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Why Are Rich People So Anxious?

Why Are Rich People So Anxious? thumbnail
“The psychology of wealth is knotty,” writes Kerry Hannon in the New York Times. “On the surface, being wealthy can make people believe they have more control over their lives, but it can also control them emotionally.”

Hannon’s article, headlined “I’m Rich, and That Makes Me Anxious,” will probably elicit eye rolls from those of us eternally beholden to bosses and landlords and banks. We can be forgiven for failing to muster compassion. “No one gets a lot of empathy talking about these things,” admits James Grubman, a psychologist to the wealthy. But that doesn’t change the reality he sees every day: that wealth can generate immense anxiety, insecurity, and fear — even as it also provides comfort, stability, and freedom.

The observation that wealth overlaps with despair has never been entirely foreign to socialist thought. Capitalism distributes resources and power unevenly; the rich get rich in ways that bar the majority of the world’s population from accessing basic goods and exercising basic freedoms, which diminishes happiness overall.

But contentment and misery don’t map perfectly onto wealth and poverty. The multimillionaires in Hannon’s article are found to harbor intense feelings of guilt, self-doubt, and above all, anxiety that their savings will be stolen or squandered due to miscalculations or misfortunes. Are the bourgeoisie, too, held hostage by capitalism?

Socialists have considered the question from time to time, perhaps most memorably, Oscar Wilde. Wilde was a keen observer of bourgeois habits, manners, and affectations, an Irish outsider with an ironic sensibility who found the British elite both fascinating and pitiful. In “The Soul of Man Under Socialism” Wilde wrote:

The industry necessary for making money is also very demoralising. In a community like ours, where property confers immense distinction, social position, honour, respect, titles, and other pleasant things of the kind, man, being naturally ambitious, makes it his aim to accumulate this property, and goes on wearily and tediously accumulating it long after he has got far more than he wants, or can use, or enjoy, or perhaps even know of. Man will kill himself by overwork in order to secure property, and really, considering the enormous advantages that property brings, one is hardly surprised. One’s regret is that society should be constructed on such a basis that man has been forced into a groove in which he cannot freely develop what is wonderful, and fascinating, and delightful in him — in which, in fact, he misses the true pleasure and joy of living. He is also, under existing conditions, very insecure. An enormously wealthy merchant may be — often is — at every moment of his life at the mercy of things that are not under his control. If the wind blows an extra point or so, or the weather suddenly changes, or some trivial thing happens, his ship may go down, his speculations may go wrong, and he finds himself a poor man, with his social position quite gone.

This latter point is an important one. This isn’t the age of kings anymore; most wealthy people now have to hustle if they want to retain their privilege and avoid sinking into the lower classes. The bourgeoisie has created a fair amount of work for itself through its own exploitative practices, generating the very threat of exploitation that compels it to replicate and sustain those practices, seemingly in its own interest.

Capitalism forces everyone, including the ruling class, into a position of market dependence and market discipline. Here’s Ellen Meiskins Wood explaining how universal that discipline is under capitalism:

This distinct system of market-dependence means that the requirements of competition and profit-maximisation are the fundamental rules of life.… What may not always be so clear, even in socialist accounts of the market, is that the distinctive and dominant characteristic of the capitalist market is not opportunity or choice but, on the contrary, compulsion. Material life and social reproduction in capitalism are universally mediated by the market, so that all individuals must, in one way or another, enter into market-relations in order to gain access to the means of life. This unique system of market-dependence means that the dictates of the capitalist market — its imperatives of competition, accumulation, profit maximisation, and increasing labour-productivity — regulate not only all economic transactions but social relations in general.

Market dependence can compel capitalists to behave in ways they feel ambivalent or guilty about, or that can alienate them from others. Vivek Chibber offers a clear analysis of how capitalism structures the behavior of capitalists themselves:

Simply surviving the competitive battle thus forces capitalist to prioritize the qualities associated with the “entrepreneurial spirit” … Whatever his prior socialization might have been, he quickly learns that he will have to conform to the rules attached to his location or his establishment will be driven under. It is a remarkable property of the modern class structure that any significant deviation by a capitalist from the logic of market competitiveness shows up as a cost in some way — a refusal to dump toxic sludge manifests as a loss in market share to those who will; a commitment to use safer but more expensive inputs shows up as a rise in unit costs, and so on. Capitalists thus feel an enormous pressure to adjust their normative orientation — their values, goals, ethics, etc. — to the social structure in which they are embedded, not vice versa.… The moral codes that are encouraged are those that help the bottom line.

