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"Who killed the Electric Car?" Thread

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"Who killed the Electric Car?" Thread

Postby Specop_007 » Sat 04 Feb 2006, 23:19:11

Expletive deleted. GM. Click
Last edited by Ferretlover on Sun 02 Aug 2009, 14:30:41, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Merge thread.
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Re: The electric car that could, but didnt

Postby Novus » Sun 05 Feb 2006, 11:45:21

The EV1 was just a legal PR stunt at a time when gas had fallen to under a dollar and GM could not even meet the demand for SUVs. There was a law on the books that said car makers could not exceed the propotional amount of cars to light trucks. By 1997 GM was selling SUVs from its 1999 quota. By building the EV1 GM was able to find a loophole to get through the SUV quotas. The EV1 also with help from lobyists convinced the Congress to allow the proportional law to expire. GM cleverly also arranged the the leases on the EV1 to expire after after the law went into Sunset.

Even though I feel sorry for the auto workers, at the end of day I am glad GM is going under. GM has been pulling stunts like this since the 1920s when they killed the steam powered car and in the 1930s when the muscled the electric street car companies out of business. GM is one of the most despicable companies to ever disgrace America.
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movie who killed the electric car

Postby jimmyz » Tue 23 May 2006, 12:12:33

Last edited by jimmyz on Tue 23 May 2006, 15:02:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby Revi » Tue 23 May 2006, 12:39:22

Your link doesn't work. My cousin was very involved in the making of this film. I think it was in the Cannes film festival. It may get some exposure. In my opinion the big car companies are the worst ones to develop an electric car. Leave it to Bombardier and other companies that know electric vehicles.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby skeptic » Tue 23 May 2006, 12:43:06

Who killed the electric car

car not ca

Tip. Always check links after you've posted them.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby Revi » Tue 23 May 2006, 12:52:07

My cousin directed and wrote it and it was at the Sundance film festival, not the Cannes. Here's another site that has info on it:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0489037/
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby jaws » Tue 23 May 2006, 13:53:03

Who killed the electric car? What do you think would have happened if 20 million commuters in California were to start plugging their cars into the state's patchwork electricity grid every night?
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby mjdlight » Tue 23 May 2006, 14:31:38

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', 'W')ho killed the electric car? What do you think would have happened if 20 million commuters in California were to start plugging their cars into the state's patchwork electricity grid every night?


Grids can be upgraded though, once we get serious about that. It's a solvable problem.

Unlike peak oil. :)
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby jaws » Tue 23 May 2006, 14:54:41

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mjdlight', 'G')rids can be upgraded though, once we get serious about that. It's a solvable problem.

Unlike peak oil. :)

Yeah I'm sure they're going to start doing that any day now.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby jimmyz » Tue 23 May 2006, 14:56:58

no reason to do it now...unless production starts. 20 million people are not going to buy one all at once lol
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby matt21811 » Tue 23 May 2006, 14:57:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', 'W')ho killed the electric car? What do you think would have happened if 20 million commuters in California were to start plugging their cars into the state's patchwork electricity grid every night?


My guess is it would flatten out the peak curve which is every electricity producers wet dream.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby Pablo2079 » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:04:11

I'm sure you could set a delay and have it start charging at 10PM or something like that..... maybe utilities would bring back the offpeak electric rates to encourage that behaviour.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby clueless » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:04:22

There will be no need for electric cars when US demand is cut by 35% due to a worthless dollar and depressed ecomomy caused by enourmous consumer and corporate debt.

I mean it's not as if it's never happened before, right ? That will free up 7 million barrels of oil per day.

[smilie=BangHead.gif]
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby jimmyz » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:08:05

decline will take care of your freed up 7 million barrels
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby matt21811 » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:10:59

I think China will take care of that 7 million barrels before decline gets to it.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby aflurry » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:31:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mjdlight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', 'W')ho killed the electric car? What do you think would have happened if 20 million commuters in California were to start plugging their cars into the state's patchwork electricity grid every night?


Grids can be upgraded though, once we get serious about that. It's a solvable problem.

Unlike peak oil. :)


OK, massive upgrades and increased demand mean skyrocketing electricity cost, not just for the people who are charging their cars on it, but for everyone else who are still just heating their homes and cooking.

Electric cars mean non-drivers will be sharing the bill for heavy drivers through price increases on the electricity they do use. Why would they want to do that?
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby jimmyz » Tue 23 May 2006, 15:42:29

that just like the cost of gas. heavy drivers use more gas than others and the price goes up for everyone.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby cube » Tue 23 May 2006, 17:56:34

*extreme eye rolls*

ohh no not another internet conspiracy video. Me thinks as we get closer to PO we're going to see alot more of these videos being produced. :roll:

This trailer is almost as entertaining as the "GM killed off passenger rail" in California. Rememebr that conspiracy theory?
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby aflurry » Tue 23 May 2006, 17:58:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jimmyz', 't')hat just like the cost of gas. heavy drivers use more gas than others and the price goes up for everyone.


I would say that the economic dynamic is the same, but in the electric car example, the effects of this dynamic discourage changing habits in favor of distibuting the burden of irresponsible behavior. If we're talking about the relative cost of driving different types of vehicles, I don't really care.

Private cars need to play less of a role in our lives. To whatever degree our energy crisis hits that discretionary segment of our usage spectrum more intensively, and less intensively on more critical areas like heat and food production, we benefit.

Driving should be priced to reflect its luxury. And I would personally prefer to see more poor people who can't afford to drive and fewer who can't afford their utility bills.

I am also suspect of the "greenness" of these cars. Hidden pollution is still pollution. Spent battery disposal would become a huge problem. Hybrids have the same issues.

Has anyone seen a full EROEI analysis on the electric car vs the ICE? If you factor in the losses from all of the energy state conversions, i expect you lose alot of useful energy along the way. (gas combustion > heat > mechanical > electricity > step up > transmission > step down > induction charging > battery storage > mechanical) Each of these steps is a lossy process. That in itself suggests that electricity just isn't the right energy source for this application.

I have always considered myself a "green," of some stripe. But I break ranks on this issue. This is an example of that "Save the Earth" bumpersticker on an SUV kind of mistake. It's a fundamentally flawed idea that you can buy your way into conservation.
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Re: movie who killed the electric car

Postby Zardoz » Tue 23 May 2006, 18:08:26

Oh, come on, people, do a little basic research:

The EV-1: A dud from the start, and GM squashed it out of embarrassment

The cars got 55 to 95 miles (90 to 150 km) per charge on lead-acid batteries and 75 to 130 miles (120 to 210 km) on a charge with nickel-metal hydride batteries. Recharging took as much as eight hours for a full charge (although you could get an 80% charge in 40 minutes)...

...The price for the car used to compute lease payments was $33,995 to $43,995, which made for lease payments of $299 to over $574 per month...


It was a joke. When GM first introduced it most environmentalists said it was mistake, and that it would give ICE alternatives a bad name. They were right.
"Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
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