[gego]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '
')Come 2010 or 2015 or whenever the economy collapses, I'm trying to imagine "patriotic" Americans turning in their gold in exchange for worthless paper. It ain't gonna happen.

[Heineken]

Ha ha! Good one, gego. I know they'll get some of my lead when they come to steal my gold.

[MountainHiker]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('aahala', 'W')hat possible motivation would the government have in conficating
gold or silver because oil supplies decline?

The two subjects have as much in common as saying the government
will conficate my high school yearbook when oil becomes short.

[dbarberic]

I was thinking about the 1933 gold confiscation and the potential if one were to ever occur in the future, then something came to me and I want to throw it out there.

I would have to think that in 1933 large amounts of the general population had gold coins. When the confiscation occurred, there was a large amount of gold that the government could get its hands on. In 2005, I believe that there are very few people who even bother to go through the effort required to buy and own gold coins. From a effort vs. return perspective, it seems to me that to go through a confiscation that occurred in 1933 the government would get very little gold in return since so little of the general population actually owns gold anymore so the amount of effort required to do a confiscation would not be worth it.

I’m guessing that more than likely, if TSHTF and the economic environment go so bad, the Government would declare gold coins illegal to own and would confiscate them on the spot if they were found in the course of doing normal police work (i.e. traffic searches, etc). However, I believe that a black market would pop up for gold coin exchange since if things were really that bad that TSHTF and a gold confiscation was announced, all confidence in paper US notes would be gone and citizens would see the value of accepting gold in exchange for goods.

If my logic is sound, then one really does not need to concern themselves with the risk of gold confiscation when purchasing gold coins.

[gego]

Gold was money when Roosevelt stole it from the American public. Think about that; he took everyone's real money and gave them paper instead, along with the law that required them to use this paper as legal tender.

The gold was then given to the Federal Reserve, a corporation owned by the big bankers, in return debt instruments payable to the treasury. Effectively, the gold ownership was stolen by the bankers.

It is physically stored in Ft. Knox and elsewhere. There are some suspicious secret paper transactions which may have comprimised the ownership claims on the physical stuff, so maybe even the Federal Reserve does not now fully own what is stored in Ft. Knox.

Since Roosevelt took away real money and substituted fake money the money price of things like houses has changed from something like $2,000 then to $500,000 now. They keep stealing your purchasing power with this fake money scheme, so why do you think they need to take what little real gold you may accumulate. They already own 95% of you, so why would they really need to come raid what little gold and silver you now have? The answer is that they don't and won't, so forget about being ripped off, cause you already have been.

[some_guy282]

Fort Knox is practically empty. Of the little gold that is there, none of it is owned by the United States government. The Federal Reserve owns some, but it isn't a government body. It's a privately owned for profit business.

[Dukat_Reloaded]

Roosevelt was a jew, ofcourse he would skirt the law and steal everyone gold.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Jews are the only people in the world who have found hostility in every country in which they settled in any numbers. The big question is - WHY?

Today it is taught in the schools that "Anti-Semitism" began in Germany in the 1930s after which they were deported. What is not studied is the fact that at one time or other the Jews have been expelled from every nation in Europe! When the Jews first began to immigrate to America the early colonialists in New York, Charleston and Savannah tried to ban their entry. Benjamin Franklin pleaded with the members of the Continental Congress to enter a specific ban against Jewish immigration into the U. S. Constitution to bar them for all time to come.

The Jews claim that they are "only" a religion. The truth is that the Jews are a RACE. Less than 30% are members of any Synagogue. Whether they are Orthodox religious, atheists, capitalists or communists - they still claim to be Jews - members of the Jewish race! Every race has inherited traits. In the case of the Jews they include trading, money-changing, usury, and a loathing for "productive labor" which is scorned as beneath the dignity of the Jews in their "bible" called "THE TALMUD."

The Jews have not changed since the days when Jesus Christ took up a whip and drove "the money changers out of the Temple." Jews have always united to form monopolies. Today they control all the department store chains and speciality shops along with the lucrative jewelry and animal fur trade. Jews dominate the fields of all precious metals such as gold, silver, platinum, tin, lead, etc. They will always ban together to drive Gentile competitors out of business.

