont convince everyone. No one will.


Grifter,

I agree with you. Oppression is one of the key elements here.

Religion was brought up when a couple of prejudiced people invented that Muslims are violent by nature, because it's part of their culture and advocated by the Koran. I clarified that violence is present in all montheistic religions and Holy Books. That's all.

I could not care less about what Spec thinks or about trying to convince him. I have too little respect for him, to care that much. My purpose in correcting his prejudiced statements is to let other readers understand that the stereotyped view of Islam and Muslim societies that is portrayed by American propaganda is not accurate, and it reflects the behaviors of a minority. Thus, it is utterly wrong to affirm that those behaviors are a Muslim or Arab thing, even less to associate them to the Islamic religion.
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Re: Showdown between the West and the Rest

Unread postby Specop_007 » Thu 03 Aug 2006, 19:49:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Miki', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '[')Then your own ignorance shines forth. No wonder your culture is 300 years behind everyone else. If they all think like you, that will surely never change.


Wow. That's *exactly* what I think when I read each of your posts. You read my mind.


Really? Let me point out your ignorance then.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Miki', '
')
The Jews and the Ultraconservative Christian Americans like you have turned my country to shreds and cowardly slaughtered my people----in the hands of which religion to you think I feel more safe?


When was the last time a Jew ran into a school screaming "GOD IS GREAT" and blew it up?
When was the last time a Muslim did it?

If you cant see the danger of Islam and the danger of harboring terrorists in your country, then you truly are ignorant.

And aside from that, I think you're a fraud. A fake, a phony. You know as much of living in a warzone as I do. You make up stories for sympathy when you deserve none, you play on the emotions of others to gain sympathy when you deserve none.
You are the lowest of scum, using others suffering for your own personal gains.
"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."

Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
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