It’s always the poor who pay the steepest price for the transgressions of the rich. Yet that reality coexists with the constant compulsion to compete, dominate, and accumulate — or suffer the consequences. That such conditions could make even a materially comfortable person feel trapped, pressured, anxious, guilty, and depressed isn’t so surprising. That’s why Marx called the working class the “universal class” — the class whose liberation will lead to a universal improvement in the human condition.

Here’s Wood again, laying out the only solution that will work for everyone:

The best that socialists can do is to aim as much as possible to detach social life from market dependence. That means striving for the decommodification of as many spheres of life as possible, and their democratisation — not just their subjection to the political rule of ‘formal’ democracy, but their removal from the direct control of capital and from the ‘impersonal’ control of market-imperatives, which subordinate every human need and practice to the requirements of accumulation and profit-maximisation.

The primary aim of socialism is, of course, to benefit the masses — the billions now exploited, dispossessed, and controlled by a miniscule ruling class. But there is a psychological, if not necessarily material, upside for the wealthy, too. As Wilde put it:

“If property had simply pleasures, we could stand it; but its duties make it unbearable. In the interest of the rich we must get rid of it.”

jacobinmag



105 Comments on "Why Are Rich People So Anxious?"

  1. Makati1 on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 10:43 pm 

    “Despite being the most educated generation ever to walk the face of the
    planet, at least according to their tuition bills paid by mom and dad, a
    staggering number of millennials still can’t seem to land a steady job. Moreover, despite the steadily improving labor market, as the USA Today points out, the outlook for millennials continues to inexplicably deteriorate with 20% of 26-34 year olds currently living at home with mom versus only 17% back in 2012.”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-11-22/labor-market-conundrum-number-millennials-living-home-mom-continues-surge

    “So why does the professional development of millennials continue to diverge from other generations? While one can never be sure, perhaps the answer to that question lies in the personal experience of young Heidi Toth who decided to quit her job, after gaining just two years of experience, to join a church mission for nearly two years. Then, after returning to work from her travels, Toth quit again in 2013 after a “series of layoffs modified her duties”…which we assume roughly translates to…”a bunch of people got fired which meant I had to work harder so I quit.””

    Snowflakes….

  2. MASTERMIND on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 10:50 pm 

    Like I said Madkat they are using enhanced oil recovery to drain the last drops out of their oil wells. Its a zero sum game. And once the world economy collapses what will china need oil for anymore? There whole economy will come crashing down along with Russia’s…You are so dumb…You think that your wishes are better then my facts..They are not..And 60 percent of China’s silk road are in junk status..Its not going to work..

  3. MASTERMIND on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 10:59 pm 

    Madkat

    I know if young people are all snowflakes then that makes you are hard ass…People who are really hard don’t have to judge others…You are so pathetic…Stop taking it out on the world that you are an impotent old man. Be honest that is why your wife left you. Because you couldn’t please her anymore so you were no use..You are just an ignorant old man who believes fake news. Too dumb to use actual studies and science.

  4. Makati1 on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 11:02 pm 

    Dream on MM, Dream on. You have given ZERO facts, just bullshit. Where are your refs?

    I’m waiting…

    You want to believe in the American “indispensable” fairy, but she doesn’t exist. The rest of the world s going to continue long after the US goes down. AND, be a better place for the loss.

    “It’s possible that one day soon, Americans will wake up to a new reality. Once the petrodollar kicks the bucket and the dollar loses its status as the world’s premier reserve currency, you will have few, if any, options. …

    After the collapse of the petrodollar, the US government will be desperate enough to implement capital controls, people controls, nationalization of retirement savings, and other forms of wealth confiscation.

    I urge you to prepare for the economic and sociopolitical fallout while you still can. Expect bigger government, less freedom, shrinking prosperity… and possibly worse.”

    Tic Tic Tic…

  5. Makati1 on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 11:03 pm 

    BTW: http://www.internationalman.com//articles/the-cardinal-sin-of-international-finance

    Ref for the above statement.

