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Doom do you want it to happen?

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Newfie » Wed 17 Feb 2016, 18:02:30

Yah think? They should get a room. It's spread over most of the threads I visit. Boooooring.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby careinke » Thu 18 Feb 2016, 17:15:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Timo', '
')
I've been shot once as a little kid. It was a complete accident, or so they told me. Horsing around in a friends basement with a bb gun, someone pulled the trigger, and OW!!!! Right leg below the knee. Tweezers pulled that sucker out. I don't even remember that it drew any blood. We debated for the rest of the day if it was a direct hit, or a ricochet off of a wall.

Kids! They do the damnedest things.


This is exactly why kids SHOULD have BB guns, airsoft guns, etc. It teaches them at a visceral level that misusing guns can have bad consequences. Yet the damage inflicted is very rarely lethal.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Newfie » Thu 18 Feb 2016, 22:15:56

That's it, I'm staying away from you guys!
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 19 Feb 2016, 01:06:35

Remember kids guns do not kills people do --- boohoo.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Wed 02 Mar 2016, 18:16:32

As much as I would find the death of the majority of the human population an unpleasant and undesirable experience, I think the collapse of industrial civilization might be a good thing because humanity has already gone so far into overshoot that it isn't even funny.

Honestly, I don't even care if our species is facing near-term extinction because the Earth will go on without us until the Sun becomes a red-giant and destroys the Earth. The Earth and the rest of the biosphere will probably be better without humanity.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Timo » Wed 02 Mar 2016, 18:40:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DesuMaiden', 'A')s much as I would find the death of the majority of the human population an unpleasant and undesirable experience, I think the collapse of industrial civilization might be a good thing because humanity has already gone so far into overshoot that it isn't even funny.

Honestly, I don't even care if our species is facing near-term extinction because the Earth will go on without us until the Sun becomes a red-giant and destroys the Earth. The Earth and the rest of the biosphere will probably be better without humanity.

Well, that changes everything! Thanks Desu. I'm feeling much better now.

In all honesty, I'm right there with you. It is an unpleasant dichotomy, but from all archeological records, earth was much healthier before humanity entered the scene.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Wed 02 Mar 2016, 20:24:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Timo', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DesuMaiden', 'A')s much as I would find the death of the majority of the human population an unpleasant and undesirable experience, I think the collapse of industrial civilization might be a good thing because humanity has already gone so far into overshoot that it isn't even funny.

Honestly, I don't even care if our species is facing near-term extinction because the Earth will go on without us until the Sun becomes a red-giant and destroys the Earth. The Earth and the rest of the biosphere will probably be better without humanity.

Well, that changes everything! Thanks Desu. I'm feeling much better now.

In all honesty, I'm right there with you. It is an unpleasant dichotomy, but from all archeological records, earth was much healthier before humanity entered the scene.

Of course, the 7 billion plus humans now on Earth will not go away without a fight. They will consume almost every last bit of energy before they finally go extinct. We will probably wipe out most of the terrestrial vertebrate species before we finally become extinct.

In fact, 97% of terrestrial vertebrate biomass is already comprised of human beings and our domesticated animals. Wild animals comprise of no more than 3% of that biomass.

Humanity is like a cancer. We have now run out of space to spread, so we will eventually kill the biosphere. And with that, we go as well.

The Anthropocene era will be leave a mark on the fossil record, no doubt. In a relatively short amount of time geologically-speaking, we have changed the surface of the planet beyond all recognition.

I don't see human extinction as more than a few generations away.

With human overpopulation, resource depletion and catastrophic climate change ready to inflict the mortal blow on humanity, get ready to prepare for the worst. But it was fun while it lasted because we've created more material-wealth than people of previous generations could ever imagine

As many people on this site have already realized, no combination of renewable/alternative energies (biofuels, hydrogen, solar, wind and etc) or technology can prevent humanity from collapsing because we've depleted so many essential natural resources that no technofix can replace the resources that we used up and wasted.

Even if we could find a new energy source to replace fossil fuels, we will probably end up expanding our population even more (due to the human nature to continue expand its scale whenever extra energy is available). And then deplete other essential resources that cannot be replaced. Thereby causing our demise at a later time.

The best you can do is join VHEMT (Voluntary Human Extinction Movenment), and voluntarily reduce global human population. So that when SHTF, we can reduce the amount of suffering people endure. But that's unlikely to happen because due to human nature, we will continue to grow the population, until the resource-base is exhausted. And then the population will have to rapidly diminish.

Every 24 hours, the global human population increases by over 200,000 people. It is estimated that if business-as-usual continues, at our current rate of population growth, we will reach 9 billion people by 2050. I doubt we can support our current population, let alone 9 billion plus people.

Eventually the population bubble has to pop. As Al Bartlett once said, "the greatest shortcoming of the human race is our inability to understand the exponential function". Seems like that is the case, otherwise, human population wouldn't be increasingly as rapidly as it is.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 03 Mar 2016, 16:20:23

"Humanity is like a cancer." Yes Desu, we have certainly acted like it.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Newfie » Thu 03 Mar 2016, 21:16:56

Yes, a pretty apt analogy, unfortunately.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 08:51:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', '&')quot;Humanity is like a cancer." Yes Desu, we have certainly acted like it.

