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A Corvette

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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Omnitir » Sun 21 Aug 2005, 07:39:44

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('shady28', '
')I disagree with this...(snip)... Sure, it looks sporty, it has a spoiler, but 1 - its not fast 2 - it doesn't handle. It is an imitation of a sports car, not a sports car.

Okay, I concede that the ideal of a sports car is basically a high performance vehicle. Though these days there are many cars that imitate that ideal and are generally considered sports cars, or at least sporty cars.

Anyway, I imagine that the age of the high-powered performance vehicle is coming to an end. And while it’s exhilarating to drive quickly, it really is a pretty stupid thing. It’s a product of the cheap oil age and of excessiveness. Having all these powerful vehicles on the road is dangerous, especially considering most of them are driven by young males who think they are on a race track. It really sucks when your trying to drive safely and conservatively and some fool in a sports car cuts you off because he has enough power to do so. Then there’s the road rage all this speed causes. Not to mention the massive amount of fuel driving quickly wastes.

While I like the design of a lot of cars (mostly classic ones), I’m not going to miss the death of the performance vehicle. In fact I’m looking forward to it.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby WisJim » Tue 23 Aug 2005, 00:30:39

Ah, sports cars--I remember my first ride in a Triumph TR3, when I was in high school or maybe junior high, and an older brother of a friend took us for a ride. A sports car is a car that could allow you to drag your elbow on the ground while cornering--or at least I have a recollection of my arm being awfully close to the ground.

But for fun, I really like the Bugeye Sprite. Might go 55 mph, but you are so low it is like a go kart, and lots of fun for the dollar.

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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Tue 23 Aug 2005, 01:01:15

Why go for just any old Bugeye Sprite when you can shove a supercharges 350 ci V8 into one instead?

http://kenvoss.com/index.html

Image

Check out the specs:

Before/ After

Horsepower: 43/ 500+

Weight: 1463 Pounds/ 1850 pounds

Fuel Mileage: 38 MPG/ 8 MPG

Fuel capacity: 8 Gallons/ 16 Gallons

Wheels: 3.5" x 13"/ 8" x 15"

Wheel Base: 80"/ 82"

Total length: 10’8"/ 10’10"

Total width: 4’2"/ 4’ 8"

Total height: 3’9"/ 3’5"

Ground Clearance: Unknown/ 5"

Top speed: 80 MPH/ Still Unknown

0 to 60 MPH: 20.9/ 4.0

¼ mile standing start: 21.7/ 8.9 – untested theory


How awesome is that?

Of course, I'd much rather have a Bugeye Sprite either converted to run on electricity via batteries or with a 200+ horsepower turbodiesel modified to run on vegetable oil or B100.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Aedo » Tue 23 Aug 2005, 02:39:16

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', 'W')hy go for just any old Bugeye Sprite when you can shove a supercharges 350 ci V8 into one instead?


You are clearly a petrol head at heart!!! I worry that this Sprite will miss the cornering, useability and "fun factor" of the original (although I concede that the original could do with a little more power!).
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Tue 23 Aug 2005, 04:51:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')ou are clearly a petrol head at heart!!!


Considering the human rights abuses courtesy of the oil industry, all the pork given to the auto industry and oilies, not to mention the environmental devastation from the internal combustion and its costly fuel and maintenance, personally, I could do without petrol.

Yet still, a little fun, so long as its in moderation, can't hurt. If I wouldn't be building an electric sports car, my other project idea was to build a replica of the Mad Max Interceptor, only with an actual functioning blower.
The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby sicophiliac » Thu 25 Aug 2005, 02:20:05

I certianly will miss the days of the performance/sports car. I am working my ass off to get my car finished up with in a year or so so I can at least enjoy it for awhile before peak oil really hits. Its a 71 Dodge Dart im thinking about stuffing a supercharged 360 in or a stroker 416 small block. Of course this will be nothing more then the occasional weekend toy. Muscle cars like it or not are a distinct part of American culture and I am sure many here will cringe at that.. but its a fact. A symbol of our once plentifull resources and of the excessive way of life that we live. I try to be optomistic and think that someday when most transportation out there is independant of fossil fuels that well still have a tad bit of oil left just for nostalgic purposes to keep ( in small numbers) the classic muscle and sports cars around. A throw back to another era when gas was cheap and oil was just gushing from the ground.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Omnitir » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 06:15:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', 'm')y other project idea was to build a replica of the Mad Max Interceptor, only with an actual functioning blower.


