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Page added on December 11, 2017
Trump’s Interior secretary: Shameless tool of oil and gas industries
Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke loves to portray himself as a humble, outdoorsy man of the people, a loving steward of the purple mountain majesties and fruited plains so dear to the American people. In defending the Trump administration’s recent choice to drastically shrink the Bears Ears and Grand Staircase-Escalante national monuments in Utah, Zinke claimed, “We listen to the voices of the people, not Washington, D.C., special interests.”
In reality, the opposite is true. The way Zinke runs the Interior Department makes it clear that the only voices he deems worth hearing are those of oil and gas special interests — not the public that uses federal lands, not scientists, not environmentalists and not even his fellow Republicans who view their own homes as having some value beyond that of a giant oil field.
When it comes to the national monument decision, Zinke’s half-hearted efforts to engage with the public didn’t appear to fool anyone. He spent four days with anti-monument people and only gave two hours to pro-monument and Native American representatives. Over a 60-day comment period, the Interior Department received 2.4 million comments, nearly all of which supported keeping the monuments as they are. Zinke shrugged all that off and instead did what oil and gas lobbyists would prefer him to do.
And on Sunday, The Washington Post published an expose showing that a uranium mining company extensively lobbied Zinke to scale back Bears Ears — and got exactly what they asked for.
This attitude towards the public extends well beyond the national monument debate. In an October report with the snooze-inducing title “Review of the Department of the Interior Actions that Potentially Burden Domestic Energy,” ordinary citizens are portrayed as little more than a nuisance to be suppressed so the Bureau of Land Management (BLM), the federal office within the Interior Department that controls most federal lands, can more easily move oil and gas drilling leases forward.
“Current BLM regulations allow any party to file a protest on a BLM decision,” the document explains, before noting that these protests have risen in recent years due to concerns about the dangers of climate change or hydraulic fracturing, aka fracking. The document goes on to recommend limiting the ability of citizens to file such protests, which may impose “a burden on oil and natural gas development on public lands.”
But perhaps the most telling example of 2017, besides the national monument debacle, is the way Zinke is handling the Greater Sage Grouse Conservation Plan, which was finalized under the Obama administration in 2015. Since the Trump administration’s only clear policy goal is to systematically destroy everything accomplished by his predecessor, it is now being torn up by Zinke’s Interior Department.
Here’s some background: U.S. Fish and Wildlife Services had been considering putting the sage grouse on the Endangered Species List, but such a designation was highly controversial. Sage grouse are spread out over a large area — 11 Western states — and an endangered species listing would have severely constrained development on dozens of millions of acres of land.
“As a result, a broad and unlikely coalition of biologists, ranchers, environmental groups, extractive industries, federal agencies and state and local governments worked feverishly to create a management plan for the bird that would preempt a listing,” NPR explained. Obama’s Interior Department called the initiative “unprecedented.”
By creating an elaborate plan to protect the sage grouse, Interior was able to keep the bird off the Endangered Species List. It was a compromise, however, and as with any compromise, many parties were dissatisfied. Environmentalists thought it didn’t go far enough to protect the bird and its habitat. Oil and gas interests are, of course, angry at pretty much any constraints on where and how they drill. So Zinke decided that the plan needed revision to take “local economic growth and job creation” more into consideration, even though the whole point of spending years developing the plan in the first place was to balance economic interests with conservation interests.
Zinke claims he wants to involve interests other than oil and gas lobbyists in the process, but, as Nada Culver, the director of the Wilderness Society‘s BLM Action Center, told Salon, environmentalists and other stakeholders fear they are “being set up to be duped.”
“Here we are at the table, providing written comment, attending public meetings, trying to be heard,” Culver said, while at the same time suspecting that Zinke will “make changes to the plans without going through a whole process, without doing environmental analysis, without providing opportunities for review and input.”
It took years for Obama’s Interior Department to develop the sage grouse plan, but Zinke’s Interior Department only provided an abbreviated 45-day public comment period for their proposal, to unravel it. There have technically been public meetings, clearly conducted in a manner designed to minimize the possibility of public input. Scott Sonner of the Associated Press reported a scene of frustration at one such meeting, which was mostly a retread of the same debate over how to manage these birds and their habitat that most people involved believed had been resolved two years earlier.
