[Z]

They didn't found a single WMD
They killed tens of thousand of people.
They flushed 100's of billion dollars down the toilet.
They created a gigantic training field for terrorists.
They will end up with an Islamic Country
They setup a new ally for Iran.

But it's OK, because they were *RIGHT*.

[Specop_007]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Z', 'T')hey didn't found a single WMD

[sklump]

Iran?

You guys cannot afford to do "save" another country. Especially a country with almost as many 15-to-25-year-old males as you have.

Iran will knock you over. If you hadn't gone to Iraq, maybe you could afford another Vietnam. Don't do it. You are in debt up to your eyeballs. You will take the world economy with you if you don't start addressing your debt crisis, toute-fucking-de-suite.

$8 trillion in federal gov't debt
$40 trillion in off-books federal obligations
$0.5 trillion per year in federal deficit
$0.8 trillion per year in trade deficit
negative personal savings ratio - i.e., credit card debt mounting faster than earnings

Please put pressure the powers that be to your own house in order before burning down yet another one.

[aceace]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Z', 'T')hey didn't found a single WMD

[eric_b]

Another ugly thread.

I never supported the 'war' in Iraq. I thought it was a huge mistake at the time
and now I'm doubly certain it was. All the 'official' reasons for going there have proven
to be lies. The country is now worse off than it was when Saddam was there, and the
US is doing nothing but sowing the seeds of hate at this point. The US has killed
so many people there... does anyone think this isn't going to come back to haunt us?

No WMDs - like any reasonable person considered Saddam a threat (especially to
the US).

Democracies aren't 'installed'. The ones that are tend not to last. Using this metric
('Spreading democracy' - another expression almost as stoopid as the 'War on Terror' -
can't stop terrorism anymore than one can stop people from killing each other)
there are many other countries (African, N. Korea) we should be invading to 'install
democracy'. We aren't, cuz it's all about the resources stoopid.

Not to mention all the wasted money, the scarred US soldiers, DU poisoning...
the list is long and ugly and goes on and on.

I'm just flabbergasted that any sane person can actually support the 'War' in Iraq at this
point. In retrospect it seems obvious the Bush administration
took advantage of all the rage 9-11 generated to lead the duped masses in the US
to war with ease. The fact 9-11 may have been allowed to happen (or even planned!)
makes the entire affair even more disheartening.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Oh, and this doesn't even take into account the economic atrocities levied against
Iraq for years before the US invaded. These alone were reponsible for millions of
children starving to death. The country was really just a shell when the US invaded, and
it's becoming increasingly clear Saddam was much more adept at holding the various
competing tribes in check the US will ever be. Can anyone wonder why so many
of these people hate the US?

Nuff said on this ugly topic for me.

[Blueberry]

Support for the war dwindling means we are less afraid.

Can't have that.

I wonder what will happen to make us more afraid again?

[Specop_007]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('aceace', 'D')ude, what the US is doing creating a war that will never end. If you're happy with that then you obviously have no concern for human life. I don't know why you think that less then 100,000 have been killed. The US Govt does not keep track of civilian casualties, other people do. The Fallujah massacre killed 20,000 and that is a conservative estimate. I wouldn't be surprised if the actual death toll was nearing 150-160,000. One third of these are under 18. Deal with it. By your name specop007 I am sure your military or ex-military. Your training has taken any sort of reasonable thought from you. You are not capable of communicating with those that are not brainwashed.

[Specop_007]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Blueberry', 'S')upport for the war dwindling means we are less afraid.

Can't have that.

I wonder what will happen to make us more afraid again?

[gego]

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash3.htm

"We are not waging a war on terror in this country. We’re waging a war of terror. The biggest terrorist in the world is George W. Bush!"

...

"We want our country back and, if we have to impeach everybody from George Bush down to the person who picks up dog shit in Washington, we will impeach all those people."

[MicroHydro]

If the war is so great, send Barbara and Jenna! Make Laura Bush a gold star mom and see how she likes it.

[BitterSweetCrude]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MicroHydro', 'I')f the war is so great, send Barbara and Jenna! Make Laura Bush a gold star mom and see how she likes it.

[Geology_Guy]

OK-so lets say we do what Cindy S. asks and all US troops leave Iraq. Just a question though-do we care what happens to Iraq after that point? If the Sunnis massacre Shia and Kurds we just ignore it right? No matter if women are oppressed by Sharia law we just stay out of it right? I am just wondering how we are going too approach these questions....

[BitterSweetCrude]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Geology_Guy', 'O')K-so lets say we do what Cindy S. asks and all US troops leave Iraq. Just a question though-do we care what happens to Iraq after that point? If the Sunnis massacre Shia and Kurds we just ignore it right? No matter if women are oppressed by Sharia law we just stay out of it right? I am just wondering how we are going too approach these questions....

[oowolf]

Cin, let me buy you a beer!

[EnemyCombatant]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')You're right. She's a crackpot, she has a right to say what she wants, but leaving Iraq now is just inviting the whole place to descend into chaos, and who knows how bad it would get.

Sure we messed up going into Iraq, but leaving now would be far worse for everyone.

[BitterSweetCrude]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnemyCombatant', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')You're right. She's a crackpot, she has a right to say what she wants, but leaving Iraq now is just inviting the whole place to descend into chaos, and who knows how bad it would get.

Sure we messed up going into Iraq, but leaving now would be far worse for everyone.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BitterSweetCrude', 'Y')ou're right. She's a crackpot, she has a right to say what she wants, but leaving Iraq now is just inviting the whole place to descend into chaos, and who knows how bad it would get.

Sure we messed up going into Iraq, but leaving now would be far worse for everyone.

[EnemyCombatant]

I don't want to pay for when I can't even afford healthcare.

If we leave the insurgency will go away. True it would become an Islamist state that beats women. However, I am sure the moullahs would bring in the Russians and/or Europeans to get the oil pumping at maximum capacity.

We can't afford 1.5 billion dollars a week. The soldiers are being bum fucked. They are just hunkered down and hope nobody shoots them in the back. It's not like they are FIGHTING the insurgency. They are on the defensive.

Look, I agree with you that leaving Iraq is a nightmare. But we have to seriously debate staying vs leaving.

If you really want my opinion.

We should give Saddam Hussein a shave and a shower and instill him as dictator again. He knows how to put the smack down.

Honestly, I don't know the answer. I'm not qualified. But neither are the neocons. WE should open this up to a national debate without it turning into a 2 minute hate.