[Novus]

America is the land of the backwards when it come to things like this.

fines in Finland are based not just on the severity of the offense, but on the offender's income.

Finland Shows how it is done.

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'D')epression flattens the tax rolls, and local government hikes fines fess and penalties to continue gorging themselves and their fat paycheques and pensions. If this is true do you agree with it, or should government be cut back like everyone else.

[deMolay]

I agree outcast, DUI driving without insurance etc. Foto Radar, chickenshit fines and fees jacked up etc. the folk should turn on the local gubmint and vote their asses out and tell them why and make it known loud and proud that extortion is unacceptable.

[Rod_Cloutier]

The municipality of the city of Winnipeg, in Canada is a prime example of this trend. In 2005 amid stagnate growth and declining revenue they introduced photo inforced traffic tickets. In the name of safety (they claimed) at first they only had about five locations in school zones and other sensitive areas. But the project proved to be such a cash cow that now ( in 2009) it seems that they have at least 50 of them in the city.

At first they were even giving tickets to city bus drivers and Winnipeg police officers, essentially picking their own pockets because they have to pay their own fines. This was also a living disaster for anyone who earns a living driving or doing deliveries in the city- in no other job in existance can you get daily fines just for doing your job normally.

When people got wise to the 50 odd permanent locations that were photo enforced, they added a new trick of setting up police in photo radar traps 2 blocks AFTER the photo enforcement locations. When people got wise to this they added unmarked cars with photo enforcement equipment in them, set up in construction zones, and just about any where else you might drive. They essentially (to perpetuate a gross cash grab) installed a zero tolerance policy to all minor traffic infractions. With extreme fines for major infractions.

The local lottery (also controlled by the government) got wise to penalize the poor people who frantically buy lotto tickets to have a change to live the good life too. They doubled the cost of buying lottery tickets, so poor people now have to pay double to get the same gambling rush they are accustomed too. At the local casino, they figured people were winning too much so they reduced the payouts on all their VLT machines, the casinos are still packed even though the chances of winning a major prize have diminished by a full order of magnitude!

There used be a saying 'a fair day's wage for a fair day's work', but that idiom has been replaced by a idiom 'I don't care how we get more money, just so long as we get it'. Sad, but I don't see this trend changing anytime soon.

[Dreamtwister]

Yeah the TTC in Toronto just instituted a new fine program:

Putting feet on an empty seat - $195
Turnstile jumping - $195
Tampering with a pass or transfer - $420
Smoking on TTC property - $230
Swearing or making rude gestures - $115
Refusing to surrender your seat to an elderly person - $115

And all of the money goes directly to the city's general funds, not the TTC.

They are also tossing around the idea of issuing licenses to bicycle riders - which naturally includes enforcement and fines for failure to possess.

[dorlomin]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Dreamtwister', '
')They are also tossing around the idea of issuing licenses to bicycle riders - which naturally includes enforcement and fines for failure to possess.

[some_math_guy]

It was the same in Halifax just after the financial crisis last fall. The city implemented many new police speed checks at key points like at the bottom of hills etc in the city to start bringing in a steady income stream. I myself received two 'speeding' tickets totalling over 500$ over a 2-month period for travelling 60km/hr in a 50km/hr zone. I had never received a speeding ticket before in over 15 years of driving.

I read in the paper a few months later that this strategy made a pile of money for the municipality, but due to public outrage it was pulled back. It is also interesting to note that the police stopping zones were located only in poor areas - never high-income areas. I guess they figure one or two doctors gets stopped for 'speeding', and the city is going to f&cki*ng hear about it and their little game is up.

In any case, since I can't afford any more points off my license, I have now have developed the habit of travelling exactly 50km/hr in town, and as a result there are usually around 25 cars behind me. One time some guy was actually trying to run me off the road in order to get by me (1 lane road). So, I guess it's better that some fool kills me or himself (or some innocent pedestrian) in order to stay under the speed limit.

The reality is that truly solving crime actually doesn't pay - if you arrest some dude who is beating his wife, you have to pay for his food and lodging (and probably court costs). If you bust a drug operation, you take away the income of desperate people who just committ other (possibly violent) crimes in order to survive. The police force is a bloated waste of resources, like most public services.

[Dreamtwister]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('some_math_guy', 'T')he reality is that truly solving crime actually doesn't pay

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Dreamtwister', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('some_math_guy', 'T')he reality is that truly solving crime actually doesn't pay

[deMolay]

I am not a drug user, and even I can see that the "Drug Wars" are nothing but a get rich scam for unionized law enforcement.

[Sixstrings]

The financial elite meeting in Davos don't know what to make of what's going on with all these uprisings:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')avos delegates do not seem to know how to react to events in Egypt. The young people demonstrating on the streets of Cairo are not the kind of voices that are represented at the forum. [ha! you think?]

