[LadyRuby]

I had another pretty big breakthrough today, my husband agreed to let me move most of our investments into much safer accounts (not tied to stock market). This morning I just leveled with him and told him how much anxiety I've been feeling that we could lose an awful lot in a matter of a couple of days if the market should crash. This morning I broke him down.

A couple of times I've suggested just trying to pay off our mortgage as much as we can but he won't go for that. But I feel a lot better having most of our funds now in "safer" areas so if we do need to withdraw them to pay down our mortgage, should either/both of us lose our jobs, we won't have lost everything in a stock market crash. (I don't care about investments other than their potential use to pay off our mortgage.)

I said to my husband the other day, after he expressed some serious frustration at me, "Some day you're going to thank me for pestering you and persevering and not giving up." I hope I'm right, not that I want a crash but if I've forced these changes unnecessarily I'll feel kind of bad.

[FairMaiden]

Skiwi...your post scared me...my fiance asked me the other day when I think we'll see a recession in the economy and I blurted out March '06 w/o even thinking about it...

[spudbuddy]

How to handle it on a daily basis - with spouses, family, friends, and assorted other near and dear? (not to mention colleagues and perfect strangers....
Perspective.
If you look around, you can't help noticing the world has become a pretty ugly place.
The sun still shines, the rain still falls (acidic, or otherwise) and a sunset still paints the sky (ozone depletion notwithstanding.)
I get the feeling sometimes that we all sorta feel like Adam & Eve in Paradise Lost.
Except it never was a paradise.

Now...in my little doggie heart, I can't wish planetary societies any harm (I was raised to be a humanist...and I'm sticking to the plan.)

On the other hand...there's a lot of pretty inhumane activity that has had the world by the balls (not to mention the ovaries) for some time now...and any shift in global order or disorder that alters the power structure enough to maybe alleviate some of that pain...well, I'm all for it.

Millions of people waving signs and placards couldn't do the job. Hell, we couldn't even get (you know who) out of the White House.

I keep thinking (maybe this is my personal manifesto) change is a-comin', that's for sure...maybe big and fast, or maybe small and slow...I don't know.
But the change doesn't have to be all bad.

I loved that bit in that one post...what are they gonna do? Hire 2 or three million extra sherrifs to evict all the foreclosed mortgage holders?
Well then...here's the plan, Stan.
I'll go get one o' them there jobs, and my next door neighbor will too, and they'll be so damned anxious to cover the territory, that when we form a union 2 or 3 million strong, they'll have no choice but to meet our demands, paying maybe $35/hr to start, with lots and lots of double overtime and great benefit packages, including profit sharing, and when my neighbor and I move to evict each other...we'll just buy each others' forclosed houses at ridiculous firesale prices! (and hand them back as Christmas gifts...)
Perspective.

Did we really get that soft? How did we make it through all those Depressions and Recessions? Not to mention a few assorted wars...

I can see a whole lot of people really depressed because they can't afford their toys and diversions anymore. Well, life is still happening beyond the plasma wall screen outside that door just next to the family room entertainment center.

I can also see a whole lot of civic pride and power returning to communities, too.
And in a way that can't necessarily be undone by corporate power.

Think of all the "communities" out there that never have had any civic design. Never had a chance to. Well, maybe now they will. That's something to get excited about. That's a lot of people.

Peak Oil is a shift - in the way we do things. It doesn't mean we stop doing things altogether.
Somewhere there's a long tall Texan reaching for his gun, just itchin'
(but that's what Hollywood told us...and just who the hell is Hollywood, anyway? Is it us?) I wonder....

Wee bits of faith, trust, know-how, ingenuity...somewhere a sign that says, "Give it up...and get on with the job."
It's still an adventure, anyhow.

How many Americans would just love to see some smallish factory pop up in their community, manufacturing something they actually need?
How many Americans would just love to wander into a storefront and find something of quality, reasonably affordable that had a simple label or tag on it, imprinted, embossed...that said "Made in America?" (the price is ten bucks...the pride is free.)
How many Midwesterners would love to trade their organically grown agriculture for some machine-tooled implements made in New England?

Sounds like a glorious pipe dream, doesn't it?
Who the hell actually convinced us that this is absolutely impossible?
And just exactly why the hell is it that we teach this to our kids?
um...when did bullshit lose its stink?

Ah...the American Dream. (sure takin' a beating.)
Maybe that's the problem.
Somewhere along the way...we lost the ability to dream like that.
(corporate money picked it up at "everyday low prices!")
We sold it, sure enough, at bargain rates.
It'll cost us to get it back.
Maybe Peak Oil is our biggest ace...we sure crapped out anyhow.