It’s not just environmentalists who are frustrated, either. Some conservative interests, who had been eager to keep the sage grouse off the Endangered Species List, are worried as well. As Courtney Flatt of KUOW in Oregon reported, some ranchers and miners in the area worry that efforts to roll back the plan could backfire, doing so much damage to the bird’s habitat that Fish and Wildlife will be forced to list it as an endangered species, which would trigger the severe land use restrictions they were trying to avoid in the first place.
Western governors, some of them Republicans, are also feeling shut out and have been highly critical of Zinke’s efforts to drastically revise a plan their states had spent years working with federal officials to create.
“We can’t have wholesale changes in wildlife management every four or eight years,” Wyoming Gov. Matt Mead, a Republican, said in October. “I don’t think that is the best way to sustain populations or provide the necessary predictability to industry and business in our states.”
Zinke’s handling of the Interior Department poses a particular danger to the future of American public lands and wildlife. But on a larger scale, it’s also a microcosm of how the Trump administration does business: In a slipshod manner, with the aim of undoing the Obama administration’s progress while placating wealthy benefactors and corporate interests, and with absolutely no concern about the long-term consequences.
52 Comments on "Trump’s Interior secretary: Shameless tool of oil and gas industries"
DerHundistlos on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 4:08 pm
At the Global Climate Conference in Bonn last month. President Dump and the Republican controlled congress thought it was a swell idea to send representatives to “sell” the virtues of US coal. Needless to say, the US table was devoid of visitors.
Alternatively Democratic Governor Jerry Brown of California and ex-Republican and former Mayor of New York, Michael Bloomberg attended as well. A number of joint venture agreements with other nations were discussed.
While Republicans enjoy belittling California and New York, these two states alone represent a staggering 40% of the entire US economy.
Source: “60 Minutes” original broadcast date 12-10-2017
Apneaman on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 7:13 pm
Can Humans Survive?
““The Plutocene: Blueprints for a Post-Anthropocene Greenhouse Earth” – the latest from prominent Australian scientist Andrew Glikson. An hour of carefully documented doom and discussion, from nuclear folly to climate disaster. Nuclear weapons and climate change both threaten our existence, but with different time scales and probability. In his work on geology and paleoclimatology, with a specialty in the causes of past mass extinctions Dr. Glikson explains his bleak prognosis in this full program in-depth interview.”
https://www.ecoshock.org/2017/12/can-humans-survive.html
Don’t look like the humans will make it, but that’s academic. Collapse will come first. Collapse is a process – death by a million cuts. No one knows when it will go but to argue that decline is not well under way is to argue against reality.
Shortend on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 7:17 pm
BAU at ANY means possible…the so called parks, reserve, wilderness protected areas…it’s all BS
Apneaman on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 9:58 pm
Shortend, I’ve long predicted that there would be environmental regulation roll backs and/or unofficially ignoring them as the Cancer gets closer to the end of it’s onetime feast. Brazil has recently had major roll back and tons of ignoring/non enforcement.
The desperation & denial walk hand in hand. Actually, they are sprinting.
Trump and his Cancer crew have greatly exceed all my expectations. They don’t mess around. It’s soooo bloody obvious that trump is handing over what’s left to his co criminal buddies. It’s a fucking clown show and exactly what one would expect in the late/last stage.
Trump administration facing lawsuit for allowing fracking companies to dump waste in Gulf of Mexico
It comes just months after the Environmental Protection Agency finalised a Clean Water Act allowing oil companies to offload unlimited amounts of waste into ocean basin
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/trump-administration-epa-sued-fracking-companies-dump-waste-gulf-mexico-centre-for-biological-a8101096.html
Apneaman on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 10:02 pm
Mass starvation is humanity’s fate if we keep flogging the land to death
” The UN’s famous projection that, at current rates of soil loss, the world has 60 years of harvests left, appears to be supported by a new set of figures. Partly as a result of soil degradation, yields are already declining on 20% of the world’s croplands.