  6. Makati1 on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 11:06 pm 

    Can’t take the bullshit you shovel out MM?

    You regress to the snowflake stage with every post that tries to put down your betters. LOL

    P.S. I’m still waiting for your ‘facts’.

  7. GregT on Wed, 22nd Nov 2017 11:57 pm 

    19 of the last 20 posts are from Americans. Judging from the discourse amongst y’all, things aren’t looking all that great.

    United you stand, divided you will fall.

  8. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:10 am 

    This West Coast Canadian anti-American extremist, is done with making any attempts at trying to help you Americans get along with each other.

    Knock yourselves out boys. Have fun! 🙂

  9. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:17 am 

    And Davy,

    Stop with the sock puppetry. You’re making yourself look even more stupid than you already did.

  10. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:20 am 

    Makati,

    Tyler Durden is not a reliable source of factual information. You can do better than that.

  11. Cloggie on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:22 am 

    Every day I pray French Revolution 2.0 will happen in America soon. Wouldn’t it be a grand ole’ time taking part in the celebrations of the jubilant crowds while corporate executives, bankers and politicians get sent to the guillotines and gallows?

    It’s coming.

    Millimind opines: Nationalism is the measles of mankind -Albert Einstein (Jew)

    Einstein like the rest of his tribe opts for communism… the whole world under the control of his kind. They had the USSR between 1917 and [1938-1953] (gradual decline) and that was it.

    They still have the US, between 1933 until November 2016, when they lost the presidency. Won’t be long until they lose the US as well, now that the NWO is going to fail big time. And then J-power is over. Exit Marxist century. London will be a majority Muslim town, after the Euro’s will have left post-Brexit. Write that off as well.

    Cloggie the fascist loves him alpha male strong man Putin..Why? Closet homosexual of course… And good job spamming this site with Putin’s Russian propaganda sources. Does he have your email address in his troll farm?

    I “love” Putin because he is the savior of Europe. He, together with China, blocked the world’s last commies, that is you. He humiliated you in Syria. And now the 700 million of Euro-Siberia and 1.3B of China are going to divide the Anglo loot between them, just like the USSR and USA divided the European loot between themselves in 1945.

    That’s is why I am upbeat and you are all depressed and using “peak oil” as a political correct fig-leaf to hide your real fear behind. There is collapse coming to America, but it won’t be PO or CC (that will come later). The real collapse will be social, ethnic divisions. Ethnic groups that will have to fight over ever less resources. And then there is the petro-dollar. If KSA falls, the petro-dollar falls and America is below Romania level. The remaining achieving whites will try to escape and we in Europe will of course come to their aid and help to get the US over with.

    Now why don’t you do our European bidding and start a “French Revolution”, millimind?

    And Cloggie why don’t you white nationalist cucks ever go marching into the inter cities? Oh yea because you would get your ass kicked that is why…

    Who gets his ass kicked again?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEekfL_4hYY

    German minister and US vassal chased out of town:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3HYk-7bZ-Y

    He and Merkel are toast.

    For three years now, Pegida is demonstrating weekly in large numbers. They enabled the AfD:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0MdOStRaOs

    Antifa has nothing like that.

  12. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:35 am 

    You’re wasting your time Cloggie. Davy and his sock puppet are clearly far more intelligent than you are.

    You can’t just read and study shit and stuff, and expect to know more than what’s on TV.

  13. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 12:53 am 

    “Mad Kat, China becomes more exposed to the dangers of oil import interruption by the month and you dismiss the dangers. Could it be you are in denial because of a blind agenda?”

    Davy is correct Mad Kat. China imports a lot of oil, and is running a huge deficit. Difficult to dismiss the dangers. Do you have a blind agenda Mad Kat?

  14. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:20 am 

    “Why Are Rich People So Anxious?”

    What a stupid title. Anyone with any brains in their head, knows that those who we in the west consider to be in abject poverty, will be far more affected by an economic collapse, than us rich folks in the west will be. I’m with Davy on this one.

  15. Makati1 on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:25 am 

    Greg, there is no “reliable” source of info anywhere today. All have spin and lies. But if the facts in the articles are correct/found in many sources, or at least seem to fit my observations, then the source is not important. I go to Zero because it is a collection of articles and I do not have to visit a hundred sites daily to see what is posted. Ditto for Global Research, The Burning Platform, and Rice farmer.

