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PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Forgive me for being irritating.

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby bodigami » Wed 14 May 2008, 18:11:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DefiledEngine', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Life can't be completely fair, but it isn't in my nature to ignore what could become murder, suffering and deprivation on a massive scale. It gives my life substance and meaning to simply care. That may seem foolish, but man doesn't live by chicken fried steak alone.


So I take it you're upset over the injustice of resource use and distribution? Then why have you bought a computer which you are now just using for non-essential entertainment?


A computer is a tool. It can be used for non-essential entertainment, but it's still a tool. Same with the Internet. And openly writting and reading about Peak Oil is NOT entertainment, it's an honest reaction to Peak Oil... although, if not accompained by action on the "real world", can become "doom 'n gloom entertainment".
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby threadbear » Wed 14 May 2008, 18:32:41

BigTex, I understand what you're saying, and agree with your point of developing a philosophy that buffers disappointment. I'm not a disappointed person, but I do understand them. I've worked with kids enough to see, how some of them can become embittered and cynical for the rest of their lives. It becomes self reinforcing, but you have to admit, they have a ton of material to work with. It's not as if they have to cherry pick to access tremendous amounts of negativity.

The rest of your post could be interpreted as being comfortably apolitical. For whose sake? Are you saying that nobody can make any approximate kind of judgement about what is right and what is wrong?
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby BigTex » Wed 14 May 2008, 18:46:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')he rest of your post could be interpreted as being comfortably apolitical. For whose sake? Are you saying that nobody can make any approximate kind of judgement about what is right and what is wrong?


We can all absolutely make judgments about what is right and what is wrong. Where we get exhausted, however, is in assuming everyone else shares our sense of right and wrong in a given case (or in any case), or in assuming that because we have judged something to be wrong that the existing power structure will lend some of its mojo to righting the wrong.

Just thinking out loud really.
:)
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby Heineken » Wed 14 May 2008, 22:47:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'J')ack, I guess being "American" is a little like being "black". It is a general consensus creation. It's not simply what you consider yourself, it's what you are considered by others.


I had a friend once who participated in a contest to answer the question, "What is an American?"

His submission was, "An American is an asshole."

No, he didn't win.
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby Heineken » Wed 14 May 2008, 22:55:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')o you have no problem with Vulture capital, working through real estate investment trusts, for example, buying up distressed American mortgage debt for pennies on the dollar?


Works for me.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'Y')ou realize, through this and other processes, the U.S loses sovereignty? Do you have any idea where this process ultimately leads?


Sure.

When I see our rulers (no, not leaders - rulers) seal the borders, end free trade, balance the budget, and end foreign aid of every sort, I'll think about it.

Until then, I'll go with the flow.

And now, a question for you - what, precisely, is an American? (By American I refer to the U.S., and membership in the society).

Let us not resort to legalisms, for example "someone who is, according to existing law, a citizen of the U.S.". No - how can I look at someone, talk with them, and conclude they are (or are not) a U.S. citizen? I suspect you will find no clear demarcation.

But if I do not know - and cannot describe - the members of my country, do I have a country? Or do I merely share a marketplace with other greedy opportunists? If the later, why should I not seek to profit, even to the detriment of the shared marketplace?

Dead serious, Threadbear.

8)


It occurs to me that, both as individuals and as people relating to one another, humans were never designed to fit into such gigantic categories. Once you get beyond small groups, it's all propaganda.

There is no "American." But, for better or worse (and I think it is worse, now), there is definitely a political entity called America.
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby Jack » Wed 14 May 2008, 23:03:41

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', 'I')t occurs to me that, both as individuals and as people relating to one another, humans were never designed to fit into such gigantic categories. Once you get beyond small groups, it's all propaganda.

There is no "American." But, for better or worse (and I think it is worse, now), there is definitely a political entity called America.


I pretty much agree. My perception is that countries - in the classical sense - consisted of populations that were homogeneous in a variety of ways. Language, for example.

Empires, in and of their very nature, were highly diverse.

I suspect the neocons were very close to the truth when the described the U.S. as an empire. But the fate of empires is different from that of countries. Countries are robust and persist. Empires rip themselves apart.

It should be exciting.
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby DefiledEngine » Thu 15 May 2008, 00:49:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')A computer is a tool. It can be used for non-essential entertainment, but it's still a tool. Same with the Internet. And openly writting and reading about Peak Oil is NOT entertainment, it's an honest reaction to Peak Oil... although, if not accompained by action on the "real world", can become "doom 'n gloom entertainment".


The point is that acquiring and using a computer wastes vast amounts of resouces compared to people in poor countries. The point is that people who know what's going on still waste resources like no other. And, really, why shouldn't they?
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Re: Forgive me for being irritating.

Unread postby MrBill » Fri 16 May 2008, 11:13:44

Who says we can help everyone?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')ive armed men burst into the small room and courtyard at dawn, just as 21-year-old, 22-week pregnant, Sunita was drying her face on a towel.

They punched and kicked her stomach as she called out for her sleeping boyfriend "Jassa", 22-year-old Jasbir Singh, witnesses said. When he woke, both were dragged into waiting cars, driven away and strangled.

Their bodies, half-stripped, were laid out on the dirt outside Sunita's father's house for all to see, a sign that the family's "honor" had been restored by her cold-blooded murder.

A week later, the village of Balla, just a couple of hours drive from India's capital New Delhi, stands united behind the act, proud, defiant almost to a man.


Source: Indian village proud after double "honor killing"

Or even that we should try?
The organized state is a wonderful invention whereby everyone can live at someone else's expense.
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