Now consider water loss. In places such as the North China Plain, the central United States, California and north-western India – among the world’s critical growing regions – levels of the groundwater used to irrigate crops are already reaching crisis point. Water in the Upper Ganges aquifer, for example, is being withdrawn at 50 times its recharge rate. But, to keep pace with food demand, farmers in south Asia expect to use between 80 and 200% more water by the year 2050. Where will it come from?”
plenty more
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/dec/11/mass-starvation-humanity-flogging-land-death-earth-food“
Cloggie on Mon, 11th Dec 2017 10:19 pm
Hahaha Salon. I used to have a subscription on that commie rag in the nineties, with my Compuserve account, 2400 baud rate shreeking modem, at a time I read Camilla Paglia, found Bill Clinton a swell guy and, I kid you not, watched Oprah and Lou Dobbs, because CNN came with the cable subscription.
I was very curious towards everything related to America. Thanks to the internet, 9/11 and the unfolding immigration disaster in the Netherlands I turned from a leftist-liberal into revisionist altrightish between 1995-2005. Became a poster addict on Dutch Pim Fortuyn anti-mmigration forums and posted thousands of posts, which prompted a lot of reading, mostly on history. In 2007 renewed interest for the old love renewable energy emerged thanks to Heinberg.
Joined peakoil.nl in 2010 led by Rembrandt Koppelaar, but they closed down in 2012 so I came here in january 2012 and in parallel began my own blog.
By november 2012 I knew that ASPO2000-Heinberg and oldschool peakoil were bunk and now in 2017 I am pretty confident that at least in Europe we are going to have a smooth and rapid transition into renewable energy, to be completed between 2030-2050.
The ridiculous amount of despair on this forum I understand as a general North-American despair with the immanent end of the American Era.
Sorry for this note to self.
DerHundistlos on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 2:10 am
Further to Ape’s posting on the worldwide soil erosion emergency, I quote from “Ibon’s” post:
In 1820, Illinois had 22 million acres of prairie land and 14 million acres of forests. Prairies were mainly in the northern two-thirds of the state with forests in the southern one-third. All but nine counties had large areas of prairies. In central Illinois, trees could only be found in scattered sites called “prairie groves” or along waterways.
By 1900, most of Illinois ‘ prairies were gone. The majority of these lands were converted to agricultural practices. By 1978, less than 2,300 acres of high quality prairie remained in the entire state. Most of the undisturbed prairie sites today are found along railroad rights-of-way, in pioneer cemeteries and in places that are not suitable for farming.
That is 2,300 acres remaining of an original 22 million acres.
Source- https://www.dnr.illinois.gov/education/ … iries.aspx
The Tallgrass prairie soils in the midwest were perhaps the world’s most fertile soils with humus layers reaching 8 meters depth. With adequate rainfall in the midwest the economic incentives to convert Iowa, Indiana and Illinois to one vast soy and corn monoculture was too great. If you drive from southern Indiana through Illinois and into Iowa you will see one vast uninterrupted monoculture of corn and soy. The only remaining significant tallgrass prairie is along old railroad right of way and a few abandoned military munition sites that were converted over the nature reserves. Here is a great example of a refuge tall grass prairie.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/main/midewin/home
Remember the importance of maintaining refuge habitat. These are the places out of which one day when Kudzu Ape recedes that nature will reclaim and recolonize former habitat.
I was very active in preserving a very small tract of tallgrass prairie in the west suburbs of Chicago when I in my late teens. Here is a link of some pictures of this wonderful refuge prairie, Wolf Road Prairie… These are my photographs.
https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipO … TKVtMaang4
So let’s take this as a case study of what I was discussing in my previous post. Those 8 meter deep prairie soils are still fertile but the humus topsoil level has eroded by more than 2/3rds. Subsidized agro industry has sucked nutrients year after year, corn for ethanol, bit export markets. This misuse as you see with tall grass prairies in the US was repeated all over the world again and again and again.”
deadlykillerbeaz on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 6:44 am
Everybody is a shameless tool for the oil and gas industry, if you need to eat, you will be burning gas to get to work. If you want to eat, you will be buying gas for your means of transportation, regardless if it is public or private transport. Everybody from the day they are born uses oil.
Don’t have to eat, I suppose, but that takes will power. You are a slave to yourself.
Nobody cares about peak oil and nobody cares about climate change. Just the way it is. Ain’t gonna be any other way.
All of the greenwashing changes nothing, fossil fuels will be burned until the cows come home.
What there is is peak stomach change. The change from a full stomach to an empty stomach will peak. E needs recharging, F is fine. Roast turkey with stuffing beats bread and water.
Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to alleviate the empty stomach. There is no escape,there is no room for an empty stomach.
Hence, a civilization, at its peak.