Ah, would that be the old Aussie Ford Falcon XC (or were they XA’s?)? Now there’s a classic muscle car. An Aussie icon from the 70’s. Though you have to wonder what the films writers were thinking having those fuel-guzzling beasts racing around the outback in a post PO world. Not overly realistic, but damn it looked cool.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Antimatter » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 06:41:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', 'm')y other project idea was to build a replica of the Mad Max Interceptor, only with an actual functioning blower.


Ah, would that be the old Aussie Ford Falcon XC (or were they XA’s?)? Now there’s a classic muscle car. An Aussie icon from the 70’s. Though you have to wonder what the films writers were thinking having those fuel-guzzling beasts racing around the outback in a post PO world. Not overly realistic, but damn it looked cool.


Ah yes, I love them! Even though they no doubt guzzle fuel. :)

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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby the_red_pill » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 16:42:51

Why don't you guys take the car talk to some other forum? It isn't applicable here. Until I found out about PO, I was a car guy too, but now, I see cars are a huge problem that we need to do something about. We're all fat/lazy with our lifestyles and drivin' everywhere.

All cars are the problem, the way of a car-based life is the problem. Driving solo somewhere instead of mass transit, instead of walking/biking is the problem. Buying over powered cars that cannot be used to their potential on roads anyway is the problem. Not just the stupid utility vehicles. I used to drive a C5 vette everyday and now I'm learning to take the bus. Why don't we use our efforts to get the word out on PO, plan for the future instead of yakking about cars that will be stuck in the garage in a few years b/c gas is $10/gal?

There isn't any way to save the planet without getting rid of cars. I love waxing poetic about sports cars too, but here isn't the place.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby GoIllini » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 18:13:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('the_red_pill', 'W')hy don't you guys take the car talk to some other forum? It isn't applicable here. Until I found out about PO, I was a car guy too, but now, I see cars are a huge problem that we need to do something about. We're all fat/lazy with our lifestyles and drivin' everywhere.

All cars are the problem, the way of a car-based life is the problem. Driving solo somewhere instead of mass transit, instead of walking/biking is the problem. Buying over powered cars that cannot be used to their potential on roads anyway is the problem. Not just the stupid utility vehicles. I used to drive a C5 vette everyday and now I'm learning to take the bus. Why don't we use our efforts to get the word out on PO, plan for the future instead of yakking about cars that will be stuck in the garage in a few years b/c gas is $10/gal?

There isn't any way to save the planet without getting rid of cars. I love waxing poetic about sports cars too, but here isn't the place.


I'll be biking to work long before I stop visiting car shows. My friend who drag races might very well be doing the same before he stops heading up to the race track every month- and he'll probably do that once gas is around $100/gallon relative to his oil investments.

Just like model railroads will probably still get taken out every weekend when we're only getting 500 watts of electricity per household, so too will sports cars.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby the_red_pill » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 20:01:08

Why don't you guys take the car talk to some other forum? It isn't applicable here. Until I found out about PO, I was a car guy too, but now, I see cars are a huge problem that we need to do something about. We're all fat/lazy with our lifestyles and drivin' everywhere.

All cars are the problem, the way of a car-based life is the problem. Driving solo somewhere instead of mass transit, instead of walking/biking is the problem. Buying over powered cars that cannot be used to their potential on roads anyway is the problem. Not just the stupid utility vehicles. I used to drive a C5 vette everyday and now I'm learning to take the bus. Why don't we use our efforts to get the word out on PO, plan for the future instead of yakking about cars that will be stuck in the garage in a few years b/c gas is $10/gal?

There isn't any way to save the planet without getting rid of cars. I love waxing poetic about sports cars too, but here isn't the place.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby shady28 » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 20:40:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('the_red_pill', 'W')hy don't you guys take the car talk to some other forum? It isn't applicable here. Until I found out about PO, I was a car guy too, but now, I see cars are a huge problem that we need to do something about. We're all fat/lazy with our lifestyles and drivin' everywhere.


