[Z]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Texas_T', 'I')t is interesting that when oil/gas/gasoline prices go up, people cry "price gouging" and even many free marketers call for tighter government oversight/policy.

[savethehumans]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')rice Gouging - Does It exist? Can it exist?

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('insurgent', 'M')onopolies can price gouge as much as they want.

[gego]

I guess you guys have heard the story of the European city state under seige and blockade in one of the many "wars". A few brave souls sneak out at night and bring in food for which they charge a high price. The people are outraged at the high price and complain to the king who hangs a few "price gougers" and prohibits the price to be anything other that it was before the seige. Of course nobody risks sneaking out anymore and the city starves.
So much for interference by government in the free markets, whether it be in times of extreme shortages or to rig the markets in favor of their friends. In either case people suffer.

Of course, government objection to price gouging is popular with the masses, and the politicians use this quite freely to continue their confidence game.
I guess what irks me the most is how many people suck up to their masters rather than recognize the reality. No wonder the government wants to run the school system and condition the minds of the youth. I guess you can say the public school system is a great success, at least from this point of view.

[pip]

Oil, gasoline, etc are commodities traded throughout the world. The US governerment or an single company can't set the price. Every study or investigation on price setting has come up empty.

[airstrip1]

You might not be able to beat the market in the long term but governments and corporations are always trying to manipulate it in the short term for their own interests.
As Adam Smith so succinctly put it
"People of the same trade seldom meet together even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public or some contrivance to raise prices."

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('savethehumans', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')rice Gouging - Does It exist? Can it exist?

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('savethehumans', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')rice Gouging - Does It exist? Can it exist?

[MacG]

Since cheap oil is absolutely fundamental to our industrialized societies, we can expect just about any behaviour from people when depletion sets in. Just about any behaviour except logical and rational behaviour. My humble guess is that we have just seen tiny, tiny sparkles of what eventually will become a magnificent firework of irrationality. All that fancy talk about "market forces" will soon go out the window in a rush, to be replaced by attempts at "strong government". And most people will cheer and applaud it.

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', 'S')ince cheap oil is absolutely fundamental to our industrialized societies, we can expect just about any behaviour from people when depletion sets in. Just about any behaviour except logical and rational behaviour.

[MacG]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', ' ')The will be rational behaviour, it's just that it will be only a small part of a whole spectrum of varied behaviour. Interesting, eh?

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MacG', 'S')ince cheap oil is absolutely fundamental to our industrialized societies, we can expect just about any behaviour from people when depletion sets in. Just about any behaviour except logical and rational behaviour. My humble guess is that we have just seen tiny, tiny sparkles of what eventually will become a magnificent firework of irrationality. All that fancy talk about "market forces" will soon go out the window in a rush, to be replaced by attempts at "strong government". And most people will cheer and applaud it.

[threadbear]

Oh...one other point, when the economy is run by oligopolies contracting directly with govt.-- price gouging is a given. There's a total lack of transparency in the procuring of govt.contracts. Bidding for these contracts is a pointless ritual, and this is a trend that will worsen, not improve. Adding to the lack of transparency and accountability, is the fact that private corporations like Bechtel and Dyncorp lack a 'public' face, as they are structured differently than public corporations.

Gouging, technically means jacking up price in a coercive way, when people have no alternative, other than to buy your product. Pharmecuetical companies do this, and to a degree health care insurers. Specialists in the medical profession do this as well. They have 'associations' that act as a cover for price fixing, as do the Sopranos. One is called the Cosa Nostra, the other, The American college of Physicians and Surgeons.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'O')f course monopoly is fate. That's the driving force behind corporations cozying up to political power. When the govt. refuses to enforce anti-competitive practise laws, you have a player or very few players with the most power "winning".

[JoeW]

Price gouging often involves a captive audience of consumers.

At the baseball park, or at the movie theater, I would argue that the concession stands are often price-gouging. It is natural that someone is going to get hungry or thirsty during a 3-hour ballgame or movie...
However, this is accepted because we know when we buy our tickets to the movie or game that we will pay ridiculous prices for these items, like $5 for popcorn and $4 for a beverage.

If I were to sell food and water to the evacuees of the recent disaster when no other source was available to them, and charge the prices that concession stands at movie theaters charge, I would certainly be found guilty of price-gouging.