    As for China, what do you actually know about China other than the propaganda in the US MSM? I do not dispute that China has financial problems, but the US is in even worse shape and is a huge debtor nation with no future. China is a creditor nation with a lot of economic irons in the fire, most of which look positive for the future. What would the US look like if it had four times it’s present population? How much oil would it have to import? Perspective, Greg, perspective.

    I would bet, and am betting, China will be in better shape, after the SHTF, than the US. And that, partnered with Russia, will be the new world power when the dust settles. If we can avoid a nuclear war, that is what the future holds, in my estimation. I would not live in the US if you paid me to. It is fast devolving into hell. And no amount of lipstick can disguise that pig.

  16. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:37 am 

    Sorry Mad Kat.

    I’ve become aware of the error of my ways. I’m now a strict follower of Davy. If you can’t beat em, join em. Stay tuned for more……

  17. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:44 am 

    And Mad Kat,

    Stop with the making sense shit already.

  18. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:17 am 

    Patiently awaiting Davy’s return, so that I can apologize. I feel so bad.

  19. Makati1 on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:25 am 

    Suggested reading for Russophiles and Sinophiles:

    https://journal-neo.org/2017/11/22/the-huge-implications-of-russia-s-northern-sea-route/

    http://www.internationalman.com//articles/the-cardinal-sin-of-international-finance

    Enjoy your turkey…

  20. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:52 am 

    “You want to believe in the American “indispensable” fairy, but she doesn’t exist. The rest of the world s going to continue long after the US goes down. AND, be a better place for the loss.”
    Shut up mad kat, MM, is saying the world economy is going down together even your buddy onlooker agrees with that. You look ridiculous denying that. You are the one who is peddling the agenda of a US collapse and the rest of the world will barely notice it nonsense.

    “Once the petrodollar kicks the bucket and the dollar loses its status as the world’s premier reserve currency, you will have few, if any, options.”
    Is that the best you got mad kat? Petrodollar is insignificant anymore in relation to total global trade. Do the math old man. Petro dollar talk is mostly about anti-American agenda. It is not being talked about in the correct context. Those who talk about the petrodollar as some kind of paradigm shift are missing the point of the real paradigm change.

    “I urge you to prepare for the economic and sociopolitical fallout while you still can. Expect bigger government, less freedom, shrinking prosperity… and possibly worse.”
    MM and I are trying to tell you the same. We are prepared and understand it you don’t. If you think you found a safe place you are mistaken and we are tired of you cramming you anti-Americanism down our throat. We are all going down together.

    Tic toc tic toc

  21. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:55 am 

    “BTW: http://www.internationalman.com//articles/the-cardinal-sin-of-international-finance”
    “Ref for the above statement.”
    “P.S. I’m still waiting for your ‘facts’.”

    Mad kat, where is your words to back up the reference above. You are as bad as dutchy with throwing out a reference without showing the words that back up your assertion. Do you understand what you are talking about or just peddling agenda on the cheap?

  22. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:59 am 

    “19 of the last 20 posts are from Americans. Judging from the discourse amongst y’all, things aren’t looking all that great. United you stand, divided you will fall.”

    Things are not looking great for all of us. IMA, in a normal comment feed the amount of non-Americans generally dominates. Lots of anti-Americans like you peddling agenda and most often off topic and extreme.

  23. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:03 am 

    “This West Coast Canadian anti-American extremist, is done with making any attempts at trying to help you Americans get along with each other. Knock yourselves out boys. Have fun! ”

    What a joke. You help us out?? What you are doing is cramming hate and discontent down your throat. You have been pricking Americans for almost 5 years now and you call that help? Name calling and accusations which you hypocritically tell me I do is something you do too. I am doing it because you are in my face. You do it because you think you are better and you Canadians are not. So I say knock yourself out and I will keep whacking you in the head and listening to you whine.

  24. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:05 am 

    “And Davy, Stop with the sock puppetry. You’re making yourself look even more stupid than you already did.”

    Widdle riddle nonsense. Lame

  25. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:07 am 

    “You’re wasting your time Cloggie. Davy and his sock puppet are clearly far more intelligent than you are. You can’t just read and study shit and stuff, and expect to know more than what’s on TV.”