I don't see PO as the problem. I see it as the Kondratieff wave. Part of the Kondratieff wave is that at peaks people get fat/lazy, go into debt, and waste a lot of resources. Those that bothered to study a bit of history before investing and refused to participate in the debt frenzy and speculation, but saved their money instead, will prosper in the next few years. Those that didn't learn from history do not have the perspective to understand what is going on, and will fret over whatever CNN and MSNBC tells them to fret about. It just so happens that right now, that is "peak oil".

Oil is just another mania. It's no different from beanie babys, dot-coms, or housing. Oil inventories are not out of line with our consumption, only gasoline is. The reason gasoline is out of line is that speculators have bid oil up to unreasonable levels, and refineries do not want to hold huge stocks of gasoline that costs a lot of $$ to make and thus subjecting them to extreme losses in any oil market crash.

Consider that companies like Morgan Stanley are leasing oil storage tanks to store their bought up oil in. Speculation at its finest. Can't wait till oil drops some more so i can short the crap out of the financial stocks.

This is a good time to buy a Corvette.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Omnitir » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 21:28:54

the_red_pill,
Here’s the thing – it’s not the car enthusiasts that are the problem, it’s the everyday use by the average Joe to commute that is the problem. It’s all the drivers sitting in cars by themselves in slowly crawling traffic that is the problem. The enthusiasts, who individually spend much more on fuel and maintenance then the average Joes, contribute to only a tiny amount of oil consumption. It’s the average Joes in their stock standard, sometimes reasonably fuel-efficient cars, who look down at the car enthusiasts that are the problem.

Looking down at car enthusiasm as being wasteful is hypocritical considering it’s all those unnecessary commuting trips that are the worst offenders.

I know people who are into off-road driving, own big expensive “SUV’s”, but only use them for recreation occasionally and catch the local train to work. The same with people I know who have race cars and take them out to the track once a month for some fun – they use public transport most then they drive. Yet some non-car enthusiasts give them a hard time for wasting fuel and money, while the non-car enthusiasts drive to and from work everyday when there are perfectly good options for alternative transport. It’s hypocritical.

There’s nothing wrong with recreational motor sport. There is everything wrong with everyday commuting.

Though it does really annoy me when people in sports cars race through traffic because they don’t have the brains or the courage to save the racing for the race-track.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby shady28 » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 22:47:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', 'T')he enthusiasts, who individually spend much more on fuel and maintenance then the average Joes, contribute to only a tiny amount of oil consumption. It’s the average Joes in their stock standard, sometimes reasonably fuel-efficient cars, who look down at the car enthusiasts that are the problem.


That's also very true. I'm looking at corvettes in the 1992-1996 range and most of them have under 50,000 miles, are superbly maintained, and don't cost much. People that buy this type of car do not drive them a lot.

I have two vehicles, a small truck and a motorcycle. The bike gets over 40mpg if im really dogging it, close to 60 if I'm taking it real easy, 50mpg is the norm. I ride to work about 1/2 the time.

Big fun is pissing off SUV drivers. They usually hit the gas when you zip by, and I just think to myself 'yeah, there goes another buck in gas for ya' as I speed away at 50mpg. I love watching SUV people at gas stations now too, gas attendants are always writing down their plate numbers when they pull in (too many SUV drive-offs I guess).
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Specop_007 » Fri 26 Aug 2005, 23:45:31

Specop thinks Toe Cutter doesnt fully appreciate the capabilities of a Corvette. It is one of the finest production sports cars to grace the streets.

And Spec would remind him the Z06 takes it to new levels.
And the C6 Z06 is probably the best bang for the buck out there.

I found this elsewhere, supposedly it came from Motor Trend however i was unable to find the article.

Corvette Z06 goes to Nurburgring test Track
The good news is the Z06 gets the second fastest production car time ever (7min 42secs)...almost 30 secs faster than the Viper and 10 secs faster than the 2 Lamborghini models for sale now.

Bad news is it seems to have some downforce issues.

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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Omnitir » Sat 27 Aug 2005, 02:16:22

I agree – small cars with high-tech adjustments like turbos are great against bigger and older rigs on the streets. But put a small car up against a large powerful one on a race track, and after the initial 10 seconds the large cars will flog the smaller ones. Just look at European super car races – the small light-weight turbocharged Porsche almost always gets flogged by the massive ultra-heavy V12 Lamborghini. –Provided the driver has the appropriate skill.