[skyemoor]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('skiwi', '
')I'm paying heed to a little voice that told me many years ago to be prepared before I turn 50... March 2006

[FairMaiden]

Its funny that I keep reading March 2006 on this site. I have been studying the world economy in great depth and predicted that March 2006 would be a very bad time with regards to inflation, interest rates and oil prices. I won't get into my conclusion...but its funny how we get to the same place from different means.

There isn't much we can do to prepare here - I live in a small apt and can't afford a nice farm or anything. I have little savings with which to play with. I have no place to grow food, etc. Its incredibly fustrating but thats life.

Hopefully March 2006 will just be the start of it and I'll find some way to prepare before then or as it happens.

Interesting time to be alive.

[skyemoor]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('FairMaiden', '
')There isn't much we can do to prepare here - I live in a small apt and can't afford a nice farm or anything. I have little savings with which to play with. I have no place to grow food, etc. Its incredibly fustrating but thats life.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('FairMaiden', 'I')ts funny that I keep reading March 2006 on this site. I have been studying the world economy in great depth and predicted that March 2006 would be a very bad time with regards to inflation, interest rates and oil prices. I won't get into my conclusion...but its funny how we get to the same place from different means.

There isn't much we can do to prepare here - I live in a small apt and can't afford a nice farm or anything. I have little savings with which to play with. I have no place to grow food, etc. Its incredibly fustrating but thats life.

Hopefully March 2006 will just be the start of it and I'll find some way to prepare before then or as it happens.

Interesting time to be alive.

[jvangi]

I thought I would hae problem with my wife about that as well...

But by investigating and talking a lot about it, we reached a higher degree of understanding actually.

My wife was the worrier, she was always worrying about money, time, work etc etc.
I was the one to say "Take it easy", we have no reason to worry.

Then, I discovered the concept of peak oil and all its ramifications the next 6 month after that. This strengthened my optimism actually.

That lead me last week to the book "A theory of power" by Jeff Vail (I don't remember how, I think its blog was quoted in this forum), what he writes in it made my wife really easy as well.

So thanks to peak oil we are happier today and... we don't talk about it anymore!

[Doly]

Talking too much about peak oil is always a mistake. When I feel that my husband is getting tired of the subject, I drop it for a while. Obsessing on PO isn't really necessary to be prepared, anyway. If you leave it in the background and mention it when it's important for a decision, it's much better. It's especially convincing if it comes accompanied of the latest big news related to PO.

[FairMaiden]

There are no community gardens near me - I live in a smaller community outside the big city. I am happy about that. I can walk most places and own a very expensive bicycle that I ride into the city (33km). I'm in awesome physical shape

I first started looking at interest rates a few years ago when they hit an all time low...and lately I've notice that long & short term rates have been changing independantly of each other. Thats VERY odd! I've never see that happen before. I can't find any expert anywhere that has any clue that is happening there. But interest rates are a useful tool to stall inflation and its been working the last couple of years. Yet...the lower interest rates have spurned a real estate boom and not the investment that it was suppose to encourage after the high tech crash. Prices have continued to climb while wages have remained flat. 20% of household income is spent on transportation (important, I'll get to that) and shelter has climbed from 30-40% due to the real estate boom. And over half of new mortgages are ARM and/or no money down.

So we have households spending as much as 60% (average) on car & house. We have $7 trillon in credit card debit. Now most folks (here in Canada its over 75%) commute more than 30 minutes one way from work.

So...what happens when interest rates rise?

With increases in interest rates, consumer spending goes down. Best Buy doesn't need as many sales associates. Businesses decide now is not the time to build that new plant...so there are no new jobs created.

Add to that: high fuel costs. Now you've got ppl who can't afford to pay for their homes and their cars.

I honestly think that any depression will hit long before PO - and it'll be the "Credit Crash".

In Canada, interest rates will increase in Sept - and for the rest of the year. That coupled with oil prices will start get ppl thinking about their precarious situations. By March...interest rates will be over 5% & gas prices will be high enough to put the "squeeze" on the indebted. Thats just my gut feeling...we'll see in a few months.

[Ghog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', 'T')alking too much about peak oil is always a mistake. When I feel that my husband is getting tired of the subject, I drop it for a while. Obsessing on PO isn't really necessary to be prepared, anyway. If you leave it in the background and mention it when it's important for a decision, it's much better. It's especially convincing if it comes accompanied of the latest big news related to PO.

[Barbara]

I know, I'm always here complaining about hubby attitude on peakoil.
But yesterday I surrendered: the battle was lost. I decided I'll never ever talk to him again about PO.
While during our trip to Greece this summer he looked convinced, he began to talk about getting the small farm and so on (I was very pleased!) now we're back to square one. Yesterday we were with friends, and he began to laugh on me, saying I want to buy a house, but don't want it here or there because of my paranoias and I'm always undecided. Everybody knew nothing about peakoil, so I looked dumb to them, wanting to buy a house but not knowing where or how.
At home I jumped at his throat for doing this to me. And he said he's tired to hear of these stories, "It's two years! You can think of nothing else, you're paranoid! I don't give a damn of this thing! Go find another husband on that po.com forum and leave me alone!"
After some hours we made peace of course, but now I'm alone again with my plans. We are a very close couple ( ) and I can't make any plan without his support and collaboration. I decided to drop everything: my garden, my storage, any little prep I made.
My family will be in danger after PO, but hey, it will be HIS fault.