    Are you drinking tonight?

  26. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:10 am 

    “Suggested reading for Russophiles and Sinophiles: http://www.internationalman.com//articles/the-cardinal-sin-of-international-finance”

    You already referenced that above, mad kat???? Why don’t you say something? Do you even understand what is being talked about? OH, I know, you want me to read it and tell you what it says because you are not capable of extracting the points. It just sounds good so you are peddling cheap agenda.

  27. BATMAN on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:18 am 

    What’s my superpower, I’m RICH

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jz5B4Icit58

  28. Go Speed Racer on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:26 am 

    fuck the rich

  29. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:47 am 

    http://www.internationalman.com//articles/the-cardinal-sin-of-international-finance

    Good find Davy. I spoke with my psychiatrist, and she says that you rock. You are my new hero Davy. I don’t normally do gay sex, but she says that it would be worth it.
    Would you mind sucking my cock before I fuck you up the ass? Honey.

  30. Makati1 on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 4:02 am 

    Hahahahahahahahaha! Thanks Greg. ^_^

  31. GregT on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 4:07 am 

    And BTW Davy, only 15000 people in Dent county. Watch your back buddy. You never know who might be looking for you…

    Have a great day.

  32. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 4:11 am 

    not worth a response. Either we have a hijacking or a mental case going on.

  33. paulo1 on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 7:50 am 

    Holy smokes, what have I missed?

    A couple of things I disagree with about the statement: “We are all going down together”. True enough, we will all be in the same boat as the ‘just in time’, oppulence expected and taken for granted as normal, crowded restaurants and a cubicle way of life deteriorates. It matters not if one is in an American, European, Cdn suburb or city expecting a bus to show up and take you to work. There won’t be any work to go to for the most part, unless one has necessary skills and services required that crosses lines. I’ll provide an example.

    In the ’80s we had a big reset in the BC forest industry and I was laid off from my job flying loggers and log buyers, etc. My good friend of the time, who had no skills beyond flying, had no work and no money beyond Unemployment benefits. In my case I had carpentery certification (red seal). Even though the entire coast was reeling, I remember building a carport or two, and very complicated oceanfront retaining wall with lots of compound angles (for a rich guyy :-), and then worked the summer flying a 3 month contract in Yukon. I then returned home to build a fish hatchery and learned how to raise salmon and ended up as hatchery foreman. The point of all this is that certain skills are foundational, and transferrable to other industries. We lived wel, ate well, and never missed a mortgage payment.

    All trade skills,medical including first aid/emt, nursing, dentistry, will all be valued and paid for regardless of the economy. It might not be lucrative, but if you have skills you will be able to eat and have housing for a family. Game design, computer wonks, waitressing/baristas…. fluff jobs, not so much.

    Those that can do, will do well. Social ticks, who may now be on the top, not so much. Just an opinion, and we know what those are worth!!

    I would far rather be in farming country or near the sea in a sparsely populated area than expect to make it in Toronto or LA. Those will be very sad and scary places. One day.

    But for now, things are still ticking along for many of us. This is a day (US Thanksgiving) for American reflection and gratitude. Monday comes soon enough for all of us.

  34. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 9:43 am 

    Paulo, good comment. It is important we have you here for level headedness and balance.

  35. rockman on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:03 pm 

    Repent – “Even better would be a steady state society where everyone is middle class and there are no rich or poor people. So have you gotten many paychecks from companies not owned by the “wealthy”? And exactly how would your “steady state society” be funded without the majority of the taxes being paid by the “wealthy”?

    You are aware of the stats provided by the IRS, aren’t you? From:

    http://dailysignal.com/2017/10/18/rich-pay-fair-share-numbers/

    “The top 1 percent of income earners pay about 39 percent of federal income taxes. That means about 892,000 Americans are stuck with paying 39 percent of all federal taxes.
    The top 10 percent of income earners, those having an adjusted gross income over $138,031, pay about 70.6 percent of federal income taxes. About 1.7 million Americans, less than 1 percent of our population, pay 70.6 percent of federal income taxes.

    The bottom 50 percent of income earners pay 2.83 percent of federal income taxes. Thirty-seven million tax filers have no tax obligation at all. The Tax Policy Center estimates that 45.5 percent of households will not pay federal income tax this year.”

