[dmtu]

This subject has already been visited to a small degree ( http://www.peakoil.com/postt69.html ) but our little group is becoming a bit more diverse and I wonder if a better title might bring out some more ideas on this subject. Certainly this thread, if it gains traction, will bring out a large degree of speculation but, if my meager education in finances serves me that's what the market is anyway. If you believe peak is in 2008 what are you going to do? On a personal level I intend to change jobs soon and haven't the foggiest idea concerning my 401k.

Will the Market fail, what about banks and the $100,000 FDIC guarantee? Will $100,000 still buy a loaf of bread? Will the dollar survive? but lastly if you have an opinion, what will happen to gold.

[MattSavinar]

You really need to get "The Oil Factor" by Stephen Leeb.

He was interviewed on FinancialSense.com on their May 8th, 2004 show.

Matt
http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net

[Ender]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'Y')ou really need to get "The Oil Factor" by Stephen Leeb.
He was interviewed on FinancialSense.com on their May 8th, 2004 show.

[k_semler]

Link

[dav0_100]

My politics has changed markedly over the last 6 months as I have discovered the peak oil story - and as I look at all my political bretheren with whom I now share the same views - and many with their 60/70s hippy style (not that there is anything wrong with that) I sense an incredible irony.
These well meaning friends who want to change the world and have all these great ideals (socialists etc) dont seem to realise one incredible powerful thing that they hold in their hand. It is like they have been carrying around an economic hiroshima bomb in their own pocket whilst shouting veinly for a changing world while nobody was listening - and they didn't even know what they had at their disposal. It is the power collectively to bring down the god forsaken monetary system on which this whole system of greed & rabid consumption is based. This same military/industrial/political system that has given us peak oil to start with, exploited our
workers, stolen our money, and is also currently on a knife edge due to the emergence of peak oil.

What they do not realise is that they can go a long way to bringing the whole thing down, and protecting and growing their remaining and hard earned income in the same action.
All they need to do is go to a bullion dealer and purchase physical gold and silver - and keep doing it. The dirty little secret of the US FED is that they have been cooking the books on Gold on Silver for years in an attempt to keep interest rates trending down and prop up the global economy. Unbeknowns to these hippy types is that coordinated purchase of the bullion (particularly silver) amongst the population will bring the derivative house of cards down on Wall street and then its altalavista baby for the US economy. Its just that simple. There is more I could say but it all revolves around these critical markets. Precious Metals and Crude Oil. EVERYTHING absolutely everything.....House valuations, stock market, interest rates you name it....EVERYTHING.

Once oil heads up beyond $70USD a barrel everyone and their dog will be buying precious metals anyway - and this will ensure the US economy will be toast in a flash. It is only a matter of time now - the US FED may be able to manipulate markets at a whim to keep things chugging along for now but it cannot manipulate nature and the depletion of the fuel/oxygen to which it owes its very existence.
So the next question I hear you ask is why on earth would the US FED facilitate the selling of western government precious metal into the open market to prop up the current economic system when peak oil in fact guarantees the demise of the current financial system anyway, and also guarantees the ascention of Gold and Silver to the moon in the process? Well Well Well...the rabbit hole is deep, and there are many who do not know the implications of peak oil on the financial system who have huge stashes of gold and silver (governments) and there are equally many "in the know" bankers & industrialists who do know what is coming and would be very happy to buy all they could from our stupid government officials at giveaway prices.

Here lies the greatest public scam & swindle of the 21st Century - probably bigger than the 1913 Fed Reserve Act and creation of our current debt based international pyramid monetary system post WW2.
Yes my friends its time to collectively torch these invisible theives and also get the other lackies who ran the fiat money system we now have - for their time is coming anyway. My Advice - get your piece of the pie before they take it from our western governemnts at 5 & 10 cents in the dollar and then end up selling it back to the populace at 100 cents in the dollar when the oil preverbial hits the fan in a few years. In so doing you will contribute more in this act to your idealistic political objectives and also your own financial security than 20 years of activism.

[Pops]

Hi Dave.
Do you have any balanced sources regarding the privatization of the monetary system in the US? I’ve seen some, but mostly they are from those involved in buying and selling PMs – surprise!
And why having some old quarters is better than having a couple of acres of potatoes, for example.
Give us some links to study please. :D

[Guest]

I think the potato versus quarters question can be answered without reference to 'experts'. Ideally you want both the quarters and the spuds. And if you cannot get both then you have to decide case by case, an ailing urban professional might not be able to farm or defend the plot whereas I might feel land can grow me more than silver coins ever will.
Concerning biased information; it is important to look for secondary motives in everything we read. I regularly visit a Gold Discusion site, and like this Peak Oil site they share a general agenda, in their case about gold, with a spectrum of views and many posters adding info and links from 'balanced' sources to defend the various positions they take. And also like this Peak Oil site they have an excellent archive of materials to inform the reader of the underlying theories, etc. I would recommend it because, despite the fact it is sponsored by individuals who have an interest in the sale and purchase of gold, the posts are from anybody and, like reading all the views here and gathering more info on my own, I'm the one who has to decide in the end.

www.usagold.com go look especially the 'another' archives

[dav0_100]

This is a great video - there is also some recommended reading. It is an expose of the great effort the bankers went to in getting their central bank in the USA. It is a HUGE and accurate history lesson going back as far as the 18th Centruy.

http://www.themoneymasters.com/

[Pops]

Great, thanks!