There are many articles online that suggests that to be the case. Humanity has taken over virtually all of the ecosystems on this planet, and forced all of the other species to near extinction or extinction.

We have destroyed the planet, and converted most of its vertebrate biomass into human beings and our domesticated animals. Wild animals only take up 3% of the Earth's terrestrial vertebrate biomass. We and our domesticated animals take up the other 97%.

It was inevitable that humans would spread like cancer throughout this planet, given that we are far more powerful in manipulating the environment than other animals. Homo sapien's evolutionary advantages in being able to exploit resources beyond what other animals could gave us unprecedented dominance in the animal kingdom.

But man has become so destructive that his demise will be his own undoing. We are facing a peak everything crisis in that virtually all-known natural resources, essential to modern civilization, are being exhausted to depletion.

We live on a planet with a rapidly-growing population and yet rapidly-diminishing resources. Humanity's current predicament is no different from that of Easter Island's human inhabitants--we overshot our resource base. Too many people concurrently exist on this planet competiting for rapidly-diminishing resources. Humanity has overshot the Earth's carrying capacity.

A receipt for disaster. I believe we will eventually become extinct, but that will entirely be our own undoing. Remember humans always go through the overshoot and die-off loop. Our population rapidly increases when there is an abundance of a particular resource I.e. fossil fuels. After the resource base is depleted, our population rapidly declines.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Tanada » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 09:37:48

Ah but if you buy into the Gaia theory by certain thought leaders our entire purpose was to free up all that geologically stored fossil carbon so that future life will get a chance to expand into the greenhouse world we are creating. Earth with major glaciations is not amicable to most life.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 10:08:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', 'A')h but if you buy into the Gaia theory by certain thought leaders our entire purpose was to free up all that geologically stored fossil carbon so that future life will get a chance to expand into the greenhouse world we are creating. Earth with major glaciations is not amicable to most life.

Yes but a runaway hothouse Earth is also not amicable to most life according to the Paleo record or at least most life currently living.
Last edited by Tanada on Thu 10 Mar 2016, 10:31:39, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: fixed broken quote
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Tanada » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 10:40:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', 'A')h but if you buy into the Gaia theory by certain thought leaders our entire purpose was to free up all that geologically stored fossil carbon so that future life will get a chance to expand into the greenhouse world we are creating. Earth with major glaciations is not amicable to most life.

Yes but a runaway hothouse Earth is also not amicable to most life according to the Paleo record or at least most life currently living.


People constantly make that claim, however the actual record shows otherwise. Mammals and Birds both of which are unequivocally warm blooded have survived on this planet for at least 150 Million years. There is a lot of evidence the Saurischia Dinosaur species were just as warm blooded as birds and mammals and they lived during the long greenhouse periods of the Earth as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saurischia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeopteryx
https://www.theguardian.com/science/201 ... and-organs
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Cog » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 10:48:35

The doomers think we are going to turn the planet into Venus. That is pure malarkey. Life will continue no matter how much we trash the planet.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 11:08:45

Yes T, it is a mixed bad and certainly creatures like insects thrive in a warmer world. I think what was probably most responsible for the Mass Extinction events was the lack of oxygen along with the Hydrogen Sulfide that was spewed out. At least that is my impression but I have not done extensive reading on all this. Maybe you, Dissident or Subjectivist can chime in more. Also, the speed of change can be a difference maker and certainly now we are I think changing things at an unprecedented rate.
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby Tanada » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 11:28:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', 'Y')es T, it is a mixed bad and certainly creatures like insects thrive in a warmer world. I think what was probably most responsible for the Mass Extinction events was the lack of oxygen along with the Hydrogen Sulfide that was spewed out. At least that is my impression but I have not done extensive reading on all this. Maybe you, Dissident or Subjectivist can chime in more. Also, the speed of change can be a difference maker and certainly now we are I think changing things at an unprecedented rate.


Without looking it up as I have other things to do right now I can tell you a couple things about the H2S extinction theory. At the time something like 80 percent of all animal life on the planet was killed including 95 percent of life in the oceans. However IIRC the earth was an almost completely water covered planet with one gigantic continent that was mostly desert. The reason most of it was desert is simple, the moisture from the sea would rain down out of the clouds as they traveled across the continent and by the time they were a thousand miles inland they were pretty dry high cirrus clouds. Thus most of the land life was concentrated along the sea shore where reliable rainfall supported abundant plant life. When the Great Anoxic Event took place and the H2S started belching out of the sea it was carried by the same prevailing winds over the same coastlines and kept dispersing up over land until it was all broken down by atmospheric oxygen. The kill levels of H2S were highest along the coast where most of the land animals were concentrated, but the high plains and desert creatures far inland survived. Yet another good reason not to live on the coast of the ocean :-D :twisted:
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Re: Doom do you want it to happen?

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 10 Mar 2016, 14:11:06

I think we should give a special mention and recognition to someone like Pstarr on this site, because he was a person who tried to make a difference and persuade others to change their ways and change course. Of course the humongous tidal wave of materialism ,ignorance and corrupt leadership it appears was never going to be stopped in hindsight. Nevertheless, I feel it my duty to salute someone like Pete in the way in olden times people saluted soldiers for defending their societies.
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