Have a good day.
Duncan Idaho on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 1:10 pm
“While Republicans enjoy belittling California and New York, these two states alone represent a staggering 40% of the entire US economy.”
Aside from nasty corps in Washington State, a few good corps in the North East, and a lot of corn and soy in the midwest, it would be third word time without CA in the rest of the US.
CA carries most of the US (disclaimer: I don’t live there).
But living in a third world theocracy has its benefits, I guess.
Davy on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 1:50 pm
Idaho, got any references? I think you are peddling your usual agenda. Disclaimer: who cares what you think you are clearly bias and without good basis.
Hello on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 2:00 pm
>>>> these two states alone represent a staggering 40%
One quick glance at
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_GDP
shows that CA + NY is approx 20% of the US. And they are about 20% of the population if the US, too. So nothing special.
Actually a bit pathetic. I expected more from those highly industrialized, automated high tech states. But they are not any better than farm states.
I guess brown people making sandwiches in NYC and LA doen’t add that much to GDP as liberals would like you to believe.
Cloggie on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 2:21 pm
“shows that CA + NY is approx 20% of the US. And they are about 20% of the population if the US, too. So nothing special.”
Haha, very good effective fact checking.
In the “old days” big cities did indeed represent more than proportional wealth generation. In the stinking West, that is no longer the case. We all know why. The sooner this imperialist f* falls apart, the better it is, so we can start all over again.
fmr-paultard on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 3:30 pm
eurotard please stop hating usa. SENTAPBs idealogy is dominant over people. Is that why you have no moral foundation to fight Islam?
MASTERMIND on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 3:38 pm
Cloggie
There is no starting all over again you buffoon. You are as dumb as they come….
Cloggie on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 3:49 pm
“There is no starting all over again ”
Of course there is, millimind. The Eastern Europeans gave the good example. Davy says for years that US is going to collapse, Kunstler has repeatedly warned for a civil war.
I know enough.
Davy on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 4:06 pm
Sure dutchy, we know you are a Davy expert. Davy also says your dumb.
GregT on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 5:01 pm
I’ll bet that Cloggie isn’t dumb enough to say ‘your dumb’, and English isn’t even his native language.
Sissyfuss on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 5:09 pm
Now that the uber money men are running the show there will be no environmental protection, no enforced labor laws, no middle-class values promotion of any kind. The only difference between the US oligarchy and the Russian one is our oligarchs have to pretend there is a choice in elections whereas the Russians just eliminate any competition. When the original environmentalists tried to protect the land they were slaughtered and the survivors placed in denuded prison arenas. The true protector of the Earth will be Gaia and her natural laws. And when she comes for us we will then be able to easily relate to the experience of those original environmentalists.
MASTERMIND on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 5:14 pm
You have to stand in awe of the fake news brainwashing to convince the majority of the public the economy is doing great. This is why they are constantly hyping up the stock market to mislead the public the economy is in good shape.. And according to the Federal Reserve and CBO office they project another decade of 2% growth with no ending in sight.
MASTERMIND on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 5:20 pm
CLoggie
After Society collapses goons will turn your woman into their personal fuck toys….You fascist scum bags are just poor and desperate losers. You will get socked in the grill just like your boy Richard Spencer did…LOL
Makati1 on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 6:36 pm
MM in one comment you actually sound intelligent and then in the next you destroy that image with your immaturity. Are you intelligent enough to know which is which?
DerHundistlos on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 7:16 pm
Hello conveniently fails to mention that solidly Red whitey states are by far the most dependent on federal welfare spending. According to the graph below, of the 25 most dependent states solidly Blue states represent just 5 while 17 of the most federally dependent “welfare queen” states are Red and 3 states classified as toss-up in neither.
So much for your theory it’s the fault of Brown people.
https://taxfoundation.org/which-states-rely-most-federal-aid-0
Sissyfuss on Tue, 12th Dec 2017 9:32 pm
They just called the election for Jones. All is not lost Derhund.
DerHundistlos on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 4:37 am
Thank you to the people of Alabama for reintroducing sanity!!!!
Davy on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 5:39 am
sanity!!!!
define sanity? surely you don’t mean the democrats are sane??
If you do then you have not been watching what is going on in DC on both sides.