At the end of the day, there simply is nothing higher performance then sheer cubic inches.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby hoplite » Sat 27 Aug 2005, 19:15:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', 'I') agree – small cars with high-tech adjustments like turbos are great against bigger and older rigs on the streets. But put a small car up against a large powerful one on a race track, and after the initial 10 seconds the large cars will flog the smaller ones. Just look at European super car races – the small light-weight turbocharged Porsche almost always gets flogged by the massive ultra-heavy V12 Lamborghini. –Provided the driver has the appropriate skill.

At the end of the day, there simply is nothing higher performance then sheer cubic inches.


Thats NOT true, the lowly AC/Ford Cobra of 1964 absolutely OWNED Ferrari/Porsche shocking the racing world with world class performance at 1/10th the cost of the Italian supercars. I happen to own a hand built (by me) replica of the 1965 427 AC Cobra. (www.factoryfive.com kit car). This car exceeds the performance of ANY modern supercar at almost any price- I have less than 50k US$ into mine.

My factory Five 65 Roadster stats:
0-60 3.2 seconds
1/4 mile 10.8 seconds/ 132 MPH
Over 180 MPH (although admittedly its not stable at over 160)
MPG: 15 city 18 highway
Curb weight 2200lbs.
lateral accel: 1.05 G
0-100-0 14 seconds

The above performance is acheived with a 392 CI Ford Small block (Bored and stroked 351 Windsor).
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby pilferage » Sat 27 Aug 2005, 20:57:28

Sounds like a 240z with a 383. Except you can build that for under 10k no prob.
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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby Cool Hand Linc » Sat 27 Aug 2005, 21:24:08

Hey, that Bugeye was pretty cool. My brothers second car was a Bugeye Sprite. 8O

Never understood that.
Peace out!

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Re: A Corvette

Unread postby The_Toecutter » Sat 27 Aug 2005, 22:20:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')h, would that be the old Aussie Ford Falcon XC (or were they XA’s?)? Now there’s a classic muscle car. An Aussie icon from the 70’s. Though you have to wonder what the films writers were thinking having those fuel-guzzling beasts racing around the outback in a post PO world. Not overly realistic, but damn it looked cool.


Actually, the Mad Max Interceptor was a Ford Falcon XB coupe with a Monza custom front end. Sick, sick car.

In the movie, the car was said to have 600 horsepower at the wheels, which is it would weigh 3,000 pounds and have about a .35 drag coefficient, top speed with proper gearing would have been around 220, 1/4 mile in the high 10 second range. Gordon Hayes, a proficient writer of Mad Max fan fiction and also a builder of an actual functioning replica, ended up writing MFP: The Chronicle which claimed the fictional car as being able to hit 240.

Of course, in real life, the blower of the movie's Interceptor is non functioning, and given that it's an old Cleveland, there's no way it would have 600 horse at the wheels, more like 250 at the wheels. Then there were those BF Goodrich tires; they're only rated to 112 mph.

A shame the real car is not all its cracked out to be in the film. If I were to build a replica, I'd want everything functioning and real, not no fake supercharger and low speed tires. People have built replicas with functioning blowers and high sped tires, and they SCREAM.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')pecop thinks Toe Cutter doesnt fully appreciate the capabilities of a Corvette. It is one of the finest production sports cars to grace the streets.

And Spec would remind him the Z06 takes it to new levels.
And the C6 Z06 is probably the best bang for the buck out there.

I found this elsewhere, supposedly it came from Motor Trend however i was unable to find the article.

Corvette Z06 goes to Nurburgring test Track
The good news is the Z06 gets the second fastest production car time ever (7min 42secs)...almost 30 secs faster than the Viper and 10 secs faster than the 2 Lamborghini models for sale now.

Bad news is it seems to have some downforce issues.


Screw Nurburgring. That track does not push those cars to their limits. It's relatively flat, somewhat gentle corners. No, I want to see how it fares in Targa Florio. Targa Florio is the test.

Lets put that Corvette up against a Porsche 908/3, Alfa Romeo 33TT3, Ferrari 312 P/B, or a Radical SRL3 in a modern day Targa Florio. Those first three cars are all from the early 1970s, the next comes about halfway to being a modern equivalent. How many Cobras shunted at the Targa Florio, and how many Cobras have killed Corvettes?
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