Today America is being flooded with Jewish immigrants from Russia and even 20,000 per year leave Israel for the U. S. - all with dollar signs in their eyes. Jews have used their vaunted money-power to seize control of the Democratic Party and constitute over 50% of all its financial contributions. Today they are buying up more and more major U. S. companies. While only 3% of the population, the Jews control over 25% of the nation's wealth and this percentage rises every year. They are the only racial group totally organized to work for political domination over America.

Opposition to the Jews did not begin in Germany but dates back before the birth of Christ over 2,000 years ago! Study the statements made by "The world's greatest men." They reveal why the "wandering Jews" have made enemies out of every host country that ever accepted them.

[drew]

Roosevelt a Jew ? You've got to be kidding, right.

Try checking your facts first.

Not that I'm an anti-semite, or bigot (both the lowest forms of scum), but do you really think a country like America would ever elect a Jew, especially in the 30's? It was kind of amazing that Kennedy, a Catholic, got elected in the sixties.

Oh also, please spare all of us the Neo Nazi BS in the future, we are all capable of walking to the trash can and digging up a copy of Mein Kamp on our own.

Drew

[DantesPeak]

Gold is already covered by cash transaction laws, and to over simplify, the government can access safe deposit boxes looking for gold if it declares the need to.

Therefore it is already hard to conduct transactions in gold. The government may be satisfied taxing your gains on gold every time it is used in a transaction, since it is treated as a commodity.

While gold and silver may be legal tender per the Constitution, it is only government approved coins at face value that is legal tender which is not subject to tax.

In sum, there is a chance of a new confiscation, but transaction taxes will
confiscate your gold anyway.

[Cleisthenis]

In the worst-case scenario of a collapse, gold and silver will have high value regardless of the governments policy towards the usage of the metals. The economy will be based primarily on barter and services, the federal government may not have any actual sway over what is legal and illegal to trade with...

[MrBill]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dukat', 'R')oosevelt was a jew, ofcourse he would skirt the law and steal everyone gold.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Jews are the only people in the world who have found hostility in every country in which they settled in any numbers. The big question is - WHY?

Today it is taught in the schools that "Anti-Semitism" began in Germany in the 1930s after which they were deported. What is not studied is the fact that at one time or other the Jews have been expelled from every nation in Europe! When the Jews first began to immigrate to America the early colonialists in New York, Charleston and Savannah tried to ban their entry. Benjamin Franklin pleaded with the members of the Continental Congress to enter a specific ban against Jewish immigration into the U. S. Constitution to bar them for all time to come.

The Jews claim that they are "only" a religion. The truth is that the Jews are a RACE. Less than 30% are members of any Synagogue. Whether they are Orthodox religious, atheists, capitalists or communists - they still claim to be Jews - members of the Jewish race! Every race has inherited traits. In the case of the Jews they include trading, money-changing, usury, and a loathing for "productive labor" which is scorned as beneath the dignity of the Jews in their "bible" called "THE TALMUD."

The Jews have not changed since the days when Jesus Christ took up a whip and drove "the money changers out of the Temple." Jews have always united to form monopolies. Today they control all the department store chains and speciality shops along with the lucrative jewelry and animal fur trade. Jews dominate the fields of all precious metals such as gold, silver, platinum, tin, lead, etc. They will always ban together to drive Gentile competitors out of business.

Today America is being flooded with Jewish immigrants from Russia and even 20,000 per year leave Israel for the U. S. - all with dollar signs in their eyes. Jews have used their vaunted money-power to seize control of the Democratic Party and constitute over 50% of all its financial contributions. Today they are buying up more and more major U. S. companies. While only 3% of the population, the Jews control over 25% of the nation's wealth and this percentage rises every year. They are the only racial group totally organized to work for political domination over America.

Opposition to the Jews did not begin in Germany but dates back before the birth of Christ over 2,000 years ago! Study the statements made by "The world's greatest men." They reveal why the "wandering Jews" have made enemies out of every host country that ever accepted them.

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dukat', '
')Opposition to the Jews did not begin in Germany but dates back before the birth of Christ over 2,000 years ago!

[dbarberic]

Ok.... to get back on topic.

I listened to a interview of Economist Marc Faber on Financial Sense Online and both him and James Puplava both seem to think that if a dollar collapse were to happen that the Government would first go after the largest and easiest to get to asset base: pension, 401K, and IRA funds. Most likely, they think that the Government would issue an act that requires the funds to invest a certain percentage in zero coupon government bonds. Giving the Government money as a way to prop up the US dollar.