[oli]

Title is basically the gist of this post.
But seeing as how oil is getting more expensive, and reading about platinum mines not being able to output enough ore to meet projections, coupled with the whole "FUEL CELLS!"-thing, I got to thinking that if one wanted to invest in the long-term, perhaps the noble element Pt would make some sense.
And if so, would futures or the physical commodity be better.
What say you?

[MicroHydro]

I bought AngloPlatinum mining stock, it trades on the South African Johannesburg stock exchange. The stock has done very well lately. Essentially they are a cartel and control the majority of world platinum production.

[patmaster75]

Tough call, as platinium price per oz is more expensive than gold, therefore holding physical platinum (in the form of coins etc) may be cost prohibitive. Also the factors to consider with holding physical is the issue of storage etc. Also could depend on your level of how bad it is going to get (i.e. your doomer level) and what your strategy as to getting into PM (precious metals) is. Are you getting into it for an investment, or "insurance" (i.e. are things going to get REAL bad). If it is insurance you may lean to more the physical, investment - you may want to consider company stock like you mentioned. I think you can get into futures contracts and so on as well but I dont know much about those.

My self I'm more into gold (holding physical, want to get silver as well - platinium is out of my price range) but I view it as my Peak Oil insurance - i.e. as replacement currency once paper money becomes worthless to be only used for emergency (i.e. buying food, weapons etc). I'm only a beginner in the PM game but I think they are the one shinining light in an otherwise dark future ahead.

If I was going for platinium I would probably go for stock as a gut call, but its like any investment - do your research, dont put all your eggs in one basket, whats your exit strategy (i.e. how do you reap your profit?) - you might want to consider gold and silver as well, if you go physical in platinium it may be hard to reap any profit from it as it probably is going to be way out of anyones price rance <edit> out of anyones price range if we have the hard crash I'm fearing</edit>...dunno just my thoughts.

Good Luck!

[Utopia]

My first post but been trolling for much longer, alas I cannot find the answer in the forums to my question.
I want to purchase silver but am unsure what I should be getting to stash away for a rainy day, it took me a while to even track down a bullion dealer in Canada.

Regardless, I was hoping to find a dealer with 1 oz bullion bars, but it seems all that is made now is 10 oz and up. My question is this, what is the best form to hold silver in? 1oz bars, 10oz bars, Mint coins? (Which are much more expensive than the boullion is) As much as I would like to keep my silver stocks in 1oz increments I dont think this will be possible.
Feedback would be greatly appreciated. If this has been covered before a link to the old article would be appreciated as well.

[Pops]

Hi U, I’m not a fan of PMs for just the reason you mention – if you are having a hard time buying it now; imagine the problems selling it later when you may need the cash.

But I’m sure someone will chime in with a constructive suggestion.

[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', 'H')i U, I’m not a fan of PMs for just the reason you mention – if you are having a hard time buying it now; imagine the problems selling it later when you may need the cash.
But I’m sure someone will chime in with a constructive suggestion.

[gt1370a]

Ever heard of Ebay?

[bobcousins]

I have been looking into buying gold/silver recently, this is what I have found, but I am not an expert. It is definitely something you need to investigate rather than leap in and start buying. It seems to be better to go for coins than bars, coins are more tradeable. The problem with coins is that collectors collect them! So desirable coins trade for more than bulk price. In addition, when silver coins were used as currency, silver content varied. Coins for circulation are an alloy with copper to make them more hard wearing (or cheaper). Since silver stopped being used for currency, special "bullion" coins have been minted which are 99.99% silver, and are not intended for circulation. These though are prettied up so collectors buy them.
So...ask your coin dealer for "investment" silver coins. These will be older coins, of whatever is the cheapest price. These should be closest to bulk price.

As has been mentioned, buying PMs as a hedge against inflation assumes a stable society where there will be dealers willing to buy the coins back. Whether buying PM is the best hedge is another question. I'm not so convinced that PMs will necessarily shoot up in price in the case of an inflationary recession, and I strongly doubt that gold or silver will return as a currency to replace paper in the case of real breakdown. People no longer have any idea how to use them as a currency. Could you tell which coin was 50% silver and which 99.99%? It is reported that in Bosnia the most valuable commodity was toilet paper.
The best advice as always with investments is to have a spread portfolio. Oh, and consult some real experts

[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gt1370a', 'E')ver heard of Ebay?

[marko]

I have been looking into silver, too. I think the usual term in the US for what you want is "junk silver" These are run-of-the-mill old silver coins that have circulated and show signs of wear and thus have little or no value for collectors. Their value is tied to the spot price of silver. Apparently, some dealers will sell bags of old US coins by the face value of the US coins. Since their weight was proportional to their face value, face value is a proxy for weight. Bags with face value of US$1,000 sell for around US$5,500 based on their silver content. They have about 720 ounces of silver. The bag would weigh close to 50 lbs, so you may want a very sturdy backpack if you buy it from a retail dealer!

However, Bob Cousins has made me reconsider my plan to buy junk silver. I had been thinking of these coins as a means of exchange after the dollar becomes worthless, but I think that Bob is probably right that we have mostly lost the culture of using precious metals as means of exchange.
It really does seem that there will be no way to preserve much value in a full-blown financial collapse unless you have your own oil tank and friends in high places who will supply the police to protect it!

[Zentric]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('marko', 'H')owever, Bob Cousins has made me reconsider my plan to buy junk silver. I had been thinking of these coins as a means of exchange after the dollar becomes worthless, but I think that Bob is probably right that we have mostly lost the culture of using precious metals as means of exchange.