(snip)

Delegates have struggled to place the upheavals in the Arab world in the context of the kind of issues that Davos is used to dealing with. There is growing concern about the political impact of rising food prices. Even fashionable emerging powers with strongly growing economies, such as India, China and Brazil, are felt to be vulnerable to popular unrest driven by food-price inflation.

Rising levels of income inequality across the world have also been a recurrent theme – and many delegates have pointed to their political consequences. George Papandreou, the prime minister of Greece, argued that in Europe the middle and working-class were being squeezed while the rich continued to prosper. Mr Papandreou said he feared that populist, nationalist and racist political movements would gain ground under such circumstances.

(snip)

The future of globalisation is a central concern of Davos delegates, so there has been a lot of focus on trade. The threat of anti-Chinese protectionist legislation passing through the US Congress is thought to have receded a little, following the midterm elections. David Cameron, Britain’s prime minister, made an urgent call for completion of the Doha round of trade talks by the end of this year, arguing: “It’s frankly ridiculous that it has taken 10 years to do this deal. We simply cannot spend another 10 years going round in circles.”
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f4758388-2b04-11e0-a2f3-00144feab49a.html#axzz1CNRkXPGv

[kublikhan]

Nice timing on this thread. CNN just ran an article on this very subject today:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')ood prices have been rising worldwide, as the cost of raw materials and agricultural products surge, contributing to political unrest around the globe. In December, international food prices broke an all-time high when they rose 25% for the year, led by rising costs for staples like rice, wheat, and maize, the United Nations reported. The sharp rise in food prices, in particular, has become "a source of political instability," New York University economist Nouriel Roubini, told CNNMoney's Poppy Harlow, at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland this week.

Food inflation in China was recently at 9.6%, while in India it surged a staggering 18%. Countries that depend on imports and don't grow a lot of their own grains, like many Middle Eastern nations, are also feeling the pain from price pressures. The recent turmoil there, with outbreaks of riots and violent clashes with police and military forces, is partially related to surging food prices.

"What has happened in Tunisia, is happening right now in Egypt, but also riots in Morocco, Algeria and Pakistan, are related not only to high unemployment rates and to income and wealth inequality, but also to this very sharp rise in food and commodity prices," Roubini said.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')t's all tying together.. we're a globalised world, but peak oil and peak growth (and maybe climate change) are all incompatible with the globalist paradigm. So that's why they're stumped in Davos, because globalism and how to make money off it is what they're all about.

A few days ago Zerohedge posted an interactive map of worldwide food riots and price hikes:

[Ludi]

There's no current shortage of food (approx. 50% of food is wasted in the US) but there is great inequity in food pricing and distribution worldwide.

Social inequity leads to unstable societies.

The US is one of the most inequitable of the developed nations.

Could we see food riots in the US? Or are we so anesthetized by media that we just won't riot no matter how inequitable our society?

How will we react to Neo-feudalism?

[Lore]

There are 80 million people living in Egypt. Approximately 50% are under the age of 30 and almost 30% are uneducated and illiterate. A case of population overshoot in the midst of inflation.

We will all come to grips with a finite planet sooner then we’ve thought. This will spread.

[AdTheNad]

I think the poverty & food inflation are just the straw on the camel's back. It seems like more and more people are asking, why are we putting up with the dictator, or undemocratic rule, that is installed (normally by America) in our country.

Over here in England, the PM David Cameron is commentating: "I think what we need is reform in Egypt. We support reform and progress in the greater strengthening of their democracy and civil rights and the rule of law."
All the while he's pushing through more legislation, against the public's best interest, than it is possible to campaign against, without backing down on anything. Truly a man who would hate a democracy where the outcome can't be bought.

And this is following on from the thread a bit further down showing the democracy barometer, where Great Britain is scoring a measly 44.6 out of 100 back in 2005. I hate to think how much lower we are now. Even America was showing way higher with 74.9/100.

All major powers in the world have been taken over by the banksters and people are starting to wake up.

I wonder, if the French nobility had known they were about to face the guillotine would they have changed their ways? I doubt it, they would have just tried harder to oppress the people or fled, not realising if only they would have changed their ways everyone would have been better off.

[mos6507]

The media seems to be pointing to the internet as a catalyst, you know how Neda's death in Iran was posted all over the youtube.

This explains why Mubarak is trying to cut off cell phone and internet access to the riot areas.

This may be one positive thing that comes out of the internet, assuming these uprisings don't just lead to even worse islamic dictatorships.

[Oneaboveall]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'T')his may be one positive thing that comes out of the internet, assuming these uprisings don't just lead to even worse islamic dictatorships.

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Oneaboveall', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'T')his may be one positive thing that comes out of the internet, assuming these uprisings don't just lead to even worse islamic dictatorships.

[scas]

I wonder if the people living in the slums of these areas are well fed? And if they are, what are their family planning practices? Next up, Somalia, Rwanda, or Liberia style action.

BTW Ludi rich nations may be extremely wasteful, but they're only one-sixth of the world. Production, storage and transportation to these megacities is another task and a half.