    Besides federal income taxes who do you think owns the companies that write the paychecks…the lower 50% of income earners? Or have you worked for that less then 1% of the population that pays 70% of the personal income tax the govt uses to run itself? And that’s just personal income taxes. Taxes on corporations make up about 18% of the revenue collected by the govt. So again, if that 1% doesn’t fund your utopian dream of a “steady state society” who will? You’re not going to get it from all workers: they already contribute 39% of the payroll taxes that fund Medicare and Social Security. At least in those programs they have the potential to get back a good bit of it…if they live long enough.

    And now we’ll hear the rebuttals from some of the 99%+ that don’t contributed any of that 70.6% of personal income tax collected by the IRS. I also suspect that few, if any of them, own companies that pay salaries to anyone. Except themselves.

    But I’m sure they’ll have strong words to share. LOL.

  36. Anonymouse1 on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 1:04 pm 

    And we have you exceptionalist, for insanity and sock puppetry.

    Balance!

  37. Davy on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 2:53 pm 

    Mouse, go fruit cake yourself. You are a millennial waste of time. Are you capable of saying anything or just the useless act of pricking Americans? Worthless!

  38. onlooker on Thu, 23rd Nov 2017 3:50 pm 

    Pity, some of the rich. They are addicted to their wealth and never satisfied as they are perpetually craving that next fix

  39. Makati1 on Fri, 24th Nov 2017 5:28 pm 

    “What if the fun and games of 2017 are over? The hidden message behind the sexual harassment freak show of recent weeks is that nothing else is sufficiently serious to occupy the nation’s attention. We’re living in the Year of Suspended Reality, stuck in the sideshow and missing the three-ring circus next door in the big tent….

    There is some kind of revolution coming to American life. One way or another, it amounts to a much lower standard of living. The journey there may take the public by surprise, a la Ernest Hemingway’s crack about how a character in one of his stories went broke: slowly, and then all at once. The main question about this journey must be whether it is accompanied by political violence. One would have to think the potential for that is pretty high, given levels of animosity and delusional thinking among the two opposing factions — can we even call them Left and Right anymore? — which may even exceed the ill-feeling of 1861.”

    http://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/the-old-songs/

    Tomorrow’s Peak Oil topic? We shall see.

  40. MASTERMIND on Fri, 24th Nov 2017 5:50 pm 

    Rockman is sharing fake news now..Dailysignal…LOL…He is as dumb as madkat…This site is full of trash…

    Good thing MM came along to clean things up.

  41. MASTERMIND on Fri, 24th Nov 2017 5:53 pm 

    Yes Rockbrain the one percent pays the majority of taxes. But the percentage amount they are taxed is lower then the middle class.. You dumbshit. The top income tax rate is around 35 percent. It was 91 percent under JFK. You uneducated hick hillbilly. Now go back to fucking your sister/wife..And I promise you I will be turning your daughters into my personal fuck toys once society collapses.

  42. MASTERMIND on Fri, 24th Nov 2017 5:57 pm 

    World’s richest are waging war on the poor, says world renowned Columbia University professor of economics

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/rich-war-poor-world-columbia-university-professor-exploit-tax-resources-money-wealth-a8067621.html

    Here is an actual trustworthy source RockBrain and an actual expert on these issues. You fake news sharing dimwit. And you know jack shit about oil and energy i will argue circles around you with evidence. Which is something you never ever site.

  43. Cloggie on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 4:55 am 

    “France to build Australia’s new submarine fleet as $50bn contract awarded”

    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2016/apr/26/france-to-build-australias-new-submarine-fleet-as-50bn-contract-awarded

    The article is over one year old but I had missed it.

    Now why would a 25m country invest in a fleet of 12 submarines?

    Submarines have one use only: “intercept” surface vessels in order to turn the latter in (very static) submarines as well. The other use: firing nuclear missiles near the enemy’s coast is probably out of Australian ambition scope.

    Now what kind of surface vessels would the Australian navy like to “intercept”?

    Perhaps Australia, on second thoughts, doesn’t like to become Chinese without a fight:

    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/america-australias-dangerous-ally-11858

  44. Makati1 on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 5:37 am 

    Cloggie, I think China already owns Australia.

