[aldente]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Macsporan', ' ') the 3000 mile Salad or cannibalism, everything or nothing

[whiteknight]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('spudbuddy', ' ')I still believe that capitalism is like a bad guard dog with big teeth and a ravenous appetite on a leash that's way too long.

[skyemoor]

In a sense, PO may reduce our greenhouse gas emissions, unless we make a big shift to oil shale, coal, etc. All we would do then would be to slightly delay PO, but accelerate climate disruption.

It all depends upon how sacred people hold their highly energy gluttonous livestyles, and how much fossil fuel campaign contributions sway their votes.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('doufus', '
')However, Duke's are usually appointed on high and not amongst the
lowly. That is, in the unlikely event that a feudal system breaks out,
your Duke will be a buddy of the Grand Gumball-possibly a relative
or at least a TRUSTED corrupt confidante of the people at the higher
level.

[DaveA]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whiteknight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('doufus', '
')However, Duke's are usually appointed on high and not amongst the
lowly. That is, in the unlikely event that a feudal system breaks out,
your Duke will be a buddy of the Grand Gumball-possibly a relative
or at least a TRUSTED corrupt confidante of the people at the higher
level. I hope you have kissed the Gumball's behind to this point.
It may not be enough. In fact the Gumball isn't even in sight right
now. He just emerges after the usual bloodletting.

[Beagle]

I think one of the problems with the "doomer" outlook is the fact that here in the west we're a few generations into an incredibly wasteful lifestyle and quite a lot of forumers here cannot even imagine how we can possibly conserve and contract our use of resources. It's either the status quo or total breakdown.

For example, we have endless sprawling suburbs of monster houses being heated for only 2 or 3 people, yet for some reason we're going to start burning tonnes more coal to maintain them all instead of moving more people into fewer houses. Why cannot intelligent people figure out that it uses a lot less energy to heat one big house to house 15 or 20 people than a whole block with 3 or 4 people per house.

So the economy takes a nosedive, your neighbours are losing their jobs and your relatives houses are being foreclosed on? No problem, you're just going to have to modify your living arrangements. Extended families will move back in together and pool resources. Gas too expensive? Well, lose the cable T.V. and no drive to Florida this year. However, this type of shift is not going to start until it is unavoidable.

Today, I see wealthy couples living alone in 4000 sqft. houses in the exurbs on 1 or 2 acres of ex-farmland surrounding every city in North America. These houses are fully serviced by their cities at incredible expense and use incredible amount of energy. This type of thing is the epitome of excess and waste in our society. We will go a long way in elliminating this stuff before we have to start eating our neighbours.

Of course, if you're one of these couples and you can't possible see what's wrong with your lifestyle or imagine changing it. "Oh, I'd just die if I didn't have 600 thead count percale sheets and a down duvet"... Then you just might.

It's not hard for me to see the above type housing supporting large extended families in the future who use all that land to grow food and raise a few animals. Perhaps they'll have one car amongst them to take the occasional trip into town to get supplies and maybe sell some things. With our modern communications maybe someone will be working from home and maybe some others will carpool into the city on Monday and stay there till Friday and carpool back. Kinda like the 30's but vastly different of course due to advances in technology etc.

The question is can we adjust fast enough to compensate for a 2 to 3% decline in oil production per annum over the next decades. I think we can. At least some countries will. It all depends on leadership (and that's where my personal pessimism kicks in).

[DaveA]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Beagle', '.')


So the economy takes a nosedive, your neighbours are losing their jobs and your relatives houses are being foreclosed on? No problem, you're just going to have to modify your living arrangements. Extended families will move back in together and pool resources. Gas too expensive? Well, lose the cable T.V. and no drive to Florida this year. However, this type of shift is not going to start until it is unavoidable.

Today, I see wealthy couples living alone in 4000 sqft. houses in the exurbs on 1 or 2 acres of ex-farmland surrounding every city in North America. These houses are fully serviced by their cities at incredible expense and use incredible amount of energy. This type of thing is the epitome of excess and waste in our society. We will go a long way in elliminating this stuff before we have to start eating our neighbours.

[whiteknight]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DaveA', 'T')he military can and will be fully functional no matter what happens, a friend of mine told me military bases run pretty efficiently, and they have the largest stockpiles of... well everything.

[oiless]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whiteknight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DaveA', 'T')he military can and will be fully functional no matter what happens, a friend of mine told me military bases run pretty efficiently, and they have the largest stockpiles of... well everything.

[oiless]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whiteknight', 't')he powers tha be wont give a shit if you call yourself "CEO" "Owner" "Duke" or "Master of Reality" and they certainly wont give a shit how you treat the employees as long as you turn out the products. As for how you handle plant security they again could care less as long as the products keep flowing and the bribes keep finding thier pockets.

[holmes]

please note: DO NOT SMOKE CRACK BEFORE OR WHILE BROWSING OR POSTING ON PO.COM.
PLEASE REFRAIN FROM USING ANY REFERENCES TO THE BIBLE. IT IS A STORY made up by man. I am sure it has some factual references however it is not SCIENCE. science is observation and what is actually going on around you on this earth. do not muddy po.coms waters with sewage and industrial pollutants. thank u.

ok now with california. read up:

Land area, 2000 (square miles)
Persons per square mile, 2000

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/06000.html
http://www.sprawlcity.org/studyCA/index.html

calfornia will be a migrating cascadeing ecological death zone. But they might have their lights on.

[DaveA]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whiteknight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DaveA', 'T')he military can and will be fully functional no matter what happens, a friend of mine told me military bases run pretty efficiently, and they have the largest stockpiles of... well everything.