Makes total sense. And given that the whole US population, holds very little real gold, a confiscation would yield very little real assets for the government. They are going to go for the easy to get, big money first.

[TnAndy]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dbarberic', 'O')k.... to get back on topic.

I listened to a interview of Economist Marc Faber on Financial Sense Online and both him and James Puplava both seem to think that if a dollar collapse were to happen that the Government would first go after the largest and easiest to get to asset base: pension, 401K, and IRA funds. Most likely, they think that the Government would issue an act that requires the funds to invest a certain percentage in zero coupon government bonds. Giving the Government money as a way to prop up the US dollar.

Makes total sense. And given that the whole US population, holds very little real gold, a confiscation would yield very little real assets for the government. They are going to go for the easy to get, big money first.

[rogerhb]

If there are any jobs going in the future then the job of "Gold Confiscator General" is the one I will apply for.

Or is the correct term "The Wizard of Oz"?

[Pops]

Just a reminder from the CoC, here: http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic2867.html

The following post content is subject to deletion:
… Hate speech: Criticism is not hate speech, but inflammatory comments directed at a particular ethnic group, sexual orientation, religion, etc. are unacceptable.

The CoC is strictly enforced in the Planning forum as well as the planning forum rules found here:
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[Bug]

Hi everyone, this is a topic I would like to have some opinions on. Yes, I am a new poster, and yes I did search for the topic before posting and I didn't find it.

As you may know the US is a very asset seizure happy country. You can have your property here seized for many reasons, drugs or simply police allegation of drugs, or allegation that your assets were somehow related to a crime however remote. And taxes, you can lose your property for a myraid of tax reasons, the IRS has the power to seize just based on their word alone, without court order. Much of this seizure under asset forfeiture laws can also happen without a court order. It's a huge, ugly frightening mess that is enough to give any propective buyer of real estate or land pause before buying.

We also know that interest rates are going up, and this means higher interest payments and taxes for everyone. Not only can you lose your assets to foreclosure by your banks if you are unable to pay increased interest on your loans (assuming you have an ARM), you can lose your property to the various taxing bodies (and if you aren't aware, there is a no player on the asset seizure front - homeowners associations (HOA). Most people aren't aware that HOAs in many areas have the full power to seize your house or land and often for frivilous reasons). We all know this seizure can be much easier now under recent Supreme Court rulings on the powers of eminent domain (your property can be now be seized and turned over to private "developers"). A house or land, suddenly your are prey for people who can shake you down, raising your taxes to extreme levels under threat of foreclosure et al.

Please know and understand: Taxes at ALL levels of government are going up if interest rates go up. That's a given.

What does this mean for the person who wants to prepare for peak oil and the ensuing economic collapse? My mother, who is retired and living on fixed income just told met that the property taxes in her town are going up 17% in the Fall. I was stunned. What about next year or the year after that? If the corkscrew is turned tighter and tighter people will be forced out of their homes en masse.

My obvious answer to this problem is to remain as assetless as possible, to rent and not make large purchases of property that can be seized or held hostage. To keep your assets in such a hostile environment well hidden and mobile. But this is contrary to perparation, one should have some land to be able to grow food, and become independent as possible.

How does one deal with this problem. I would like very much to buy some land and get down the road of independence but this issue of hyper taxation (which will happen as interest rates rise) and culture of seizure has put me off on the idea.

[rwwff]

You're being paranoid.

Pay your taxes, don't do an ARM, live within your means, and don't poke the powers that be. How hard is that?

If you are really worried about the tax seizure thing, then buy a farm and actually try to break even, grow alfapha or something that other small and medium sized farmers might want to buy from you. At that point, you'll be using a different tax form and all kinds of improvements to the farm then become business expenses, right along with the property taxes themselves (which will be reduced because its ag exempted.)

[Jack]

First, welcome to Peak Oil!

I must disagree with rwwff - I suspect that various governmental bodies will grab everything they can. I posted a news item in Open Discussion apropos to the issue.

Here's a LINK, with an excerpt of the article and redirection to the complete article.

A Florida town has just passed enabling legislation to take any private property to deal with an emergency. Interesting, is it not?

[rwwff]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', 'A') Florida town has just passed enabling legislation to take any private property to deal with an emergency. Interesting, is it not?