    I doubt any of those subs will ever be finished. According to WIKI, as of July this year (2017), they are still in the design stage. The total project is to take 25 years. That is a joke as there is no chance in hell that they will ever be finished.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collins-class_submarine_replacement_project

    Australia is collapsing just as is the US. Twenty five years is forever today. Not going to happen.

  45. Davy on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 6:42 am 

    “Submarines have one use only: “intercept” surface vessels in order to turn the latter in (very static) submarines as well. The other use: firing nuclear missiles near the enemy’s coast is probably out of Australian ambition scope.”

    AAAh, where did you dream that up the Dutch Einstein reincarnated? There are many uses for submarines. Pleas supply your references because that is just plain false.

  46. Davy on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 6:47 am 

    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/america-australias-dangerous-ally-11858
    Dutchy, why not put some words with your reference. Why not tell people the article was by Malcolm Fraser an anti-American Australian politician. We know how much respect politicians have or most of us do.

  47. Davy on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 6:55 am 

    “Cloggie, I think China already owns Australia.”
    Got any references mad kat? I think Australia has China by the nuts. China needs Australian resources. IMA, China has no ability to invade and take Australia and likely never will. It cannot project military power over the sea. Like you say “The total project is to take 25 years.” China will take years to build a force that can land and conquer a large nation. I am not even sure it will ever have the capabilities.

    “Australia is collapsing just as is the US. Twenty five years is forever today. Not going to happen.”
    Yea, China is going to take the US and Australian down is the issue, mad kat. Have you been watching what is going on in China? I mean you like to claim you have your hand on the heartbeat of Asia. LOL. If so you would see China is coming apart financially and economically.

  48. Davy on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 7:07 am 

    Hey, mad kat, this is how China is going to take Australia down. Dutchy, maybe Malcom Fraser should talk about this more. IMA, the same is happening in Canada.

    “The Party’s Over For Australia’s $5.6 Trillion Housing Frenzy”
    https://tinyurl.com/y7fajvky

    “As a whole, the Australian economy has grown through a property bubble inflating on top of a mining bubble, built on top of a commodities bubble, driven by a China bubble.”

    “The party is finally winding down for Australia’s housing market. How severe the hangover is will determine the economy’s fate for years to come. After five years of surging prices, the market value of the nation’s homes has ballooned to A$7.3 trillion ($5.6 trillion) — or more than four times gross domestic product. Not even the U.S. and U.K. markets achieved such heights at their peaks a decade ago before prices spiraled lower and dragged their economies with them.”

  49. Cloggie on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 9:14 am 

    “Australia Fears Asia Power Shift to China If U.S. Withdraws”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-22/australian-policy-paper-warns-of-china-s-rise-in-asia-afr-says

    Dutchy, why not put some words with your reference. Why not tell people the article was by Malcolm Fraser an anti-American Australian politician. We know how much respect politicians have or most of us do.

    Normal people know that the name of the author is usually written at the top of an article.

    Fraser is not “anti-American”, whatever that may mean, he is a senior Australian politician, whose first obligation is to think about the future of Australia. His line of reasoning is that if the US would lose a confrontation in the South China Sea against China, it could very well mean the end of Australian independence, for no other reason than the US-Australian alliance, giving the Chinese the pretext of invading Australia… and never leave and solve its overpopulation problem in one stroke. If historically Australia was a Dutch, British and American colony respectively, why can’t China be the next colonizer?

    Australia has hardly an army worth mentioning and would be no match for the Red Army. And nobody is going to defend Australia once the US empire goes belly up, as it will in the next decade.

    Fraser is just being rational in advising Australia to distance itself from America in the hope China will leave Australia alone. But in general, Australia has very weak cards, with or without the US.

    25m people in a country not much smaller than China.

  50. Davy on Sat, 25th Nov 2017 10:15 am 

    Dutchy, explain China’s invasion capabilities for me. Explain how they are going to conquer a continental sized nation. Explain that please. Maybe review what it took for the US to sweep Iraq. Do you remember the logistics involved with that? This effort was with a nation that could project power across oceans. IMA, the Us swept Iraq but could not maintain a functioning state with stability.

    At the moment China can do little. You and Malcom are living in a fantasy world and both are peddling an agenda with a personal motive. Your motive dutchy is a Euro Empire. This is why you can overlook reality and broadcast a fantasy of a future that is not here and likely never will be.

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