In the case of gasoline, I fail to see how it can be considered price-gouging when the price has risen nationwide. In local markets where the price was suddenly $6/gallon, I would call that gouging because it is taking advantage of the sudden change in a local market of relatively captive consumers.

[threadbear]

I agree, Jaws, that the big three auto companies are a perfect example of why oligopolies can and do fail. Whether they are ALL 'destined' to fail, is a question. The automaker's hand in glove relationship with big oil, inside the brass knuckles of govt, is ill equipped to deal with what's coming. The auto-maker's eco-system is about to get hit with an asteroid, and no mutual backscratching networks will save them.

You say that corporations seek protection from govt. not monopolistic control. This is more a semantic exercise than anything else. The more a corporation is sheltered from competition, through whatever means, the more it has a chance at monopolistic control. Microsoft was well on it's way. Here we had an example of a company, with an inferior product, dominating a specific industry. It still operates at a tremendous advantage, even after the "remedies" imposed by the law.

I don't doubt the reasons you state for corporate mergers and acquisitions. It's helpful to have someone who obviously has an Economics 101 primer to help us understand the benign reasons that corporations merge. But how does this help competition? Would it not be better to let nature take it's course and allow the weak to die, allowing what might be more superior but smaller companies waiting in the wings to get a shot at the big time? This seems like a state sanctioned socialization of business scheme to me. Are you sure you're not a Communist?

Wait till things get really rotten, to see how big corporations, with zero competition, gouge rather than compete with lower and lower prices. I agree that for the time being, prices, though rising, are still historically cheap in retail goods. This will change.

[BabyPeanut]

Prosecution of Gasoline Price Gougers in the US
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')url=http://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/stories/2005/11/07/daily9.html?from_rss=1]Eustis gas station one of 4 to pay up on price-gouging fines (link)[/url]
Orlando Business Journal - 1:02 PM EST Monday Nov
Florida Agriculture and Consumer Services Commissioner Charles H. Bronson announced Monday that his department has collected $14,000 in fines from four service stations in connection with price-gouging investigations following the last summer's hurricanes.
The stations, among 10 offered settlement agreements in recent weeks for allegedly engaging in price gouging, signed the agreements calling for the payment of the fines and a pledge by the service stations that they will comply with the price-gouging law in the future
In addition, each of the stations has agreed to reimburse customers for any overcharges, provided that they have receipts showing that they purchased gasoline from that facility on the dates that the stations were cited for overcharges in the settlement agreements.

[BabyPeanut]

Georgia too $this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')url=http://www.wtok.com/news/headlines/1955382.html]McBride Pleads Guilty to Gouging (link)[/url]
Livingston, Ala. by Andrea Williams Nov 07 1:08 PM
Recently, 42-year-old Jason McBride was indicted for alleged gas price gouging. Initially he pleaded not guilty. Monday morning his attorney stated in Sumter County Circuit Court that he's changing his plea to guilty.
Although prices at McBride's stores are dropping now immediately after Hurricane Katrina McBride is accused of selling store in Sumter County. To this accusation McBride had said that right after the storm he charged $3.49 per gallon for gas due to the fact that he paid $3.29 per gallon for it.

Meanwhile, McBride is listed as secretary treasurer for McBride Oil Company. Based out of Aliceville, Alabama, the company supplies 56 stores throughout East Mississippi and west Alabama.
During court proceedings McBride's attorney stated that his client has sent a check for $10,000 in fines for the case to the district attorney's office. The question now is whether or not McBride must appear in court to change his plea to guilty. Judge Eddie Hardaway says he will likely make that decision within the next two weeks.

[jaws]

Next time these greedy gas stations will remember what the government wants them to do in a gas crisis: close.

[BabyPeanut]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')url=http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15551717&BRD=1601&PAG=461&dept_id=477132&rfi=6]
Gas station in Baldwin, NY accused of price gouging (link)[/url]
By Marley Seaman November 10, 2005
A Baldwin Getty station was one of three area gas stations charged with fraud and price gouging after an investigation by the Nassau County district attorney's office. Each faces thousands of dollars in fines for overcharging customers and selling lower-grade gasoline at premium gas prices. ...skip... In one instance, a customer claims to have paid $40 for gasoline, but the pump was stopped at $37. Another said he paid for $20 worth of gas and received only $18 worth.