[dohboi]

Pointing out the failures of capitalism does not mean that I have to prove that every other system in the world is an enormous success. (Sorry to state what should be blindingly obvious--people seem to be reacting rather defensively, here. I had no idea so many were so enamored of a system set up to serve primarily the wealthy, i.e. those with capital.)

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dohboi', 'N')ice parody, MQ. I'm honored to have inspired it.

Yes, population is certainly a very big part of the equation--in the long term the only part.

[dohboi]

Or perhaps: Ebola: How Nature's Bats Taste??

[Fishman]

Dohboi, your lack of knowledge about ebola, epidemiology, vaccines, and capitalism is astounding. There is a vaccine for one of the hemorrhagic viruses, yellow fever, it was far more prevalent. No one, no one, does extensive research on rare virus vaccines until they become more prevalent. The cost benefit ratio would be astoundingly bad. You come with an assumption that resources can be pooed from unicorns on an unlimited supply. It WAS NOT know that ebola would eventually go widespread. There are several other similar hem. viruses with similar mortality, spread rates out there that also just sit. Just because you want a vaccine doesn't mean you get a vaccine. There are numerous deadly infectious diseases that have no vaccine because we've not been able to develop them even with a HUGE profit to be made. Lack of logic and knowledge is how an idiotic thread like this starts

[dohboi]

Thank you for that set of opinions, Fish. I am not alone in my position, so if I am completely up a tree in this, I have lots of august company up here at least.

[Cid_Yama]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')olks, capitalism is actually better, there really is no better "system" than a competitive profit-driven market system. It's the most efficient, most robust, most innovation.

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dohboi', 'E')bola has been known for decades.

Throughout that period, we knew that it could one day spread and become a major deadly pandemic.

Yet for all those years no vaccine was developed.

Why?

A prudent society/culture--a culture that considered seriously the long-term well being of the health and welfare of its people--once it knew a major threat was lurking and could pounce at any moment, would put considerable effort an resources into doing what it could for the (nearly inevitable) day when the 'pounce' happened.

But we didn't.

Why?

Clearly we are not a prudent society.

Why?

Because we are governed by corporations that by law can only act in the interest of the increased short term profits of their stockholders.

[dorlomin]

Every two days more people die of tuberculosis than have died of ebola in recorded history.
Capitalism has flaws, but it is petulant children who blame all the worlds ills on it.

[dohboi]

OS, given their very limited resources, compare the per GDP response to Ebola of Cuba with that of any capitalist country and then get back to me. Perfect, no. There is no perfect. But, given the dominance of the capitalist system today, much of the ills of the world do have to be laid at its doorstep at this point.

Dor, for the zillionth time, tuberculosis is not growing at anything like exponential rates.

I am not blaming ALL the world's ills on Capitalism. But to the victor also goes the responsibility for the conquered world.

I do like the world 'petulant,' though! '

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dohboi', 'P')ointing out the failures of capitalism does not mean that I have to prove that every other system in the world is an enormous success. (Sorry to state what should be blindingly obvious--people seem to be reacting rather defensively, here. I had no idea so many were so enamored of a system set up to serve primarily the wealthy, i.e. those with capital.)

[jupiters_release]

Capitalism is ebola.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kublikhan', 'I')n 2003, research and development expenditures were approximately $95 billion with $40 billion coming from public sources and $55 billion coming from private sources. These investments into medical research have made the United States the leader in medical innovation, measured either in terms of revenue or the number of new drugs and devices introduced. In 2006, the United States accounted for three quarters of the world's biotechnology revenues and 82% of world R&D spending in biotechnology.

[Kristen]

China has sent assistance and several vials of an experimental vaccine

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/3 ... 80396.html

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/33012186 ... ab7de.html

I agree that capitalism is a parasitic system if not perverse. However capitalism and Ebola are separate from each other.

[dohboi]

Well, it was jr that said they were the same thing, but I took that to be...metaphorical.

And I didn't say that Capitalism 'caused' Ebola. Only that it has proven rather ineffectual so far at preparing us for it or stemming it before it reached the level that it now potentially threatens modern civilization.

And that struck me as a pretty clear sign that it is unlikely to help prepare us for, prevent, or effectively stem as they develop further any of the other catastrophes that are looming or are actively crashing down around our head.

Apparently some are more concerned about preserving the reputation of this defunct and discredited system that trying to ferret out what kinds of systems may actually help.

And lore (apparently unintentionally) helps makes my point--the only elements of the US system that have done anything even marginally effective against this thing are mostly those who conservatives at least would label socialist.

[Cid_Yama]

I left out one important point. Not only do capitalists screw the people, screw the nation, and screw the planet. They are incentivized to do so.

I am one of the few who benefits from a capitalist system, but the fact that I benefit from it, doesn't change the facts regarding it.

One can only reallocate one's wealth so much. So I guess there is one other point about capitalism.

Capitalism eliminates opportunities for investment. Opportunities which would otherwise be available. What calls itself Capitalism today actually strangles a true free market, because the last thing so called 'Capitalists' want is competition.

Instead, what you have is a Plutocratic Authoritarian regime masquerading as Capitalism. Monopoly, anyone? I start with all the properties of any value. That's fair, isn't it? That seems to be what you are all saying.

[sjn]

It is really remarkable after 10 years there are those on this site who still hold the view of growth is good, and exponential growth is better. Has anybody ever argued Capitalism isn't a near ideal system for incentivising growth, and removing barriers to exploitation of all kinds?

[dohboi]

Good points, Cid and sjn.

It strikes me that the only time in history (and geography) that capitalism really could have developed is during the period of the discovery and exploitation of fossil fuels, an enormous energy bonanza that allowed the mirage/delusion of infinite gross to appear to be justified for so long.

The feedback of using ff to get more and more and more ff kept this growth spiraling upward, but now we are starting to see something about what the consequences of this insane growth has been and will be.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sjn', 'I')t is really remarkable after 10 years there are those on this site who still hold the view of growth is good, and exponential growth is better. Has anybody ever argued Capitalism isn't a near ideal system for incentivising growth, and removing barriers to exploitation of all kinds?

[dohboi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 't')he causes of our 21st-century predicaments...go far beyond "capitalism."