Sissyfuss on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 6:54 am
Davy, at least the Dems present a modicum of environmental awareness whereas the Repulsecans and Trump are pursuing a scorched Earth policy that is truly despicable.
Davy on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 7:08 am
Siss, yea but not much. Most Democratic environmentalist are fake green living a lie. Yet, environmentally nothing is worse than a science denying Republican conservative. At least fake green democrates realize the environment is being destroyed. The problem with fake green Democrates is they are unwilling to sacrifice their affluent lifestyles and they practice science denial with the solutions.
Cloggie on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 10:09 am
They just called the election for Jones. All is not lost Derhund.
Recount next?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/possible-recount-in-alabama-what-happens-now/ar-BBGFJMz
Rep Cucks celebrate their own (possible?) defeat:
https://www.infowars.com/establishment-republicans-cheer-roy-moores-loss-in-alabama/
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 11:37 am
Derhund,
Sanity is not supporting immigration and population explosion like the Dems do.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 11:59 am
“Sanity is not supporting immigration and population explosion like the Dems do.”
Would anyone care to take a stab at translating the above into english?
Apneaman on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 1:15 pm
Poor clog, his American counterpart (creepy groping old man) Roy Moore got a boo boo.
More meaningless monkey politics.
Overshoot consequences will take down civilization, then things will get bad. It cannot be avoided.
If I was a weak, old, alone, effeminate eurotard white man like clog, I’d be terrified too – they’re (MENA) coming and looking for payback for centuries of eurotard colonialism. Now that’s really some dead people’s baggage eh?
The Global Crisis That’s Creating 21.5 Million Refugees Each Year
How environmental destruction created a refugee crisis.
https://www.alternet.org/environment/global-crisis-thats-creating-215-million-refugees-each-year
Cloggie on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 2:05 pm
“If I was a weak, old, alone, effeminate eurotard white man like clog, I’d be terrified too – they’re (MENA) coming and looking for payback for centuries of eurotard colonialism.”
If I were a depressed kiketard like you, I would worry more about mobilized raging North-Americans seeking revenge for their country being f*-up by your types:
http://www.kevinmacdonald.net/immigration.pdf
https://www.biblebelievers.org.au/expelled.htm
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 2:40 pm
Clog,
All y’all are to friggen lazy to go looking for anyone. Lol Mad Max takes effort. Like mak farming and prepping from his computer. I wouldn’t count on any yield.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 2:43 pm
“All y’all”
WTF……..over??????
DerHundistlos on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 3:19 pm
@ Siss and GregT
Well done as usual.
“They (Democrats) practice science denial with the solutions.”
“Sanity is not supporting immigration and population explosion like the Dems do.”
These are the nonsensical words of radical Republicans desperately mudslinging about for a narrative to vilify the opposition. The Republican party is bankrupt of morals and principles thus the only remaining strategy is to try and define the opposition party as being just as godawful. I had to laugh. Is this the best they can do? No wonder Dems are sweeping elections.
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 4:44 pm
DerHund,
So subsidising immigrants and spreading more humans around the world to pollute, depleat resources and fire up more Co2 is the reason Dems are sweeping elections? Lol You heard it hear first folks.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 4:59 pm
Boat,
“You heard it hear first folks.”
I believe what you were trying to say is “You heard it here first folks.” and if it was, you would be correct.
You would be the first person here to accuse one of the two political parties, of a country that makes up just slightly more than 4% of the world’s population, of “spreading more humans around the world to pollute, depleat resources and fire up more Co2”.
It really does not get any more brain dead.
Makati1 on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 5:42 pm
Boat is a sample of the US’ failed education system.
“Famous science fiction writer Isaac Asimov once said: “There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.””
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wired-success/201407/anti-intellectualism-and-the-dumbing-down-america
“Journalist Charles Pierce, author of Idiot America (link is external), adds another perspective: “The rise of idiot America today represents–for profit mainly, but also and more cynically, for political advantage in the pursuit of power–the breakdown of a consensus that the pursuit of knowledge is a good. It also represents the ascendancy of the notion that the people whom we should trust the least are the people who best know what they are talking about. In the new media age, everybody is an expert.””