Sorry for the rants, but there's no one else I can talk to.

[Ming]

You probably just need to "reduce the pressure" (related to the PO problem) on him: With a little more time he will probably understand things.
And PO's really bad effects are still some years away, so you will have time to "revisit" the preparations in (say) a couple of years.

Anyway, if you are left with no alternative, you can always think about his suggestion: Finding a new husband in a PO forum can be a solution…

[rogerhb]

Keep a diary with your own ideas noted, the current price of oil, gold price, price of a loaf of bread and pint of milk, exchange rates to key currencies, and write a few predictions every few days, also include predictions from MSM. After a year, review the diary with current prices and see how your predictions stand up.

I'm not trying to turn you into Nostrodamus but if these things are truly happening you will have some evidence and able to show Hubby what time you have lost.

[LadyRuby]

I can appreciate how frustrating it is. You want him to understand this problem, for his sake and yours, and he's just not "getting" it. There's only so much you can do without his blessing. It's dangerous because if there is some kind of collapse and you're proposed steps would've helped tremendously, you don't want to spend the rest of your lives saying "I told you so." We've had some similar conversations, although we're set up pretty well for a house so that's not an issue. He thinks I'm a total doomer when actually I'm pretty optimistic!

[RonMN]

I think everybody is a little "off" with the hurricane evacuees and all. I've already seen conversations go from making "disaster plans" to paranoia to screaming that "you're paranoid" all in a 10 minute period.

Don't drop anything except the PO discussion...as conditions worsen he'll want to bring it up again. Be patient...that's what marrages are based on

But it may not be a bad idea to take a topic he likes to talk about & tell him you never want to hear of it again...perhaps he needs a small taste of his own medicine (just a thought).

[blukatzen]

Barbara,
The events we've seen down in New Orleans may have been filled with stories between wives and husbands who "one" who wanted to leave and the other who refused to, only to find death during the storm or aftermath. We'll never know the whole truth on many of these people. Something to take note of.
If you have children, you have to make plans for THEIR sake! (NOT HIS!) Gardening is something to persue even IF peak oil was never an issue. It is good to get out in the sunshine and learn to grow your own fruits and vegetables. Learn to do one thing under the guise of another. Other plans, like storing foods effectively, first aid implements, etc. are even more important, as we've had the events in New Orleans exposed as truth..the government, whether municipal, State, or Federal doesn't care about your hide. You and yours better!
For someone who would stoke his ego on the expense of his wife in front of "friends" who don't know anything about Peak Oil..well...I had a husband like that once. I dumped his ass. LONG GONE!
The one I have now just had the foresight to buy a wonderful hunting bow, (he used to shoot competitive archery) to bring food home for us. He not only believes in this, but is actively (along with me) working on each paycheck to secure our future. We've bought a treadle sewing machine, lots of non-electric "Amish style" wood-working tools, etc. We are active in learning and living a simple life. I have a small fruit orchard, and garden. (however, I run garden centers, and taught horticulture..so that isn't fair to most on this list.)

Barbara, the expense to your own self-worth is not worth it. I know that there ARE better men around, one who would never make fun of me in front of "so called friends"? You are doing the correct thing. People with his attitude, in the future, will be toast. Don't go along for the ride.

[Madpaddy]

Barbara,

I have a friend who is PO aware and needs a wife. He is so busy preparing that he doesn't have time to meet women. Sounds like you two should meet up.

I'm not joking but anyway, I'm sure that your hubby has just become PO aware and is in the angry denial phase and maybe his pride is a bit hurt because he didn't see it sooner.

All the best,
MP

[Evltre]

oh Barbara - it must be a horribly difficult situation to be in - I know that if my dear hubby hadn't of jumped in boots and all on this one I would have found it difficult to cope with!

[FoolYap]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Barbara', 'B')ut yesterday I surrendered: the battle was lost. I decided I'll never ever talk to him again about PO.

Yesterday we were with friends, and he began to laugh on me, saying I want to buy a house, but don't want it here or there because of my paranoias and I'm always undecided. Everybody knew nothing about peakoil, so I looked dumb to them, wanting to buy a house but not knowing where or how.

I can't make any plan without his support and collaboration. I decided to drop everything: my garden, my storage, any little prep I made.
My family will be in danger after PO, but hey, it will be HIS fault.