[Plantagenet]

Thanks Pops.

Curiously, most folks here are bashing Romney for acknowledging the reality of Peak Oil in his 2010 book--- I don't get it---IMHO he deserves some credit for it.

As the news story about this notes, No other national candidate has ever publically acknowedged peak oil---not even Al Gore.

[Pops]

LOL!

I don't think many are bashing him just trying to understand the politics. Talking about externalities like Naval costs to continue importing oil aren't the typical severe conservative tone. Heck typing the word subsidy in the same sentence as the name of a key constituency is enough to give the Rush/Rove brain-trust apoplexy.

Not to mention pollution and AGW/GHG!

Argh!

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', ' ')Talking about externalities like Naval costs to continue importing oil aren't the typical severe conservative tone.

[SeaGypsy]

It's not really about the oil Planty. It's about diplomacy.

China has been mocking the pathetic Philippine and Vietnamese Navies, sending in massive ships and declaring 'Ancestral Territorial Rights' over massive regions of the South China Sea and islands which are very clearly NOT part of it's territory. Many of these places may well have no oil or gas, or so little it's of no real significance. China is starting to bully it's way around the region.

The USA has few close allies in SE Asia. It cannot afford to let things swing the other way. 100% sure Romney will not back down and let China walk all over the Philippines or Vietnam, let alone Taiwan.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', 'I')t's not really about the oil Planty. It's about diplomacy.

[SeaGypsy]

It's still a huge IF, but oil/ gas may be a key factor. Chinese leverage in the region is the current key regardless of oil/ gas was my point; no ifs.

[AdTheNad]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', 'T')he USA has few close allies in SE Asia. It cannot afford to let things swing the other way. 100% sure Romney will not back down and let China walk all over the Philippines or Vietnam, let alone Taiwan.

[SeaGypsy]

China is playing good cop bad cop, while the USA has it's eyes on another ball. The administration is aware and starting to come to the party. Even the Chinese in SE Asia don't trust China, so the US has to stuff things up pretty badly in the region to lose the propaganda war, if that were to be the case. Netanyahu is getting pretty frustrated at the US not dancing to his tune and blasting Iran back to the stone age. The world is in a mess, basically.

It wasn't just a bit of agent orange, it was millions of tonnes of the stuff. Not to mention the horrors done in Cambodia, which barely rate a mention in the victor's history books.

[Plantagenet]

One of the clearest signs that the Chinese understand peak oil is their moves to gain control of oil through purchases of foreign oil companies, and through their land grabs in the south China Sea.

One of the clearest signs that Obama is clueless when it comes to peak oil (and creating jobs) was Obama's decision to block construction of the Keystone XL pipeline, which would've brought a million barrels of oil to the USA each day and created many thousands of high paying jobs.

One of the clearest signs the Romney understands the peak oil problem (and knows how to create jobs) is Romney's warnings about peak oil in his book, Romnay's support for building the Keystone XL pipeline, securing a million barrels of oil each day for the USA ( and generating many thousands of high paying jobs), and Romney's concern about the costs of naval and military wars to protect oil overseas.

[Pops]

Or, just an option here, Romney could be in the pocket of the Koch Bros and O could actually be concerned about the environmental risks - in the pockets of treehuggers if you prefer.

It's pretty ironic actually that you would raise the pipeline. In this case the bumper sticker excuse is a few hundred permanent jobs (obviously the actual motive is hundreds of millions, probably billions in profits) and the hold up is potential risk to the environment – the classic externality.

It doesn't surprise me that you would use the pipe as an example Plant, after all privatizing profits and socializing risk IS the party line and you're a dependable party guy. What is so surprising to me is that mitt would allow the taboo word "externality' in a champaign book.


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162- ... -at-stake/

[SeaGypsy]

One of the first effects of the pipeline would be to remove the current regional discount to WTI, would it not? The idea of the USA rushing to export some amount of oil, given it's damn obviously not going to become anywhere near self sufficient in the foreseeable future, seems inane to say the least/ regardless of the politics.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', ' ')The idea of the USA rushing to export some amount of oil...seems inane to say the least/ regardless of the politics.

[Pops]

Not to get too far OT but the XL South from Cushing (central US) has permits and construction is starting up anytime - with O's encouragement. And yeah, that will help reduce the glut in the mid-continent just like the reversal of the Seaway pipe helped earlier in the year.

The big refineries on the Gulf of Mexico have been increasing exports of product for several years (it's against the law to export crude), taking advantage of the WTI vs Everywhere else spread. That's also why our refineries on the east coast went belly-up, they had to buy crude from the world on the Brent benchmark so why even refine it here, just float product over (or around from the gulf) already cooked.


http://journalstar.com/news/local/trans ... 664fc.html

[SeaGypsy]

My expertise is in SE Asia, Oceania geopolitics, the USA specific stuff I learn as I go from peeps on here and MSM.
I appreciate both sides of this debate, I don't know enough to buy into it in any serious way.

[ralfy]

If being "strong" includes maintaining current resource consumption rates, then that won't happen.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '.').. the XL South from Cushing (central US) has permits and construction is starting up anytime - with O's encouragement.

[Pops]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')ays removed from fundraisers attended by Exxon Mobil Corp. (XOM)’s Chief Executive Officer Rex Tillerson and Continental Resources Inc. (CLR) Chairman Harold Hamm, Romney called for the aggressive development of fossil fuels to make the U.S. an “energy superpower” in a 21-page plan released yesterday.

Opening the Atlantic coast to oil and gas production and giving states control over energy development on the federal lands within their borders, would help achieve North American energy independence by 2020, create 3 million jobs, and add $1 trillion to federal, state and local government budgets, according to the plan.

[Plantagenet]

I like Romney's call for a scientific inventory of the oil potential of all US offshore areas, using modern geophysical methods, so we can do the basic science and better evaluate these areas.

Its the exact same thing Congressman Roscoe Barnett has been demanding for decades.

You can't make a plan to deal with Peak Oil if you don't even know what resource base you've got to work with.

[seenmostofit]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'I') like Romney's call for a scientific inventory of the oil potential of all US offshore areas, using modern geophysical methods, so we can do the basic science and better evaluate these areas.

Its the exact same thing Congressman Roscoe Barnett has been demanding for decades.

You can't make a plan to deal with Peak Oil if you don't even know what resource base you've got to work with.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seenmostofit', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'I') like Romney's call for a scientific inventory of the oil potential of all US offshore areas, using modern geophysical methods, so we can do the basic science and better evaluate these areas.

Its the exact same thing Congressman Roscoe Barnett has been demanding for decades.

You can't make a plan to deal with Peak Oil if you don't even know what resource base you've got to work with.