Makati1 on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 6:10 pm
“The Dumbing Down of America – By Design” *
“With the US the biggest debtor nation on earth, Americans are drowning in debt as hopelessly trapped collateral damage from a rapidly sinking, overextended Empire desperate to remain the sole global superpower even if it means death to the whole human race. At home the hapless American population has become increasingly the victim of its own government’s tyranny and oppression under the constant roving eyeball of criminal surveillance and a brutal militarized security state, leaving its citizens defenseless without any security, liberty, freedom or place to hide. After centuries of carefully orchestrated design, oligarchs of the banking cabal have finally gotten what they’ve been plotting and scheming, globally enforced austerity and impoverishment reducing life in America and around the world to near Third World status, and absolute control. The oligarchs are counting on a dumbed down population too busy addicted to their video games or watching sports or Kim Kardashian’s latest wardrobe malfunction to even notice that a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway.”
https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-dumbing-down-of-america-by-design/5395928
*Joachim Hagopian is a West Point graduate and former US Army officer. … After the military, Joachim earned a masters degree in Clinical Psychology and worked as a licensed therapist in the mental health field for more than a quarter century. He now concentrates on his writing.
Apneaman on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 7:09 pm
Yabut, Mak. You’re not allowed to use
globalresearch.ca cauze Davy said its bad N stuff.
Actually, one super liberal progressive guy at Rationalwiki said its bad N stuff and Davy showed us that he wrote that.
What more evidence could anyone possible ask for? Golly.
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 7:54 pm
Mak,
Oligarchs love immigration. You missed the point immigration is bad news for a finite planet. Because of my immigration position my school system failed me? Lol
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:01 pm
Mak,
I am net debt free. I guess I failed system norms yet again. As long as one can borrow 3% and under and make over 3% in the market I would be stupid to not invest.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:05 pm
“You missed the point immigration is bad news for a finite planet. Because of my immigration position my school system failed me?”
The last time I checked, there aren’t immigrants coming here from any other planets, and I doubt very much that your ‘immigration position’ has anything to do with your school system failing you.
There are some things that education simply cannot fix.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:11 pm
“As long as one can borrow 3% and under and make over 3% in the market I would be stupid to not invest.”
Plenty of people did exactly that back in ’08 Boat. Over 10 million US families lost their homes due to foreclosure.
Gambling with money that you owe to somebody else, is not an intelligent plan, especially not in the current environment.
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:37 pm
If you can’t wait at least 10 years for the money invested in the market you have no business being in the market. Lesson #1 in investing. I think bypassing your intelligent plans is good business.
Boat on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:43 pm
You keep an eye on those aliens. I’ll track the effects of immigration. Our schools prepared us for these roles. Hey, I checked up on those Jews, if you don’t believe in Shia law you have nothing to fear.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 8:56 pm
“I think bypassing your intelligent plans is good business.”
For the most part Boat, you don’t think. At least not in a rational manner.
“If you can’t wait at least 10 years for the money invested in the market you have no business being in the market.”
That’s the advice I gave to people 25 years ago. Things have changed a little bit since then. And for somebody like yourself, at 60 years of age, that was never a good plan.
GregT on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 9:21 pm
“You keep an eye on those aliens. I’ll track the effects of immigration. Our schools prepared us for these roles. Hey, I checked up on those Jews, if you don’t believe in Shia law you have nothing to fear.”
Do you understand what it means to have self respect Kevin?
Makati1 on Wed, 13th Dec 2017 10:00 pm
Boat:
!. Where did I mention immigration?
2. NET debt free is NOT debt free. Ask the NET debt free the hour before the 1929 Market crash. Millions were suddenly losing everything that they owned NET free just minutes before. Debt of any kind is not intelligent or necessary.
3. The ‘market’ will not be here in 10 years. Maybe not even in one. Keep playing the odds and you will lose.
Davy on Thu, 14th Dec 2017 3:13 am
“2. NET debt free is NOT debt free. Ask the NET debt free the hour before the 1929 Market crash. Millions were suddenly losing everything that they owned NET free just minutes before. Debt of any kind is not intelligent or necessary.”
Mad kat, you are indebted to your social security check that could stop tomorrow. You are indebted to your ability to function without assistance that could end tomorrow. Having a positive net worth and an income is successful. If one can live within their means then there is no problem until there is a problem for everyone. It appears you are not very successful because you have no net worth just a welfare check every month. Your Philippines that is in extreme overpopulation will be in a world of hurt once a financial crisis comes. Your country will not be able to afford all those things needed to support such a large population. You are screwed too mad kat.